PeterHilton Posted November 2, 2010 Share Posted November 2, 2010 but when he goes up against D. Fish he didn't look that great. That was true.And it was actually surprising. But Fish got lots of help. I still think Rondo dominated enough during the second half of last season and the play-offs that it's no longer fair to doubt his credentials. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted November 2, 2010 Share Posted November 2, 2010 Whatever. It's not like all he had was this one game. He completely dominated the Celtics playoff run and routinely overwhelmed the opposing PG to the point the Celtics' opponents had to rearrange their defense. Yeah I don't think anyone is saying Rondo is great because of one game. He led the league in steals, averaged 10 assists a game, and was named first team defense last year, and that was before he stepped up his game in the post-season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownsy Posted November 2, 2010 Share Posted November 2, 2010 but when he goes up against D. Fish he didn't look that great. you mean up against Kobe, who finished second in DPOY voting. The lakers did all the could to avoid the fisher - rondo match up, which they did quite effectively outside of transition cross matches. They did the exact same thing they did in 08', have Kobe cover rondo, which allows Kobe to help when rondo gives the ball up due to the lack of a consistent jump shot. The only difference is it worked this time, and the Celtic's injury bug caught them in game 6 when they lost Perkins. Without him they had no answer to the lakers front court advantage which they had somewhat evened out by having the ability to have perkins, a great defender, take gasol or bynum one on one. Once that broke down with perk out they had to give help and the Laker's superior front court allowed the triangle to go to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownsy Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 18 more assists for Rondo tonight, hes averaging 17 through 4 games. Not that he can keep that up but that's pretty crazy. Hit some jumpers tonight too. Kid's a joy to watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capelli King Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Rondo is a surprise to me, back 3ish years ago, i always thought he was being pushed way too much, i actually liked House more back then. He has however improved allot, that i have to say, his D is very impressive, he really is a great competitor and organizes the attack well. He is not the great offensive player, his shooting is average at best and i still think he should stick to what he is good at, which is setting up his team mates, especially if you consider who he has as team mates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownsy Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Rondo is a surprise to me, back 3ish years ago, i always thought he was being pushed way too much, i actually liked House more back then. He has however improved allot, that i have to say, his D is very impressive, he really is a great competitor and organizes the attack well. He is not the great offensive player, his shooting is average at best and i still think he should stick to what he is good at, which is setting up his team mates, especially if you consider who he has as team mates. The not a good offensive player is kind of off base, though i agree with everything else. HE had the 3rd highest shooting percentage among PG's last year. He is not a good jump shooter (although he's improved marginal every year. seems to be on the J kidd plan, he'll be an average shooter in only 7 more years ) But he is a fantastic finisher at the rim, Pure passing PG, to me only behind chris paul with nash losing a step, passing's also part of the offensive set, and he is avergaing just a ridiculous 16.8 APG right now, along with 15 PPG) He's also by far the best rebounding PG in the league with Kidd slowing down, he gets an insane amount of offensive rebounds for a PG leading to even more offensive chances for his teammates. Honestly to me it's not the lack of a plus Jumpshot that holds him back from greatness, It's shooting 60% from the FT line, where he can get any time he wants. If he could up his FT % to even...75% over the next few years, he'd be in the top 10 player in the league discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownsy Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Also, congrats to Paul Pierce. He made me a Celtics fan. I grew up on the Cape and had to hear every year about how great the Celtics teams of the 80's were from my uncles. When Pierce got drafted I was 13 and really started to follow the game. He's gone from overconfident young guy, through a near death experience, to the team leader he's grown into the last 6 years or so. Been a joy to watch you grow up from that scoring machine with a attitude to a complete SF and team leader. 20,000K points down, 1067 to go to catch LArry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHaynes23 Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Also, congrats to Paul Pierce. He made me a Celtics fan. I grew up on the Cape and had to hear every year about how great the Celtics teams of the 80's were from my uncles. When Pierce got drafted I was 13 and really started to follow the game. He's gone from overconfident young guy, through a near death experience, to the team leader he's grown into the last 6 years or so. Been a joy to watch you grow up from that scoring machine with a attitude to a complete SF and team leader. 20,000K points down, 1067 to go to catch LArry Paul Pierce is kind of a double whammy for me. I really don't like the Celtics at all. They were my least favorite team until LeBron took his talents to South Beach this summer. They are growing on me though because it's so fun to watch Rondo play, and they play like a true team. Plus Paul Pierce was a Kansas Jayhawk, and I'm from Missouri, enough said. But his 20,000th point was a cool moment even though I'm not his biggest fan. He could have easily left when things were down for the Celtics, but he stuck it out and is an all-time great for that franchise now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Remember when it was him and Antoine Walker and the C's were terrible? They've certainly gone in different directions since then: http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Former-Celtics-star-Antoine-Walker-is-broke-and-?urn=nba-198509 http://bankruptcy4austin.com/2010/05/29/attorney/lawyer/antoine-walker-files-for-bankruptcy-view-the-documents-here/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capelli King Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Walker was a pretty good player when they were together. I think Pierce did the right thing (obviously that can be easily said now) to stick with the Celtic. I think allot of the credit needs to go to their coach though, i think he does a fantastic job to get the most out of what they have, his team spirit is second to none and look how he turned around last years Celtics? Most people had them finished way before the playoffs started, they went to the finals and if not for a very good Lakers team they would have done it. I still think the Lakers are the team to beat this year and one thing is for certain i sure do not want the Heat to ever win the title as long as Kobe is alive. I think Lebron did the worse thing possible for his career. If he really wanted to be the "King" he would stay in his own castle and attract Wade over to Cleveland instead, they could make up the space for at least one of either Wade, Bosh or Stoudemire and the Cavs have a pretty decent nucleus around. So unless the Heat go on in the next 6-7 years and win at least 4-5 titles, this move was a bad one and some how i do not think they will win so many. Winning 1 or 2 titles as a Cavs player is worth way more than winning 5-6 "manufactured" titles with the Heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 You're forgetting the fact that no one wanted to actually go to Cleveland. Because IT'S CLEVELAND. I agree that being on a loaded team in Miami will hurt Lebron's legacy a bit but staying in Cleveland wasn't an option. Bosh had the chance to go..he refused. Wade wasn't going there. Amare said he wouldn't have gone. Big time free agents want to go to big markets, with big marketing possibilities, and big recreational possibilities. Cleveland offers none of that. The ONLY thing that lured players to Cleveland in recent times is Lebron and once he saw that wasn't going to be enough to lure any real star...he decided it was time to move on . And he was right. And based on early returns I'd be stunned if he doesn't get at least one ring. Soon. (also...i don't think that many people would say 1 title in Cleveland would be the same as 5-6 in Miami. That nuts) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capelli King Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <p>That is my point, bottom line Lebron ended up being like all the rest, just went where the money is, left behind him his own state, gave up on trying to make the Cavs a proper franchise and slotted a bunch of superstars together to make things easier. </p><p> </p><p> Winning titles when you have 3 of the 10 best players (and 2 of the top 5) on one team means little. Even if we take some of the great players of the past such as Barkley, Drexler or more recently Garnett, they gave a good try in their own teams to try to win things before trying moving to a "ready made" team, late in their career to win titles. In this case we have 3 players in their prime. </p><p> </p><p> Also i do not agree with what you said about Lebron not having the influence to bring stars to Cleveland, i am sure he could do that, in the end he simply "followed" someone elses plan, instead of creating his own. </p><p> </p><p> Good luck to him, hope he screws up</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genadi Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Capelli King" data-cite="Capelli King" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That is my point, bottom line Lebron ended up being like all the rest, just went where the money is, left behind him his own state, gave up on trying to make the Cavs a proper franchise and slotted a bunch of superstars together to make things easier. <p> </p><p> Winning titles when you have 3 of the 10 best players (and 2 of the top 5) on one team means little. Even if we take some of the great players of the past such as Barkley, Drexler or more recently Garnett, they gave a good try in their own teams to try to win things before trying moving to a "ready made" team, late in their career to win titles. In this case we have 3 players in their prime. </p><p> </p><p> Also i do not agree with what you said about Lebron not having the influence to bring stars to Cleveland, i am sure he could do that, in the end he simply "followed" someone elses plan, instead of creating his own. </p><p> </p><p> Good luck to him, hope he screws up</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I agree with this completely.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunGBD Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Capelli King" data-cite="Capelli King" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That is my point, bottom line Lebron ended up being like all the rest, just went where the money is, left behind him his own state, gave up on trying to make the Cavs a proper franchise and slotted a bunch of superstars together to make things easier. <p> </p><p> Winning titles when you have 3 of the 10 best players (and 2 of the top 5) on one team means little. Even if we take some of the great players of the past such as Barkley, Drexler or more recently Garnett, they gave a good try in their own teams to try to win things before trying moving to a "ready made" team, late in their career to win titles. In this case we have 3 players in their prime. </p><p> </p><p> Also i do not agree with what you said about Lebron not having the influence to bring stars to Cleveland, i am sure he could do that, in the end he simply "followed" someone elses plan, instead of creating his own. </p><p> </p><p> Good luck to him, hope he screws up</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I hate LBJ now, not gonna lie. What he did was wrong. but you got 2 facts wrong. </p><p> </p><p> 1) He did it for the money. Wrong, He took a pay cut. I wanna say 10 million, is it a lot when you think about it? No. But it a pay cut none the less</p><p> </p><p> 2) Bosh a top 10 player? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. No.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedpropaganda Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 Yeah Lebitch took a yearly pay cut but with everyone next year taking pay cuts - don't think that matters. Considering once Miami starts winning titles (and they will) being a winner will mean alot more to him and be worth more than just $$$ on paper in a contract. AND DO NOT FORGET... No state taxes in Florida which means his contract is worth more simply cause he doesn't lose it to the gov yearly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted November 5, 2010 Author Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Capelli King" data-cite="Capelli King" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That is my point, bottom line Lebron ended up being like all the rest, just went where the money is, left behind him his own state, gave up on trying to make the Cavs a proper franchise and slotted a bunch of superstars together to make things easier. <p> </p><p> Winning titles when you have 3 of the 10 best players (and 2 of the top 5) on one team means little. Even if we take some of the great players of the past such as Barkley, Drexler or more recently Garnett, they gave a good try in their own teams to try to win things before trying moving to a "ready made" team, late in their career to win titles. In this case we have 3 players in their prime. </p><p> </p><p> Also i do not agree with what you said about Lebron not having the influence to bring stars to Cleveland, i am sure he could do that, in the end he simply "followed" someone elses plan, instead of creating his own. </p><p> </p><p> Good luck to him, hope he screws up</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Okay i can agree with it that he took the easy way out and went to a place with other superstars to make getting the title a little easy for him, but he def. didn't go for the money. Point is no one could have offered him more money than the Cavs. Also he would have earned more money by not opting out of his contract this year and just going into next year as a free agent.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Capelli King" data-cite="Capelli King" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> Also i do not agree with what you said about Lebron not having the influence to bring stars to Cleveland, i am sure he could do that, in the end he simply "followed" someone elses plan, instead of creating his own. </p><p> </p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Well you're wrong. I could post a dozen of these. Bosh refused to go to Cleveland:</p><p> </p><p> <a href="http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67883/20100706/report_cavs_lebron_working_on_recruiting_bosh/" rel="external nofollow">http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67883/20100706/report_cavs_lebron_working_on_recruiting_bosh/</a></p><p> </p><p> The same rumours were out there about Boozer and Amare. No one was going to Cleveland if they had a choice. So what was he supposed to do? Stay there and lose year after year after year while Orlando and Miami and Boston got better? How many years did he "owe it" to Cleveland before he was allowed to make a decision about his own future?</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stennick Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <p>Exactly where does it state that you owe your home town/state anything in sports?</p><p> </p><p> Why are you indebted to that place just because thats where your parents raised you? </p><p> </p><p> I hate hate hate the "hometown kid" stuff in sports. Sports is about winning the championship plain and simple. He tried for years to win it there, no matter if it was him, them or just bad luck he coudln't do it. </p><p> </p><p> He gave them what six or seven years worth of his career? Just because he's from there and people loved him he has to stay? </p><p> </p><p> People act like he did some horrible act by leaving. Everyone can be on their high horse all they want but the fact is you try playing for your home town team for SEVEN years and never winning a championship. You try being the face of a franchise, the face of an entire city and have that placed on your shoulders night after night, year after year. </p><p> </p><p> After seven years of that if you were given a chance to go elsewhere to a place that didn't need you to be its savior, to a place that you weren't its only superstar, plus you're given a chance to win a championship? I'd take that deal in a heart beat.</p><p> </p><p> Lebron never said "I'm staying in Clelveland" not once did he say he was staying there, when his contract ran out people should have taken a clue that if he wanted to stay he would have re upped before letting that contract lapse. </p><p> </p><p> People can cry all they want about Lebron but the fact is he took LESS money to go win a championship. In an era where everyone cries that all athletes want is the money he took less money to go win a championship. </p><p> </p><p> This guy is not Michael Jordan, he's not Kareem, Magic or Bird. This guy is not capable of doing it on his own and I think thats been proven to this point. To sit here and slam the guy because he made a business move to leave his home town is just plan silly and sounds like a depressed teenage boy trying to lash out at his ex girlfriend because she went to an out of state university to better herself instead of sticking around at some run of the mill local college just so they could be together.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningHamster Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Exactly where does it state that you owe your home town/state anything in sports?<p> </p><p> Why are you indebted to that place just because thats where your parents raised you? </p><p> </p><p> I hate hate hate the "hometown kid" stuff in sports. Sports is about winning the championship plain and simple. He tried for years to win it there, no matter if it was him, them or just bad luck he coudln't do it. </p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I am the absolute opposite, I hate hate hate how modern sports are just a mish-mash of mercenaries from around the world who were temporarily convinced to wear the same colour jerseys for several million dollars.</p><p> </p><p> Not saying everyone has to play for the town they were born, but it would be nice if each team had a few local guys and there was some notion of loyalty and hometown pride. Not sure that has ever been a big factor in the NBA though to be honest.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BurningHamster" data-cite="BurningHamster" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I am the absolute opposite, I hate hate hate how modern sports are just a mish-mash of mercenaries from around the world who were temporarily convinced to wear the same colour jerseys for several million dollars.<p> </p><p> Not saying everyone has to play for the town they were born, but it would be nice if each team had a few local guys and there was some notion of loyalty and hometown pride. Not sure that has ever been a big factor in the NBA though to be honest.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I dare you to find me an example of a big time modern sport where that IS the case. Or even if it was the case EVER. </p><p> </p><p> I swear I have no idea what's up on the boards...it's like crotchety old man week. </p><p> </p><p> If you want local guys playing for their local team and showing local pride go watch high school.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smurphy1014 Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <p>Looks like Cavs fans have responded to LeBron <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F959ukD6nBc" rel="external nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F959ukD6nBc</a></p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattitudeV2 Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="smurphy1014" data-cite="smurphy1014" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Looks like Cavs fans have responded to LeBron <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /><p> </p><p> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F959ukD6nBc" rel="external nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F959ukD6nBc</a></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It's a good commercial fan for me a (Cleveland Sports Fan) but anyone else except Lebron fanboys wont care about it.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted November 5, 2010 Author Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="PeterHilton" data-cite="PeterHilton" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I dare you to find me an example of a big time modern sport where that IS the case. Or even if it was the case EVER. <p> </p><p> I swear I have no idea what's up on the boards...it's like crotchety old man week. </p><p> </p><p> <strong>If you want local guys playing for their local team and showing local pride go watch high school</strong>.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> teehee.... I agree with peter. Players don't have a choice where they are going to play coming out of college. By the time there contracts are up most of them have a home in their new area so why not stay. Players don't owe anyone anything (as odd as that is to hear from me). The teams aren't paying players after they retire in anyway shape or form. I agree that the players need to go out and find there money to support their families. Half of these guys end up broke anyways. Lebron went to Miami because he saw like most he wasn't going to win a title with the Cavs. It's not like Jordan where he played in a big market. He had a GM whose only claim to fame was Lebron. Besides that he was never able to draft anyone else. Lebron left, Boozer left, no one was going to stay.</p><p> </p><p> Now the past two years a big reason why no one came could be because of Lebron's contract and I will not agree or disagree with it. There are examples for both arguements (Trevor Ariza and Ron Artest last year saying he wouldn't tell them and Amare and Bosh saying they wont go.)</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slagaholic Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BurningHamster" data-cite="BurningHamster" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I am the absolute opposite, I hate hate hate how modern sports are just a mish-mash of mercenaries from around the world who were temporarily convinced to wear the same colour jerseys for several million dollars.<p> </p><p> Not saying everyone has to play for the town they were born, but it would be nice if each team had a few local guys and there was some notion of loyalty and hometown pride. Not sure that has ever been a big factor in the NBA though to be honest.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You mean as opposed to previous eras when ownership ran players like horses giving them a pathetic percentage of the money they generate and when they showed an inkling that they may be finished they either cut their pay or cut them?</p><p> </p><p> I'd rather have a bunch of well paid money generating mercenaries than poorly paid glorified middle class athletes who generate tons of money that go directly into the owners pockets.</p><p> </p><p> Loyalty and hometown pride in pro sports is dumb. The owners aren't loyal why should the players be loyal?</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Slagaholic" data-cite="Slagaholic" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> Loyalty and hometown pride in pro sports is dumb. The owners aren't loyal why should the players be loyal?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Yup</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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