The Official MMA Discussion Thread

[LoNdOn]

Wooo. London's great for me - within distance. Machester/Brumland are a pain to get to. It'll be good to see these guys in action, and do these new Wolfslair guys have names?

 

The tickets cost about an arm and a bollock though. I live in London basically and will be hard pressed to attend the event.

[Guest Poppers]

Are we aloud to talk about matches tonight or are spoilers not aloud?

[brashleyholland]

Well the fights are airing live in the US, UK and Oz, so I don't see why not. Best not to spoil the prelims though, in case they are aired during the PPV.

[Daffanka]

Well if you were watching It's Showtime you got to see another Badr Hari DQ soccerkick. What a jerk.

 

e: If you haven't already and you have any interest in kickboxing you really should watch it. High level kickboxing is the most enjoyable thing in combat sports.

[Guest Poppers]

Well if you were watching It's Showtime you got to see another Badr Hari DQ soccerkick. What a jerk.

 

e: If you haven't already and you have any interest in kickboxing you really should watch it. High level kickboxing is the most enjoyable thing in combat sports.

 

I would really love to watch some K-1 but I have absolutely no clue where to.

[brashleyholland]

I would really love to watch some K-1 but I have absolutely no clue where to.

 

HD Net in the state and Canada...nowhere officially shows it in the UK anymore, unless Eurosport still have it on Fight Club.

 

Otherwise...it's all out there online. I'm ashamed to say that I pay for a site that streams near HD quality MMA and Kickboxing events...erm...less than legally. Unfortunately, if I don't then I can't do my job as there is no legal way for me to watch Dream/Sengoku etc in the UK.

 

I do pay for my ESPN HD subscription for the UFC though, and have spent the GDP of a small county attending every live MMA event I can make it too over the years, so I don't feel too bad about it :-p

[Daffanka]

I would really love to watch some K-1 but I have absolutely no clue where to.

 

It's not K-1 this time, it's from It's Showtime which is a Dutch company I believe managed by the premier kickboxing gym Golden Glory.

 

This guy has some of the fights and is hopefully uploading more. Make sure to watch Saki - Manhoef because it ruled.

[brashleyholland]

Well if you were watching It's Showtime you got to see another Badr Hari DQ soccerkick. What a jerk.

 

 

Manhoef got spanked. Again. Hari has lost it man, totally off the rails. Ruts and K-1 let him get away with it every time though, so he doesn't learn.

[Daffanka]

It was a competitive fight and Saki is a really good fighter though, Manhoef's far from done.

 

Also while we wait for Dan Lauzon to gas I'll clarify my position on loving high level kickboxing.

 

There's no other combat sport where you see so many extremely high level competitive fights. In MMA there's often obvious technique deficiencies, a big gap in level of the competitors or both. Even the highest level fights are often visibly dominated by one fighter.

 

I absolutely love a high level, highly competitive MMA fight. Machida - Shogun 1, Barnett - Nog 1, Shogun - Lil' Nog. But they happen so rarely when compared to kickboxing.

 

e: wow the crowd is going to be terrible for this event

[Guest Poppers]

It's not K-1 this time, it's from It's Showtime which is a Dutch company I believe managed by the premier kickboxing gym Golden Glory.

 

This guy has some of the fights and is hopefully uploading more. Make sure to watch Saki - Manhoef because it ruled.

 

I didn't say it was. But from my understanding you were talking about kickboxing in general

[Daffanka]

Well this has been a night of upsets. Let's see if Miller and Rashad can round it out.

 

e: Well look at that.

[BHK1978]

The Little Nog fight was complete and utter crap, granted I do not know a lot about MMA but I do have enough knowledge to know when a guy was obviously losing. MMA judges are just as bad as the NBA refs!

[GatorBait19]

I truely thought Evans was knocked out in the 3rd. He wasn't defending himself will Jackson laid in his shots and Dean didn't stop the fight. I have always hated how sometimes refs will let a fight go on, but stop others quick.

 

Tonight to me didn't prove anything, Evans didn't want to stand up with Jackson. Jackson wasn't as quick as he's been in the past (mainly because of his rust/cut down of weight). I think the rematch (if we get one, which I believe we will) will be much better.

[Dustin]

I truely thought Evans was knocked out in the 3rd. He wasn't defending himself will Jackson laid in his shots and Dean didn't stop the fight. I have always hated how sometimes refs will let a fight go on, but stop others quick.

 

Tonight to me didn't prove anything, Evans didn't want to stand up with Jackson. Jackson wasn't as quick as he's been in the past (mainly because of his rust/cut down of weight). I think the rematch (if we get one, which I believe we will) will be much better.

 

Let's be honest, this post screams "I don't know what I'm talking about."

[GatorBait19]

Let's be honest, this post screams "I don't know what I'm talking about."

 

hmm, you might be right. Your post screams "I'm a ****"

 

 

hm, let me guess......

 

 

You see Evans as the more dominate of the two fighters because he was quicker, naturalized Rampage against a cage 60% of the fight, and got a nice shot in at the begining. It doesn't matter to you that Evans stalled, he ran away from Rampage, and didn't want him to get any motivation.

 

Now was this smart, yes. For the first time I saw Evans use a game plan, but to sit here and say Evans is the more dominate fighter when Evans has had 2 fights since Rampages last fight and has trained consistently over the year is retarded to me.

 

 

Rampage looked slow, not aggressive like before in this fight with Evans. He had to cut 30-40 something pounds as well for the fight. Rampage rocked him in the 3rd (rewatch the video) he get a couple good licks on Evans with him not defending himself. I have seen plenty of fights like that where the ref would call a fight after the second lick with no defense.

 

Rampage was slow, rusted, and not completely prepared. When he gets that rematch he will beat Evans, if not I will receded my remark about you and never talk in this thread again, but I doubt he loses.

[Dustin]

hmm, you might be right. Your post screams "I'm a ****"

 

Four stars? Thanks man.

[GatorBait19]

Also, I though Ralek looked very good tonight. Diaz didn't have his best match but caught a great armbar.

[Dustin]

hmm, you might be right. Your post screams "I'm a ****"

 

 

hm, let me guess......

 

 

You see Evans as the more dominate of the two fighters because he was quicker, naturalized Rampage against a cage 60% of the fight, and got a nice shot in at the begining. It doesn't matter to you that Evans stalled, he ran away from Rampage, and didn't want him to get any motivation.

 

Now was this smart, yes. For the first time I saw Evans use a game plan, but to sit here and say Evans is the more dominate fighter when Evans has had 2 fights since Rampages last fight and has trained consistently over the year is retarded to me.

 

 

Rampage looked slow, not aggressive like before in this fight with Evans. He had to cut 30-40 something pounds as well for the fight. Rampage rocked him in the 3rd (rewatch the video) he get a couple good licks on Evans with him not defending himself. I have seen plenty of fights like that where the ref would call a fight after the second lick with no defense.

 

Rampage was slow, rusted, and not completely prepared. When he gets that rematch he will beat Evans, if not I will receded my remark about you and never talk in this thread again, but I doubt he loses.

 

I saw Evans as the dominant fighter because he out stuck Rampage, outwrestled Rampage, was much faster, imposed his gameplan and more. Rampage did only two things the entire fight in rocking Rashad (did absolutely nothing to follow up) and getting some ground and pound (most of which was blocked).

 

How long Rampage was off or how he would do in a rematch does not change the fact that he was dominated this time.

[TheKenwyne]

Joooohn Hathaway!!!

[Daffanka]

I truely thought Evans was knocked out in the 3rd. He wasn't defending himself will Jackson laid in his shots and Dean didn't stop the fight. I have always hated how sometimes refs will let a fight go on, but stop others quick.

 

Tonight to me didn't prove anything, Evans didn't want to stand up with Jackson. Jackson wasn't as quick as he's been in the past (mainly because of his rust/cut down of weight). I think the rematch (if we get one, which I believe we will) will be much better.

 

He clearly wasn't.

 

I thought Dean did a great job of not stopping the fight. Rashad was moving around, disrupting Quinton's base, not letting him get any clean shots in and wasn't out. So why would the fight be stopped?

 

Rampage looked roughly as bad as he did against Jardine and lost because he was up against a better fighter, I don't see why this is a surprising development.

 

Other thoughts:

 

SHOOT FOR THE DAMN TAKEDOWN MILLER

 

The Duffee fight was strange, surreal and hilarious.

 

I thought Brilz beat lil' Nog but I thought the first round could go either way. Made me a fan of Brilz though, classy guy.

 

John Hathaway rules because he beat up Diego Sanchez.

 

Luiz Cane still can't defend lefts and Diabate unsurprisingly beat him up.

 

Guillard's liver knee finish looked awesome/gross.

 

Stun gun supremacy.

[RingofHonorGuard]

First off, anyone that says Nog vs. Brilz was a bad fight lacks any sort of real understanding of MMA. That was one of the best fights I've seen in a long time, mostly due to the fact that a massive underdog raised his stock and made people believe that he beat Little Nog. While I'm not going to toot Brilz' horn and say he could be a serious contender, I think he could have done more in the UFC if he was a few years younger and more dedicated to the sport... But for a fireman who doesn't train full time to be able to go in and manhandle Nog Lite like that was pretty impressive.

 

Now... As far as the result goes, I had to watch the fight twice. Everyone always gets so caught up in what the announcers are saying, and often that will create a bias in ones head. After the fight I thought Brilz won the decision, and I got irritated when Little Nog won. First thing I did after the PPV was over was watched that fight again(this time with no sound). Nog took some decent punches, but he landed the more flush shots, had some good submission attempts, and the only time he was ever truly in danger was during the guillotine, which he never would have tapped to. Brilz never had the hold properly sunk in, and Nog was moving around trying to get the load lightened up. Pretty much anytime Brilz would attempt any sort of ground control Nog would slip out the backdoor. Good fight, regardless. I think it could have gone either way but after watching it a second time and getting over the fact that an underdog did -way better- than expected, I see how Nog took the Split. Regardless, Brilz vs. Jardine, make it happen. Dude's gonna at least make a good gatekeeper.

 

Thought the Bisping/Miller fight was one of the worst co-main events ever. I spent more time chatting with friends than I did watching the fight. It went down pretty much exactly how I thought it would. Miller is a tough dude, and I didn't see Bisping finishing him... And on that same token, I didn't think Miller was at the level yet to beat Bisping... So it was a recipe for a decision from the get go. Bisping needs to fight Marquardt next, especially if he's going to talk about title shots.

 

Rashad got knocked out, but he recovered. Deal with it. I'm a Rampage fan, I wanted him to win, but Rampage was winning the fight for like 30 seconds, the rest of the fight Rashad made him look like he was 40 years old fighting against a 20 year old. It was sad to see. There's no way they book a rematch to this fight, especially right now. It was a lopsided decision. Quinton should fight Forrest a second time if they're going to do any rematches. I think that fight makes the most sense. A lot of people are crying for Machida vs. Rampage, but I don't see any way whatsoever that Rampage comes out of that the winner. Forrest/Rampage II makes the most sense because both were beaten by Rashad.

 

Diego is on the fast track to being a disappointment. He had -nothing- for Hathaway. Wrestling, which is supposed to be the major weakness of the UK fighters, was where Hathaway mostly controlled the fight. That's supposed to be Sanchez' key strength. Hathaway is so far the first complete UK fighter I've seen. UFC should market him wisely, dude's young and once he gets more experience under his belt he's going to rock the division.

 

What can you say about the Duffee/Russow fight? I wanted Duffee to win because he's from a neighboring city to me, and he's just a funny dude. If you haven't seen the picture of him surfing Sherdog and eating a burrito, go find it. That thread is one of the funniest I've seen. Anyway, I was actually more familiar with Russow in this fight than Duffee. Russow was in... well, awful shape? Now, what I wanna know is... How does Tim Hague get obliterated in 7 seconds, and yet he survived on his feet with PAT BARRY until subbing him... And Mike Russow can take punches from Duffee all day and never even seem disoriented? The only thing I can think of is Hague just took it right on the beak at the exact location it needed to land at. Sad. I'm still a Duff-man fan though. BRING ON BUENTELLO!

 

Fights I wanna see now:

 

Little Nog vs. Cyrille Diabate(Both put Cane's lights out, and with Nog coming off a split decision it makes more sense. People might not like this because they still want to see L. Nog/Forrest, but I'd rather see them give Cyrille a chance.) Alternatively, if The Janitor somehow beats Jon Jones I would love to see Little Nog vs. Janitor III.

 

Rashad vs. Shogun(Fights already happening I think, and Shogun by all measures should absolutely destroy Rashad)

 

Rampage vs. Forrest II

 

Cane or Jardine vs. Brilz

 

Hyun Kim vs. John Hathaway

[jesterx7769]

I truely thought Evans was knocked out in the 3rd. He wasn't defending himself will Jackson laid in his shots and Dean didn't stop the fight. I have always hated how sometimes refs will let a fight go on, but stop others quick.

 

Tonight to me didn't prove anything, Evans didn't want to stand up with Jackson. Jackson wasn't as quick as he's been in the past (mainly because of his rust/cut down of weight). I think the rematch (if we get one, which I believe we will) will be much better.

 

hmm, you might be right. Your post screams "I'm a ****"

 

 

hm, let me guess......

 

 

You see Evans as the more dominate of the two fighters because he was quicker, naturalized Rampage against a cage 60% of the fight, and got a nice shot in at the begining. It doesn't matter to you that Evans stalled, he ran away from Rampage, and didn't want him to get any motivation.

 

Now was this smart, yes. For the first time I saw Evans use a game plan, but to sit here and say Evans is the more dominate fighter when Evans has had 2 fights since Rampages last fight and has trained consistently over the year is retarded to me.

 

 

Rampage looked slow, not aggressive like before in this fight with Evans. He had to cut 30-40 something pounds as well for the fight. Rampage rocked him in the 3rd (rewatch the video) he get a couple good licks on Evans with him not defending himself. I have seen plenty of fights like that where the ref would call a fight after the second lick with no defense.

 

Rampage was slow, rusted, and not completely prepared. When he gets that rematch he will beat Evans, if not I will receded my remark about you and never talk in this thread again, but I doubt he loses.

 

While the first user to reply might have been harsh your replies def. scream "I;m a Rampage fan Rashad shouldn't win lalalalalal dont wanna hear it"

 

Rampage landed what 3 punches from standing then the 5 when Rashad was on the ground? I dont think Rampage even threw 20 punches. You talk about Rampage Rocking and how he should have TKO'd him in the third but casually pass over Rashad rocking Rampage in the first.

 

The whole fight was pretty straight forward. Rashad leaped in and out landing a few punches at a time and took him down a few times after he lured Rampage into an exchange or he pushed him up against the cage. Was he the most active against the cage? Of course not. But you can't say Rashad was stalling, why didn't Rampage just get his a$$ of the cage wall? Exactly. Once again you cannot blame Rashad for "running away" isn't the whole point NOT to get hit? What do you want him to do stand right in front of the one dimensional Rampage and wait to get hit? And what about Rashad GnP in the third? He landed more strikes on the ground than Rampage did when the "fight should have been stopped"

 

Rampage has been a conservative counter fighter his last few fights and I think he went into this fight thinking Rashad was going to stand and trade with him like Rashad had been doing in fights and Rampage would be able to land stronger punches and win. He looked like crap plain and simple, slow, conservative, didn't want to do much at all, he didn't want to start or engage the stand up and he didn't want to try to take Rashad down either and try his own GnP. To me he looked like the one stalling and like he did not even want to be there. I don't know why he didn't go after Rashad after he put him on the ground, he just stood there afterward, very lousy and half assed. Call it ring rust or any other excuse, Rashad clearly won and for all his training Rampage clearly has to hate himself this morning.

 

Wasn't the most exciting at all, but if I'm Dana Rampage showed me far from enough to get a rematch. Give him Vera in 3/4 months if Vera's recovered (which i dont think he is) otherwise Machida

[RingofHonorGuard]

While the first user to reply might have been harsh your replies def. scream "I;m a Rampage fan Rashad shouldn't win lalalalalal dont wanna hear it"

 

Rampage landed what 3 punches from standing then the 5 when Rashad was on the ground? I dont think Rampage even threw 20 punches. You talk about Rampage Rocking and how he should have TKO'd him in the third but casually pass over Rashad rocking Rampage in the first.

 

The whole fight was pretty straight forward. Rashad leaped in and out landing a few punches at a time and took him down a few times after he lured Rampage into an exchange or he pushed him up against the cage. Was he the most active against the cage? Of course not. But you can't say Rashad was stalling, why didn't Rampage just get his a$$ of the cage wall? Exactly. Once again you cannot blame Rashad for "running away" isn't the whole point NOT to get hit? What do you want him to do stand right in front of the one dimensional Rampage and wait to get hit? And what about Rashad GnP in the third? He landed more strikes on the ground than Rampage did when the "fight should have been stopped"

 

Rampage has been a conservative counter fighter his last few fights and I think he went into this fight thinking Rashad was going to stand and trade with him like Rashad had been doing in fights and Rampage would be able to land stronger punches and win. He looked like crap plain and simple, slow, conservative, didn't want to do much at all, he didn't want to start or engage the stand up and he didn't want to try to take Rashad down either and try his own GnP. To me he looked like the one stalling and like he did not even want to be there. I don't know why he didn't go after Rashad after he put him on the ground, he just stood there afterward, very lousy and half assed. Call it ring rust or any other excuse, Rashad clearly won and for all his training Rampage clearly has to hate himself this morning.

 

Wasn't the most exciting at all, but if I'm Dana Rampage showed me far from enough to get a rematch. Give him Vera in 3/4 months if Vera's recovered (which i dont think he is) otherwise Machida

 

Vera vs. Rampage would be one of the worst matches ever for the UFC. There's very little upside to it. Vera would be able to hold Quinton against the fence like Rashad did, possibly even easier.

 

Secondly, Vera is coming off of back-to-back losses. They aren't going to give him a chance against a top contender for having two losses in a row. Rampage lost to Rashad, but he's still only lost twice in the UFC now. Don't make it out like Rampage is some can who deserves to be fighting C-level fighters because he looked sluggish against Rashad.

 

Vera has no business fighting the upper tier of fighters right now. He is an example of someone who looked good when he debuted and got carried along on the UFC hype train to retarded levels. He's got two losses in a row, and if he lost to Quinton they would almost have to cut him. And if he beats Quinton what does the UFC really gain? It just makes Quinton look even worse and lowers his marketability a little.

[jesterx7769]

Then who do youw ant him to fight? Him fighting Forrest dosn't make as much as you sense as you said, Forrest beat him and is coming off a win. So what does Forrest gain? If he wins people will just say Rampage is going down hill and lost it since he just lost to Rashad after such a long lay off.

 

They seemed content on pushing Vera (eventhough I agree with you on not liking him) before so there is def. upside. If Vera wins he gets a big name win and gets back on track, if Rampage gets the "easy" win he gets back on track. Most of the top LHW are booked anyway. Besides if Rampage really is retiring after his contract (as he said before but he also said he was done fighting before and not finishign his contract so who knows) then why push him at all? That's why I think a Machida fight makes sense since eventhough they are coming off losses they could headline/co an event and get the PPV buys making the UFC money

 

Your post also is very contradicting. You start out by saying Vera would be able to hold him up against the fence, implying he could control the fight and win from the clinch. Then at the end you say Vera has no business fighting upper level fighters and not to say Rampage shouuld be fighting C level cans. So which is it? You can't say Vera would control Rampage then call him a C level can and say Rampage shouldn't be fighting him and he's a contender.

[Daffanka]

I think Rampage really needs to find the form he had against Henderson. Even if he'd managed to KO Rashad in the third he's still looking as bad as he did against Jardine and would get messed up by Shogun the same way he did in Pride.

 

I'm not going to write him off just yet because he's been in slumps like this before (admittedly he was younger then) and has come back. It was at least encouraging to hear him say that he wanted to get back in as soon as possible.

 

e: Regarding Vera - Rampage, I don't think it's going to happen. It's a risky fight for both guys as a bad version of Rampage could potentially lose a terribly boring decision to Vera while a good version of Rampage would take Vera's head off and give him his third straight loss, and it's not like they can put Vera in the co-main or put Rampage on the undercard.

 

I think Rampage - Machida makes a lot of sense from a business perspective, or any match ups between Nog, Machida, Forrest and Rampage that doesn't lead to Rampage - Forrest 2.