NEW WRITERS, A Question

[Bigpapa42]

I would love to see the excel sheet or word document that some of you great writers use.

 

Meaning, how do you outline your main story arch. What are your "pencilled in" notes on who to push, why and how?

 

I'll use Eisen-Verse as an example just for the fact that he created his own company.

 

What did you use (couldn't have all been in your head) when you first thought of the idea? How do you lay it out on paper before booking the show/writing up the event? etc...

 

Not sure if I'm clear on what I'm asking for. Hence why I don't write diaries.

 

Hopefully someone will understand what I'm trying for.

 

R

 

Check your PMs, Reaper.

 

For my current TCW project, I have one big spreadsheet with a couple dozen sheets that I use to keep track of most stuff. From PPV-by-PPV booking plans to roster to music. Future feuds, storyline ideas, all of that. For the bigger storylines, I'm using a separate Word documents with the major points of the story that I need to include and where they should be, roughly. In the planning stages, I had a few Word documents for different ideas, storylines, characteriztions, etc.

 

I know that EV put a lot of time into developing his vision for DOA, much as I did for TCW. I assume a lot of wrtiers do the same for their promotions, geting an overall feel and grasp on things before they begin to lay out specific booking plans and shows. That "vision" is a pretty key thing to me, as its want you want to get across to your readers.

 

not sure how "welcoming" or "inviting" this thread is. But it seems to be serving a propose so I am cool with the direction it went.

 

as long as we are talking about readers. Any Ideas on how to recognize them with some kind of thank you awards?

 

I love the idea of recognizing the readers in some way. Unfortunately, I am bereft of suggestions on how to do so. Have nothing. Zero.

[MaxxHexx]

What did you use (couldn't have all been in your head) when you first thought of the idea? How do you lay it out on paper before booking the show/writing up the event? etc...

 

Not sure if I'm clear on what I'm asking for. Hence why I don't write diaries.

 

Hopefully someone will understand what I'm trying for.

 

When I am bored in class I will just take out a notebook and start listing ideas or changes. If I have my laptop I just pop them into a notepad .txt document. Nothing fancy, just functionality. While it does not sound like much, this listing maintains sanity, and makes things easier, need to know about the roster, I just open up the doc, which I keep on my desktop. Far faster than opening an navigating the game, especially when at work or class.

 

The power of the mind is not to be shied from either. The random day dreaming produces most of my best ideas.

 

 

I don't know, maybe a small corner in the Diary Hall of Fame???

 

This is a wondrous idea. Reader of the month is a great idea for those that truly contribute and build this community.

[ColtCabana]

I'm currently trying to start up a diary again but after writing up my first show I've noticed it was just over 4,000 words! I'm worried that I won't be able to keep this effort up for the weekly shows. Do any experienced or otherwise diary writers have any tips for me? I'm thinking of shortening the matches because they take the longest to write for me and I don't want them to get stale.

[Self]

I'm currently trying to start up a diary again but after writing up my first show I've noticed it was just over 4,000 words! I'm worried that I won't be able to keep this effort up for the weekly shows. Do any experienced or otherwise diary writers have any tips for me? I'm thinking of shortening the matches because they take the longest to write for me and I don't want them to get stale.

 

Wow. 4000. I just checked a few of my shows (which I considered fairly long) and they clocked in at around 2,500.

 

1) Write 3-4 shows before you create the thread on the forum. Not only will this give you a headstart on your future work (as long as you don't blow your load posting them in quick succession) but it will be a test of your commitment. Maybe after 2 shows you'll find it IS too much work. Best find this out before you start posting.

2) This might just be me, but I always work best with a deadline. A lot of folks seem to post their shows 'as soon as they get it done', but I went for a more rigid structure. I posted a show every Monday. No sooner. No later. With that deadline, I could see exactly what I had to do, and how much time I had to do it. Plus, if I got the show finished early, I could take a break, recharge, or even get a headstart on next week's episode. I find deadlines relaxing. Do you?

3) I don't think many folks read matches all that closely. Most skip to the winners or skip to the finish. Put just enough detail in that each character comes across (angry guys fight angry, technical guys do submissions, powerhouses do big slams) then just write the finish. You can put more detail into the Main Events, but for prelim fights keep it concise. You don't need to write move-for-move. It's like in real wrestling. Save it for the main event. Don't burn out the crowd early.

[ColtCabana]

Wow. 4000. I just checked a few of my shows (which I considered fairly long) and they clocked in at around 2,500.

 

1) Write 3-4 shows before you create the thread on the forum. Not only will this give you a headstart on your future work (as long as you don't blow your load posting them in quick succession) but it will be a test of your commitment. Maybe after 2 shows you'll find it IS too much work. Best find this out before you start posting.

2) This might just be me, but I always work best with a deadline. A lot of folks seem to post their shows 'as soon as they get it done', but I went for a more rigid structure. I posted a show every Monday. No sooner. No later. With that deadline, I could see exactly what I had to do, and how much time I had to do it. Plus, if I got the show finished early, I could take a break, recharge, or even get a headstart on next week's episode. I find deadlines relaxing. Do you?

3) I don't think many folks read matches all that closely. Most skip to the winners or skip to the finish. Put just enough detail in that each character comes across (angry guys fight angry, technical guys do submissions, powerhouses do big slams) then just write the finish. You can put more detail into the Main Events, but for prelim fights keep it concise. You don't need to write move-for-move. It's like in real wrestling. Save it for the main event. Don't burn out the crowd early.

 

Yeah, 4000 really hit me as being too long to maintain. I've learnt from my last diaries a couple of years ago, I have 2 months PPVs booked in advance to write my shows around. In regards to deadlines, I think I am the opposite to you, I don't work well with deadlines they play on my mind!

 

This is a sample of a match:

 

Wrestler 1 got a slight smattering of cheers for his entrance with was most likely only because of the presence of Valet 1. Wrestler 2 on the other hand got a huge mixed reaction and looked all business as he headed to the ring. Wrestler 1 started off the match with some good brawling before hitting a nice belly to back suplex which got a loud cheer from Valet 1. This seemed to light a fire under Wrestler 2 who had a point to prove from last nights PPV. From the collar and elbow tie up Wrestler 2 took control getting Wrestler 1 in a headlock before transitioning to the ground via a surprising bulldog. A few stomps and a stiff DDT later it was time for Wrestler 2 to prep and hit Finisher 2 for the 1...2...3.

 

thanks for your advice

[Self]

Match length is good. I'd try to throw a little more 'colour' in there. Instead of 'good brawling', why not use or 'violent punching' or 'precision striking' or 'swift kicks' or something like that? It's a little more visual, and might make the characters 'pop' a bit more for the reader.

 

Odd Self-specific point. I never booked my shows in advance. I always wrote them first, THEN booked them with TEW. That's me though. I tend to change my mind a lot. If I booked first, I can guarantee that in the 4-5 days it takes me to write a show, I'll have come up with new ideas about at least 3 segments. I've been looking for my old FCK spreadsheets, but it seems I deleted them all. They weren't all that interesting. The main purpose was to make sure every storyline advanced on every show, and to make all of my main characters had something to do. Glorified checklists.

[James Casey]

I would love to see the excel sheet or word document that some of you great writers use.

 

Meaning, how do you outline your main story arch. What are your "pencilled in" notes on who to push, why and how?

 

 

For MAW, I had the monthly shows mapped out at the end of whichever document I was writing in. At the start of each month, I'd begin to fill in the details for the month's TV shows. by the end I'd end up with something like this:

 

September – The Clash

Giedroyc challenges Newton, pride – Masked Man vs. Davis Wayne Newton

Antonio vs. Cameron Vessey

Divine Intervention vs. The Me In Team vs. Platinum 12” vs. Dirty Elite © – MAW Tag Team titles

Gino Montero, El Heroe Mexicano, Amazing Fire Fly and KC Glenn vs. Eric Eisen, Joe Sexy, “Enforcer” Phil Roberts and Ernest Youngman – MM unmasks after match, challenges Youngman A reminder that the unmasking would take place here, and not after the MM's own match

Joanne Rodriguez © vs. Grace Harper – MAW Women’s title

Swoop McCarthy vs. Jean Cattley © – MAW World title

Kid Arachnid vs. Alicia Strong – lumberjack match, Arachnid takes convincing to hit Strong, won’t do it, no offence, shenanigans, interference, no DQ, accidental taking out of Alicia? Or Alicia throws match to spite Elite? Random notes thrown in as I worked out how this match would run.

 

1

D: Ernest Youngman vs. Jean Cattley A test to see if their later TV match would come out okay

Lassana Makutsi vs. Davis Wayne Newton – Newton wins, calls out MM, challenges at PPV, MM accepts, veiled threat to Youngman

Swoop McCarthy vs. Ernest Youngman – Number One contender, Youngman spooked, Swoop wins The Masked Man at work, distracting Youngman and costing him a match

Elite put Strong into Women’s match, no need to warm up for Arachnid, would never hit a woman, easy win for Elite Building up to the Alicia/Elite split– Joanne Rodriguez and Lauren Easter vs. Grace Harper and Alicia Strong

The Firm backstage promo – focus on goals, take down Elite, be ready for anything

Kid Arachnid vs. Sean Deeley

El Heroe Mexicano vs. Eric Eisen

“Bulldozer” Brandon Smith vs. Antonio – Antonio challenges Vessey or Valentine

Gino Montero and KC Glenn vs. “Enforcer Phil Roberts and Joe Sexy

 

2

Youngman spooked – Kid Arachnid vs. Ernest Youngman – I’ve beaten everyone, just one more, Eisen doesn’t count – you need to beat everyone – including Alicia! The angle setting up the inter-gender match between Arachnid and Elite

Lassana Makutsi vs. Sean Deeley – Makutsi wins, challenges Newton

Lauren Easter vs. Grace Harper

Gino Montero and KC Glenn vs. Dirty Elite

“Bulldozer” Brandon Smith vs. Jean Cattley

Jared Johnson vs. “Enforcer” Phil Roberts

El Heroe Mexicano vs. Eric Eisen

 

3

Challenge to break poor run of form – Gino Montero © vs. Sean Deeley – MAW All Action title

Kid Arachnid vs. Thrash

Youngman tries to crash the World title match, challenges Swoop – Accepts for two weeks time, but next week... – Youngman spooked Setting up the #1 contenders match, also playing on the Youngman/Masked Man angle

Phoenix vs. Ernest Youngman © – MAW Traditional title

KC Glenn vs. Leadfoot

Fumihiro Ota and Lauren Easter vs. Joss Thompson and Tracy Brendon

Swoop McCarthy vs. Joe Sexy – double DQ A reminder to myself that this match was to keep both guys on TV and looking strong

Luchas De Mascaras vs. Eric Eisen and Jean Cattley

 

4

Phoenix vs. Davis Wayne Newton

T-Bone Bright vs. Eric Eisen

The Canadian Blondes vs. The Party Animals vs. Dirty Elite

KC Glenn vs. Joss Thompson

Joanne Rodriguez and Ashley Grover vs. Laura Flame and Nadia Snow

Luchas De Mascaras vs. “Enforcer” Phil Roberts and Jean Cattley The post-PPV show normally wouldn't have much in the way of angles on it, mainly just the transition from one month's feuds to the next

 

My Excel spreadsheets have evolved from the relatively simple EWR days to the 10 sheets I used for MAW. Some of those only got rarely used (three sheets for 8, 16 and 32 man brackets, for example) but the others packed a lot of information into a single screen.

[eayragt]

All I'll add to this is that every reader is different. The only 2010 diary that I've read all of, word for word, is infinitywpi's. It's an easy read, can be done quickly, and doesn't require the investment of some of the other diaries.

 

Things have changed since 2007 when I religiously read almost every long running Cornellverse diary...

[Phantom Stranger]

I would love to see the excel sheet or word document that some of you great writers use.

 

Meaning, how do you outline your main story arch. What are your "pencilled in" notes on who to push, why and how?

 

I'll use Eisen-Verse as an example just for the fact that he created his own company.

 

What did you use (couldn't have all been in your head) when you first thought of the idea? How do you lay it out on paper before booking the show/writing up the event? etc...

 

Honestly, 90% of what I do is all in my head, because flex is essential to me - I don't lock in plans, because when I do things go in the way so i'd rather improvise within framework. I know that I'm going to have X big match at Y event, and I know it's going to be led up to by moments A, B, and C - and those fit in where I fit them in. Given I've got another storyline where match 1 is going to happen the event Y, and that needs moments 8, 9, and 10, and given that A and 9 could be combined, I tweak when I book that show.

 

If match X does better than expected, I'll extend the series and so other plotlines shift; if there's chemistry issues, sometimes I shorten it, sometimes I don't. And occasionally a random tag pairing becomes something I want to go with based off their results...

 

In TCW, at present, I'm working toward Malice in Wonderland, the big show, and War to Settle the Score, where I'm planning to trigger events will set up 2009's big programs. This means that I'm starting to drop hints and indicators, because I love slow-burn programs and consequently book for them. Once I get through WtStS, there's the short run to Total Mayhem, then I'll find a new point to book toward and slowly head for there.

 

What happens in the meantime will always change as potential talent becomes available, contracts get disputed, wrestlers improve or fail to, and injuries happen - so I just have the stuff briefly sketched out in my head.

[MattitudeV2]

Hey guys, I know you know me from my dynasty writting but have struggled to ever get a story going and I have plans of starting another dynasty. Need to get my storylines across in order to get a long standing one going so if anyone could help me via private message that would deeply be appreciated.

[mistaken]

Hey guys, I know you know me from my dynasty writting but have struggled to ever get a story going and I have plans of starting another dynasty. Need to get my storylines across in order to get a long standing one going so if anyone could help me via private message that would deeply be appreciated.

 

We should start a Big Writer Little Writter Program,

 

We all enter our weight then I divide it into three groups the Plus, the Average & the Emaciated.

 

We leave the Average alone, but team up the Plus with an Emaciated, and see who has the bigger impact on the other.

[DiablomanConQueso]

This has been a very interesting and thoughtfully paced thread. I will place my thoughts and then go on my merry way.

 

I started a thread not so long ago to try to get the full enjoyment out of TEW 2010 by starting a diary. I started it off, and I plotted and I wrote and I posted and I started but then I stopped after the 5th post.. Was it the lack of response to my post? Was it that I realized that my writing needed an overhaul? Yes to both.

 

If you are writing for the wrong reasons then feedback becomes all that more important to you. If you write to get hits on the post and obsess over it like you were actually getting paid for it then you will hit the proverbial wall of insecurity and writers block that I so not-so graciously hit.

 

 

My advice to new writers like myself is to write because you love to write. Write because it makes the game feel so much better when you incorporate you own story and spin to it. Write, well, because you like writing matches and cards and all that in between....

 

As for me, since my last post I was able to take FCW to regional and am currently finishing off year 3. I have a notebook full of notes and concepts to follow up with but I am thinking of just starting fresh.

 

anyways, again... great thread!

[Irish Wolf]

Rewarding readers gets done in quite a few dairies and its fun. Nevermore did it in his MoSC diary. All of us who were posting our chants got put into the story as part of the crowd. I think at one point my "fan" in the crowd almost got beat up by one of the heel wrestlers. Dragonmack called out a few people in his latest diary, mentioning my love of Steve Flash merchandise as an example but he's done it with others as well. Even Self's FCK diary where voting in the polls made you feel like you had some say over the direction of the show, These little things are great and they really make the reader feel like he's involved in the show. I think bringing the reader into the show is the greatest reward.

[BHK1978]

I agree with you Apupunchau@optonline, I tend to keep up with writers that respond to you. Eisen-Verse is the perfect example of this, if you comment in his diary he will respond no matter how dumb the comment is (And believe me I have made some dumb comments in his diaries.).

 

My point being, if you as a writer tries to include your readers, I think people feel more like they are apart of something. Therefore, they are more apt to give you feedback or make picks. If people post stuff in your diaries like questions and you do not bother to respond. People might feel that you do not care about what they have to say and that might turn them off.

[Irish Wolf]

I agree with you Apupunchau@optonline, I tend to keep up with writers that respond to you. Eisen-Verse is the perfect example of this, if you comment in his diary he will respond no matter how dumb the comment is (And believe me I have made some dumb comments in his diaries.).

 

My point being, if you as a writer tries to include your readers, I think people feel more like they are apart of something. Therefore, they are more apt to give you feedback or make picks. If people post stuff in your diaries like questions and you do not bother to respond. People might feel that you do not care about what they have to say and that might turn them off.

 

To add to this in what may seem like circular logic diary writers won't necessarily draw in their readers unless they comment, and reader may not comment unless they feel drawn in. So writers sometimes it takes a little initiative on your part and readers if you try and get yourself involved chance are the writer will involve you.

[Self]

I agree with that. Personally, I never replied to comments, and I feel like some of my readers may have been a little turned off by that. I wanted to reply, I intended to, but every time I tried I felt like I was either giving away spoilers, or breaking kayfabe in a way that would hurt the story I was telling. So I largely decided to keep quiet and let the shows speak for themselves. Stylistically, I stand by this choice, but I recognize I may have chased away some commenters in the process.

 

Vaguely connected point in regards to communication. A good writer listens and adapts his work to his audience. For example, Steve DeColt was only supposed to be in 3 episodes of FCK, but because my readers seemed to dig him (especially his ridiculous catchphrase) I brought him back, eventually creating the most Awesome Alliance in wrestling history. I may not have told my readers "Wow. Y'all sure like DeColt. I think I'll bring him back." but that's precisely why it happened. Give the fans what they want.

[BHK1978]

To add to this in what may seem like circular logic diary writers won't necessarily draw in their readers unless they comment, and reader may not comment unless they feel drawn in. So writers sometimes it takes a little initiative on your part and readers if you try and get yourself involved chance are the writer will involve you.

 

Well this is really going to make this weird but sometimes writers ask for feedback, and people come in and trash them for being needy. I guess it is a vicious cycle.

[Bigpapa42]

The issue of responding the readers is one I've always found interesting. There is no "right way", in my opinoin. I've always respected Self's approach of maintaining kayfabe throughout the project. Its tough, but its an approach I can understand and is a more realistic way of storytelling when you think about it. Personally, I went the far opposite, and try to have as much interactivity as possible. Like EV, I try to respond to almost all comments that people put in there, and I even do occassional post-show thoughts where I explain some of my booking logic. The upside to that degree of interactivity is that it engeanders discussion (though some of it is off-topci) and I now have a "very vocal reader base", in part due to that. The downside is that it can make a mess of stuff for people to sift through if they only want to read the shows and segments. Plus, it can tough not to throw out hints at future direction and plans, especially when it justifies a decision someone is questioning. Again, I don't think any given approach is right, as they all have their upside and downside...

 

Trying to create reader comments and interaction by asking questions, using polls, etc, can be effective. But you have to be careful on what you are asking. If you do it too overtly and on important things, it can come across as if you want the readers to book things. Again, just be careful with it.

 

I do very much agree with Self that its important to use and adapt to the information you receive from the readers. That might mean altering plans to some extent if the readers take to a given character or storyline more than intended. Don't go overboard with things and maintain a perspective on it - going to overkill can lose what you've gained.

[The Masked Orange]

The issue of responding the readers is one I've always found interesting. There is no "right way", in my opinoin. I've always respected Self's approach of maintaining kayfabe throughout the project. Its tough, but its an approach I can understand and is a more realistic way of storytelling when you think about it. Personally, I went the far opposite, and try to have as much interactivity as possible. Like EV, I try to respond to almost all comments that people put in there, and I even do occassional post-show thoughts where I explain some of my booking logic. The upside to that degree of interactivity is that it engeanders discussion (though some of it is off-topci) and I now have a "very vocal reader base", in part due to that. The downside is that it can make a mess of stuff for people to sift through if they only want to read the shows and segments. Plus, it can tough not to throw out hints at future direction and plans, especially when it justifies a decision someone is questioning. Again, I don't think any given approach is right, as they all have their upside and downside...

 

Trying to create reader comments and interaction by asking questions, using polls, etc, can be effective. But you have to be careful on what you are asking. If you do it too overtly and on important things, it can come across as if you want the readers to book things. Again, just be careful with it.

 

I do very much agree with Self that its important to use and adapt to the information you receive from the readers. That might mean altering plans to some extent if the readers take to a given character or storyline more than intended. Don't go overboard with things and maintain a perspective on it - going to overkill can lose what you've gained.

 

I get what you mean about trying not to reveal what will happen even though it justifies a point.

 

Sorta like the episode of House where (damn, forgot his name. He works for Obama now) dies and the critics said it was badly done and it was only done to make that one episode bigger.

 

Well then came the series finale and BAM!, justification.

[mystic]

In reading this thread I went back to my first diary using tew 2005 and had a look. Noticing that I did not get a "comment" untill I hit page 3. In reading it over, I remember now that I don't think I wasn't begging for comments but I went out of my way to ask for comments from readers.

 

As far as writing, as others have said here, write the dairy because you want to. Find a company that you would enjoy playing even if you were not doing a dairy for it. I've seen many dairies jump from show to show, but I personally like detail so I write out day to day even the boring midweek meetings.

 

For me I had everything planned out that I wanted in my fed and if a comment made by reader I may or may not add it in. (I still have all my files typed in word that I used for the diary.) If something in the game forced me to change a plan, I wrote it into the diary as it added another layer to the writing I think.

 

As far as responding to comments, I responded to the first set out of character which broke the flow of the diary I think but later on I actually created a new staff member to answer fans comments adding them to the thread.

 

Shows for me were the fun part, at the time of writing I used the wrespi 2 moves list and worked matches out in my head, (fun but long process some times).

 

Overall I liked writing it, but real life took over and it never got a proper ending, as it just died. Though it did win a C-verse DOTM award from Adam. (which yes was cool when I got it)

 

just my two cents

 

The New Era of Danger and Violence Extreme (using tew 2005 and carried over to 2007, diary now dead and the one I am talking about above but leave thoughts if you wish)

http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14689

 

The Rise of a Dream (using tew 2005, using c-verse and writing now)

http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=91753

[Remianen]

I would love to see the excel sheet or word document that some of you great writers use.

 

Meaning, how do you outline your main story arch. What are your "pencilled in" notes on who to push, why and how?

 

I'll use Eisen-Verse as an example just for the fact that he created his own company.

 

What did you use (couldn't have all been in your head) when you first thought of the idea? How do you lay it out on paper before booking the show/writing up the event? etc...

 

Not sure if I'm clear on what I'm asking for. Hence why I don't write diaries.

 

Hopefully someone will understand what I'm trying for.

 

R

 

Honestly, the stories I've put together are mainly ripped from existing, uh, "literature". For example, one of the key long-running stories I have in my diary is going to be an almost direct rip of the Drizzt-Catti brie relationship (except the end). I have the entire Vampire Chronicles running through the promotion too, though not in the same exact way. (Not to spoil things but the Armand-Daniel relationship is duplicated in exact detail, which I'm pretty proud of. )

 

Interaction between characters can be seen in all literary forms. Heck, I got an idea for Grace Harper's characterization from 'Masque of the Red Death'. Ideas came to me from reading things as diverse as Ovid to Chaucer to Poe to Koontz & King to Salvatore. They don't even need to be GOOD (bad characterizations can teach you a lot as well).

 

I think the #1 thing folks can do to encourage new writers is simple: give 'em feedback. Even if it's by PM (which is my typical MO ), knowing that people are reading and show interest in what you're doing is easily the most encouraging thing people can do, I think.

[Ruthian23]

I have a quick dumb question. I'm preparing a diary, but I'm unfamiliar with how to post pictures in a post if they're not available somewhere on-line. How do people do that in their diaries? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

[Bigpapa42]

I have a quick dumb question. I'm preparing a diary, but I'm unfamiliar with how to post pictures in a post if they're not available somewhere on-line. How do people do that in their diaries? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

You upload them yourself. Typically done via a Photobucket account, or something similar.

[Dragonmack]

I have a quick dumb question. I'm preparing a diary, but I'm unfamiliar with how to post pictures in a post if they're not available somewhere on-line. How do people do that in their diaries? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

You upload them yourself. Typically done via a Photobucket account, or something similar.

 

Upload the pictures to an online site like Bigpapa said, Photobucket is nice and easy. They provide an img link you can paste into your post that will point to and display the picture on photobucket.

[Ruthian23]

Thanks, guys. Much appreciated.