GDS Top 50 of All Time

Johnny Fenoli · November 15, 2010

The GDS Top 50 Wrestlers of All Time

Here's how it works, you post your top 20 list of the greatest wrestlers of all time, in ORDER. Then, we tabulate the results, a 1 seed earns 20 points, a 20 seed earns 1 point.

Criteria:

This based purely on your opinion. But, if you want something to go off of here's some help.

Ring Skill: Pure talent in the ring.

· Microphone Skills: It’s incredibly important today, but always has been important.

· Titles Held: Major accomplishments in the ring.

· Longevity: You can’t be among the best if you didn’t have staying power.

· The Sniff Test: If you smell like a Hall of Famer, you are.

· Crowd Pop: The good ones could make them cheer or boo loudly.

· Influence: Just how much this person helped and/or changed the business.

I encourage everyone on the board to participate, it will make our list more accurate and make it more fun. DEBATE ON!!!

Hive · November 15, 2010

Well, it wasn't easy... and lists like these are, of course, always highly subjective...

My list may look pretty weird to some people, but I have only included wrestlers I have seen several matches with - excluding lots of old-timers as well as tons of Mexican and, especially, Japanese wrestlers that could potentially have been on the list. Furthermore, my #1 criteria for selecting the wrestlers for this list has been their overall appeal to me, both now and when I was a kid and watched wrestling every week. If I never liked a wrestler in any way, he's not on the list - no matter how popular and successful he might be (The Undertaker being and example, I just never ever liked his character). Also, the actions of Chris Benoit makes me unwilling to include him, even though I really really liked him once.

I have probably forgotten someone, but anyway... here goes:

1. Sting

Largely due to nostalgia from when I first started watching wrestling, Sting is #1. I was really into babyfaces at the time, and to me he was the ultimate babyface; the man who's nearly impossible to turn heel. He always connects with the audience and has a very likeable vibe. And his finishers are great. Contrary to most, I think, I liked him more with his earlier surfer-gimmick than the crow one, though.

2. Hulk Hogan

While I did eventually get bored and fed up with Hogan, his influence and appeal in my younger years is enough to warrant his place here. Biggest name in wrestling, ever.

3. The Rock

Probably the most entertaining wrestler ever, and simply brilliant at promos. Not bad in the ring either. Just too bad that he's one of the only big name wrestlers with even weaker finishers than Hogan...

4. Steve Austin

The man who made the attitude era. Was equally good both inside and outside of the ring, and he was amazing at making his finisher work for his image.

5. Bret Hart

One of the best technical wrestlers I have ever seen, and a great babyface. And the sharpshooter is always awesome.

6. Ric Flair

Hard to not include "the dirtiest player in the game" who is probably the best heel I have ever seen (back in his prime, that is).

7. Randy Savage

Extremely charismatic and good in the ring as well. Insanely weird promos, but effective. Was always interesting to behold.

8. Eddie Guerrero

His "cheat, steal and lie" gimmick was innovative and fun and very likeable. Add to that the fact that he could really go in the ring. Was not too fond of his finisher, though.

9. Chris Jericho

Had he been bigger, he would have been the perfect heel. He's probably the best guy at generating heat from the crowd these days, and never stops to amaze me neither in the ring or on the mic.

10. Shawn Michaels

Very agile and interesting performer, amazing how he kept being able to go at the highest level for so many years. And his sweet chin music always amazed me, seeming so damn real.

11. The Great Muta/Keiji Muto

Great in-ring wrestler who performed with an interesting "asial mystical" gimmick, good both as a face and as a heel.

12. Vader

In my opinion, the best "big man" in wrestling ever. He could go like no man I have ever seen besides him at that size. His Vader-bomb was devastating.

13. Diamond Dallas Page

The first man to use my favourite all-time finisher, the diamond cutter. Played well both as a heel and as a face and did good promos.

14. Kurt Angle

It's probably a tie between him and Bret Hart as the best technical wrestlers I have ever seen. Always gives his all in matches.

15. Ricky Steamboat

An amazing worker that was really ahead of his time. Classic matches with Flair and Savage.

16. Curt Hennig

His awesome technical skills worked so damn well with his "Mr. Perfect" gimmick, he should really have won more titles.

17. Randy Orton

This choice probably puzzles a lot of people... but I really like the guy. While not Steve Austin, he's as close as we'll get these days. Would have loved to see him in the attitude era. Also, he uses my favourite finisher.

18. Rey Mysterio

Probably the best high-flyer I have ever seen, back in his prime. Extremely agile and fast, always interesting.

19. Triple H

Say what you will about Triple H, he's a great heel. Not the best in the ring, but good enough to be entertaining.

20. Edge

My #20 could easily have been a number of people, it was very hard to choose. But Edge's mannerisms got him the spot.

Honourable mention of others who didn't make the final cut but were considered (in random order): Scott Hall, Kevin Nash, Davey Boy Smith, Rick Rude, Arn Anderson, Christian, Owen Hart, Samoa Joe, Jake Roberts

Now edited to be more presentable.

FlameSnoopy · November 15, 2010

My criteria is simply how much I like them. So here we go:

<ol style="list-style-type:decimal;"><li>Steve Austin

- He has been my favourite wrestler since.. since I started watching wrestling. </li><li>Mistico

- He manages to amaze me everytime with his smoothness and pure skill. Also, cool attires. </li><li>The Road Warriors

- I'll plug them in as a team, because they don't shine as inviduals at all. </li><li>Chris Benoit

- The guy did what he did. But he was the first wrestler I was a fan of, and one of the best wrestlers in the business' history. There won't be another wrestler like Benoit. </li><li>Eddie Guerrero

- Now it starts getting harder. The top three is the easiest, but I liked Eddie as well the first time I saw him. Excellent performer. </li><li>Mascarita Dorada

- Okay. Some of you may know this guy, some of you wont. He is a midget, who is extremely skilled, likable and has a shiny attire. </li><li>Ultimo Dragon

- Something about this guy. Maybe its the attire, maybe its the skill. Probably bit of both. </li><li>Shawn Michaels

- When I started watching wrestling (Summer 2005) I didn't really get excited by Shawn. But having watched him in his prime really made me like him. Alot. </li><li>Mick Foley

- And his many gimmicks. Amazing performer, and a non-generic brawler, with some of the better gimmicks and sensational entertainment abilities. </li><li>Owen Hart

- A very good heel, who would have fit to be a World Champion in the WWF for sure. </li><li>Rey Mysterio (Jr.)

- Again one of the "instant" hits, when talking about me being their fan. Very agile and fast, a perfect underdog. </li><li>Kurt Angle

- No need for an introduction. </li><li>The Rock

- Okay. One that I'd lie if I'd say I didn't like him. Unique microphone ability, and he always shined off flashiness and coolness. </li><li>Tajiri

- A Japanese dude. Very original and unique, likable antics and style. </li><li>KENTA

- One of the few Japanese wrestlers that have made me an instant fan. Manages to get through the "generic jap" -barrier with ease. </li><li>John Cena

- A very good performer, who is also an instant "cheer" -figure. Also, underrated wrestling ability. </li><li>Jushin Liger

- I'd lie if I'd say that I didn't like Liger when I first saw him. A fine performer, who seems to be very professional. </li><li>Umaga

- The most interesting monster ever. </li><li>Shark Boy

- He's a frickin shark. And awesome at that. </li><li>Bob Backlund

- The ultimate babyface closes the list. </li></ol>

--------------------------------------------------------------

Honorable mentions go to (in no order): RVD, British Bulldog, La Parka, Great Sasuke, Tiger Mask I & IV, Super Crazy, Ricky Steamboat (who would have likely been #21 or so), Taz, Ultramantis Black, The Hurricane, Mike Quackenbush, Mascarita Sagrada, Mitsuharu Misawa, Motor City Machine Guns, Hulk Hoganand El Hijo del Santo.

Self · November 15, 2010

Alrighty. Let's try this. First 5 are easy. Others are harder.

1. The Rock. Given what I think wrestling is, I thought The Rock was pretty damned perfect. Amazingly entertaining on the microphone. Fun athletic matches. He looked credible on top. A comparatively short run, but a fantastic one, and his continued relevance in the mainstream is a testament to how great he was/is. It's a shame wrestling couldn't keep him.

2. Steve Austin. Brought wrestling to another level.

3. Hulk Hogan. Ditto, only not as good in the ring.

4. Bret Hart. Not as big a star as the previous, but better in the ring, and a lot more important to me personally. He was one of the first wrestlers I latched on to. He defined to me what it was to be a hero.

5. Ric Flair. On top for oh-so-long.

6. Kurt Angle. Amazing in the ring, comes with a legitimacy few possess, and an entertaining character to boot. His lack of true megastardom is the only thing keeping him out of the top 5.

7. Rey Mysterio Jr. Incredibly important figure in wrestling history, helping usher in a whole host of smaller, faster guys.

8. Shawn Michaels. A fantastic in-ring performer.

9. Owen Hart. Much like his brother, Owen is higher on my list than he perhaps deserves to be. Owen Hart was my favourite wrestler growing up. As a boy living in my brother's shadow, I could relate to him in his rivalry with Bret. I loved him so much, I pretended in school that 'Owen' was my middle name. Wrote it on all my school books.

10. Jeff Hardy. I've always been a Hardy-mark, and watching Jeff win the World Title... I was so proud of him. An incredibly popular guy who I personally love and has succeeded often in spite of the industry.

11. Sting. I wasn't a WCW guy, but I was enthralled by his rafters stuff.

12. Andre The Giant

13. John Cena. Beloved by so many people. A true role model.

14. Rob Van Dam. One of the most unique performers I've ever seen. I loved ECW when I finally happened upon it in 2000, and RVD was the shining star. More than a 'wrestler', he's an 'attraction'.

15. Chris Jericho.

16. Mick Foley

17. Triple H

18. Randy Savage

19. Eddy Guerrero.

20. The Undertaker.

A very WWE-dominated list. Given my recent love for Indy and Japanese wrestling, I wish I could have added more of those guys. However, I'm not much of a historian. I've been watching that kinda stuff for like 3 months, and I don't think I've seen anything from before 2009 (and I'm okay with that). So my knowledge of Japan and Mexico in practically non-existant, and I find it hard to put anyone who never cracked WWE or WCW in a 'Top 20 of All Time'.

Honourary Mentions? I thought about putting more of my personal favourites in there, but I have an affinity for midcarders, and Matt Hardy, Lance Storm, BxB Hulk, Zack Ryder et al didn't seem to fit. Also, Goldberg came close.

EDIT: Forgot about Andre. Brock's off the list.

ChrisKid · November 15, 2010

This is purely based on my favourite wrestlers

1. Jeff Hardy

Always been a Hardy fan easy to get behind

2. AJ Styles

His old gimmick was good would be No1 but his present gimmick is <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/frown.png.e6b571745a30fe6a6f2e918994141a47.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />

3. The Miz

His charisma and vocal skills are AWESOME!

4. Randy Orton

Also could've been No1 a couple of years ago but his current promos are a little bland

5. Owen Hart

Never saw him wrestler but he has a great legacy and a special place in my list

6. Alex Shelley

The member of MCMG i follow more closely and prefer more to Sabin

7. Matt Hardy

Much like Jeff but lost my attention with no pushes and a handful of wins more recently

8. The Rock

Charismatic and funny what's not to like

9. CM Punk

Great Role model for being Straight Edge plus a good wrestler

10. Santino Marella

Funny so what if he's a jobber

11. Jonny Storm

Entertaining british wrestler, met him he's also a really nice guy

12. Chris Sabin

Great moves just needs a better haircut

13. Kurt Angle

Techinally a master with a good charecter sadly this slipped in TNA

14. Samoa Joe

Same with Angle

15. Eddy Guerrero

Entertaining as hell shame he had to pass

16. Marty Scurll

The British MCMG with Zack Sabre Jr. needs US recognition

17. William Regal

As one of the Englishmen in the business he is a true inspiration to me

18. Bryan Danielson

Technically sound with a gimmick to get behind, may need more skills to make him standout

19. British Bulldog

Good face/heel and has a good legacy in his son and also being one of the most famous British Wrestlers ever

20. Tajiri

Good wrestler most notebly for his WWE days with Regal he was pretty funny

Honourable mentions: DDP,Sting,The Nexus (as a group),RVD,Gregory Helms,Sheamus and Zack Ryder

juggaloninjalee · November 15, 2010

Top 5 go into detail...

1) Hulk Hogan - the man who got me into wrestling and was the top draw in wrestling from the 80s and thru the 90s. Had highly entertaining and memorable matches in the 80's, 90's, and in the 2000's.

2) Stone Cold Steve Austin - The face of the Attitude era. Probably my personal favorite wrestler based on how much I liked him. He had heel tendencies but people couldn't boo him. He had record breaking numbers for Wrestlemania and helped WWF become the #1 wrestling company again after WCW was kicking their butt in the ratings.

3) Andre the Giant - Without him being so dominant in the 80's and 70's there would have been no Hulk Hogan and wrestling may not have been what it is today. He makes my list because he was a main stream name. He made money all over the world in wrestling and entertainment.

4) Ric Flair - Only reason he isn't higher is because in my opinion he was not the main stream draw that the guys above him are. One of the most entertaining wrestlers ever. He always made the face look good before somehow managing to pull off the win. Held major titles in all the major US promotions and could have really done something more if he got that big match with Hogan in WWF in the 90s. That match would have been great with a proper build.

5) Shawn Michaels - He was a great tag team performer in the late 80's. In the 90's he really came into his own and showed how ruthless a heel could be by putting his partner thru a glass window. After his back injury he ended up training some of todays better wrestlers such as Daniel Bryan, Brian Kendrick, Paul London, and even the late Lance Cade. While none of these guys have become legends the jury is still out on Daniel Bryan, Kendrick, and London. Bryan could have a legendary career but is a long way away from that right now. HBK however came back in the 2000's and put over a lot of people and again put on some of the best matches ever.

6) Rock

7) Legion of Doom

8) Sting

9) Macho Man Randy Savage

10) Bret Hart

11) Jerry Lawler

12) Undertaker

13) Curt Hennig (Mr. Perfect)

14) Ricky Steamboat

15) Kurt Angle

16) Mick Foley

17) John Cena

18) Ultimo Dragon

19) Vader

20) The Outsiders Nash and Hall

10-20 was hard to decide. For me any of those could have been off the list and insert someone else that's great. If I knew more about wrestling outside the US I am sure I would have had more international wrestlers too.

Self · November 15, 2010

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="ChrisKid" data-cite="ChrisKid" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="29511" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>16. Marty Scurll The British MCMG with Zack Sabre Jr. needs US recognition</div></blockquote> Really? Scurll before Zack? I saw them wrestle on the pre-show at Dragon Gate UK, and Zack stood out to me a lot more. Not to say Scurll doesn't have his charms, he had a really fun match with Cyber Kong the following night. I'd put Zack ahead of him is all. Different strokes <img alt=":)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />

d_w_w · November 15, 2010

I'm not really sure what this is based on. A mix of "what I think about when I think about professional wrestling" and "how much I liked 'em, I guess". Definitely slanted toward folks that I've seen over time, with little to no historical representation.

1. Hulk Hogan: My childhood favorite. I fondly look back on my dad taking me to Lubbock to see Hogan versus the Big Boss Man. Less interested in Hogan over time, but for me, when I think about wrestling and wrestlers, I'll always think of Hulkamania first.

2. Dean Malenko: Odd choice, given the rest of my list. I loved Malenko during the WCW days. His matches Rey were fantastic. They flowed so well and I think this was the only period in my time as a wrestling fan where I cared more about things like "work rate" than character. Malenko's matches in WCW were undoubtedly responsible for me wrestling in high school and probably helps to explain why I'm all about MMA and, especially, BJJ and submission grappling today.

3. The Rock: Charisma, charisma, charisma. Probably the only guy that could make a come back and get me to consistently watch professional wrestling again.

4. Sting: Loved watching Sting on Saturday's on TBS (which would typically be followed up by a Braves game). Enjoyed the rafters stuff as well, even though I kind of felt like WCW dropped the ball on it.

5. Raven: Another of my WCW favorites. Cut great promos that didn't feel at all like the promos that everyone else was cutting.

6. Rob Van Dam: Watching Van Dam do a monkey flip from the top rope to someone (Bam Bam?) over the guardrail was fantastic. So many great moves that make so little sense.

7. Giant/Big Show: Think that big men bring something special to wrestling, at least when they are semi-mobile. Loved to rent old VHS and watch Andre and King Kong Bundy, but giving the nod to the Giant/Big Show as I've watched his performances in the context that they happened and find it hard to get invested in events that happened prior to my viewing.

8. Steve Austin: Cause he said so.

9. Jake "the Snake" Roberts: C'mon, the dude brought a damn python to ringside. Plus, I'm pretty sure that the DDT is the greatest move of all time.

10. Mr. Perfect: Loved his silly sports related promos and still have to resist the urge to spit gum out and swat it to the side during my daily life.

11. Undertaker: I find him somewhat drab now, but thought that he had just about the greatest character ever when I was younger.

12. Ric Flair: The quintessential heel for me. Often he annoyed me, but he always seemed to bring out the best of those around him and for that, he gets my nod.

13. Rey Mysterio Jr.: See Malenko above. Always rooted against Rey when he faced Malenko, but cheered for him otherwise.

14. Rick Rude: I hated Rick Rude so much in the late 80's. I remember watching some WWF program on Sunday morning with my dad and just fuming at that guy. It's only in recent years that I've come to understand that he was that good.

15. Chris Jerico: One of the few guys that can/could consistently make me laugh.

16. Kevin Nash: Similar to Jericho, except not as fun to watch wrestle.

17. Kurt Angle: I guess 15-17 were about being funny, because I thought that Angle was pretty much hilarious during his WWE run. Can't get very interested in him now though, for some reason.

18. The Great Muta: I'm not very knowledgeable about Japanese wrestling, but I remember being entertained by Muta in the WCW. Everyone knew that dude was going to spray mist in your face and those idiots still got misted. Made me lol.

19. Randy Savage: His Slim Jim commercials are embedded in our cultural memory. Pretty entertaining and Miss Elizabeth was one of the first women that I had a crush on.

20. Mick Foley: Great books, great spots in some of his matches, inspired my e-wrestling character to have multiple personality disorder.

PeterHilton · November 15, 2010

1. Hulk Hogan - if you asked a thousand people who weren't internet wrestling snobs to name a professional wrestler, at least 900 of them would come back with the Hulkster. He's become a part of pop culture. He's the Cocoa Cola of wrestling and that means a lot more than whether or not the guy could deliver a rolling enzuiguiri or whatever.

2. The Rock - a big star and a good athlete who put on underrated matches while becoming the biggest star in wrestling. The only reason he didn't affect the industry the way Hogan did is because he got TOO big and actually had to move on to a more lucrative career.

3. The Undertaker - never as big a star as the Austin/Rock/Hogan trio...but he's been consistently over for more than a decade and the fact that his character is still a draw after this amount of time is a testiment to his work as a performer in the ring and out. The fact that he's also incredibly unique in the sport is also a plu

4. Stone Cold - put on his best matches before he got really big, but he was the driving force behind the WWF's resurgence, his promos were insanely over, fans adored him, and for a short stretch he was the biggest act by FAR in wrestling. The fact that fame seemed so fleeting is what dropped him below top 3 imo

5. Andre the Giant- at one point one of the 2 or 3 most famous athletes on the planet. Him turning on Hogan is one of the most memorable moments of 80s wrestling. Might've even been more famous except he had already begun to deteriorate by the time the WM era began.

6. John Cena - he's been THE biggest star in wrestling for like the last 5 years and counting. He's really the only WWE star to make an impact on the crossover market in that time. Better than what people will say in the ring. If the WWE ever hits another "hot ere" it will be in part because Cena carried them when the industry was at it's lowest.

7. Ric Flair - on just what they can do as a performer, arguably the best ever. The only reason he's this low is because he was mainly a regional act during most of the 80s and Eric Bischoff kept him in the doghouse during the Monday Night Wars. So during the two hottest times in wrestling history, in his absolute prime, Ric was mainly a role-player.

8. Shawn Michaels - i considered him sort of an afterthought years back..but ever since he returned to the WWE post-back issue, he's cemented himself as one of the better in-ring performers ever as well as one of the more reliable workers as far as driving a storyline. I always thought the HBK schtick was silly for a guy his age, but outside of that the only fault i can pick at is his iffy drawing power

9. Randy Savage - i think people forget how popular he really was in the 80s. And how good a wrestler he was before he got all roided up in his WCW days. Because he's so linked to that Megapowers storyline, people seem to forget his epic feuds with Steamboat, Flair, UW, DDP, etc. Horribly underrated.

10. Kurt Angle - he is my personal fav of all time. He's a great actor: even as a heel there were noticeable differences between "Three I's" Kurt and "savage stalker" Kurt and "Sexy Kurt" and "MEM" Kurt...etc. He's brilliant in the ring, incredibly consistent, and knows how to step up his performances in the really big moments. If he never loses his mind and ends up in TNA, he'd be a major part of the WWE now and probably higher on the list.

I'm going to be brief about the rest of the list, but it's sad to think that a couple of guys (Hart, Eddie) are like Kurt in that they would've been much bigger and had more memorable careers if not for tragedies that cut their careers short

11.Triple H

12. Bret Hart

13. Chris Jericho

14. Sting

15. Eddie Guerrero

16. Terry Funk

17. Rick Steamboat

18.Vader

19. Mick Foley

20. The Road Warriors

wilts · November 15, 2010

1. Hulk Hogan

2. Shawn Michaels

3. John Cena

4. The Rock

5. Sting

6. Steve Austin

7. Mick Foley

8 Randy Savage

9. The Undertaker

10. Vince McMahon (controversial I know, but he has been involved in some of the most entertaining and anticipated feuds in recent history and matches against the likes of Austin, Hogan and even Shane were undoubtedly a draw.)

11. Triple H

12. Kurt Angle

13. Andre the Giant

14. Chris Jericho

15. Bret Hart

16. AJ Styles (would love to put him higher because he is apart from MCMG the wrestler I enjoy watching the most. Maybe in 5 years time he will be a lot higher, but he just hasn't proven that he can stand at the top yet...just my opinion)

17. Hall & Nash (Sorry but these 2 have to go together because without the other, I think neither would have had the impact that they did. Not saying that either guys role couldn't have been filled by someone else but the fact is it wasn't.)

18. Rick Riude

19. Rob Van Dam

20. Edge

Honourable mention to Andy Kaufman.

Also, noticeable by his absence is Ric Flair. As a manager I love the guy, he can (or at least could) go on the mic. But as a wrestler he bored me to tears...

FlameSnoopy · November 15, 2010

This is my opinion, and no offence to anyone, but I find this list worthless if we just go "1. Hogan, he was the biggest draw ever". I bet we can find relatively trustful information of who sold the most arenas, shirts and dvd's, and post it here. And everybody knows who are at the top, so it's not going to be the same. When as if you would make it by your personal opinion of wrestlers, it would make it far more interesting and surprising, rather than listing the obvious, biggest draws.

If we'll go this way, it will end up with Hogan, Austin & Rock in the top five. Just my two cents.

PeterHilton · November 15, 2010

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="FlameSnoopy" data-cite="FlameSnoopy" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="29511" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div> If we'll go this way, it will end up with Hogan, Austin & Rock in the top five. Just my two cents.</div></blockquote> And what would be wrong with that? Genoli didn't make any specific criteria. It's a top 50. If I go based off of "importance" or "drawing power" it's no less legitimate than someone who's just listing their personal favorites. Yes, the personal favorites deal is more surprising, but nobody said it HAD to be done that way. Just let things play out...nobody's way is more correct than anyone else'e...I'm certain there will be a wildcard in the top 10.

wilts · November 15, 2010

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="FlameSnoopy" data-cite="FlameSnoopy" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="29511" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>This is my opinion, and no offence to anyone, but I find this list worthless if we just go "1. Hogan, he was the biggest draw ever". I bet we can find relatively trustful information of who sold the most arenas, shirts and dvd's, and post it here. And everybody knows who are at the top, so it's not going to be the same. When as if you would make it by your personal opinion of wrestlers, it would make it far more interesting and surprising, rather than listing the obvious, biggest draws. If we'll go this way, it will end up with Hogan, Austin & Rock in the top five. Just my two cents.</div></blockquote> Not disagreeing with you flamey, just playing devils advocate, but if people put those 3 at the top of their lists then surely that is their prerogative, no? I for one didn't put Hogan at the top of my list because he was the biggest draw, but because he always entertained me, he was THE guy when I got into wrestling and I owned pretty much every bit of Hogan merchandise there was at the time.

FlameSnoopy · November 15, 2010

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="PeterHilton" data-cite="PeterHilton" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="29511" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>And what would be wrong with that? Genoli didn't make any specific criteria. It's a top 50. If I go based off of "importance" or "drawing power" it's no less legitimate than someone who's just listing their personal favorites. Yes, the personal favorites deal is more surprising, but nobody said it HAD to be done that way. Just let things play out...nobody's way is more correct than anyone else'e...I'm certain there will be a wildcard in the top 10.</div></blockquote> I just don't think it will be as much fun, and certainly not as interesting. I mean, what would be the reason to have 20 people to make a list that will definitely end up being the one list of the biggest draws? I'll aggravate it a bit: It's no fun, it's not interesting, it's a waste of time and it's not surprising. <img alt=":)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="wilts" data-cite="wilts" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="29511" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Not disagreeing with you flamey, just playing devils advocate, but if people put those 3 at the top of their lists then surely that is their prerogative, no? I for one didn't put Hogan at the top of my list because he was the biggest draw, but because he always entertained me, he was THE guy when I got into wrestling and I owned pretty much every bit of Hogan merchandise there was at the time.</div></blockquote> Very true, and I am glad everyone has a different criteria. I just don't see the interest in a list that will 100% surely be the same with every poster.

PeterHilton · November 15, 2010

But it won't be the same specifically because not everyone will use the same criteria.

FlameSnoopy · November 15, 2010

Exactly.

Mr_Tricky · November 15, 2010

Based purely on who entertains me the most:

1. Bret Hart

2. Steve Austin

3. The Rock

4. Kurt Angle

5. Ric Flair

6. Dean Malenko

7. Shawn Michaels

8. Mistico

9. Ricky Steamboat

10. Ultimo Dragon

11. The Undertaker

12. Eddie Guerrero

13. KENTA

14. Bryan Danielson

15. Randy Savage

16. The Great Muta

17. La Parka

18. Rey Mysterio Jr.

19. Jushin Liger

20. Goldust

Astil · November 15, 2010

Chris Jericho
The Rock
Shawn Micheals
Steve Austin
Hulk Hogan
Ric Flair
Undertaker
Andre the Giant
John Cena
Sting
Edge
Triple H
Ricky Steamboat
Kurt Angle
Kenta Kobashi
Eddie Guerrero
Jeff Hardy
Kane
Randy Orton
Vader

This may be a controversial list... NO Bret Hart, NO Owen Hart, NO Randy Savage

alden · November 15, 2010

I am going to go with a few diffrent things for my list i guess. First is drawing power *yes that is what wrestling is about today* second the "it" factor and a few on my list are going to just be men that i think are great talent but many might not agree with.

1) Undertaker: When you talk about men who once they hit the top stay there you can't mention taker. His gimmick will go down in history as one of the best of all times. He is a locker room leader and he is not afraid to put people over. He is and always will be in my mind the mold of what a great worker is.

2) Hogan: Ok yes, he was not a great talent when he was on top but he did change wrestling forever. I was honestly never a fan of hogan. His promo's were trash, he could not work and did not put people over alot of times. BUT and that is a big one.....hogan could sell. Look at most of his matches. Pre-hulk up time he sells everything like crazy.

3) Flair: The man was the whole package for me. He could work with almost anyone, he could talk and he had the "it" factor. He put people over alot and was willing to help build people. People would not have loved dusty or magnum or a ton of other people if they did not hate flair so much.

4) Sting: Sting was the number two man to me in wcw/nwa. Sting was loyal all the way to the end and in wrestling that is hard. He could put on a good match and he could work a mic. I know it is rare but i prefere the surfer dude compaired to the "dark" sting. I think once he joined the wolf pac is when i started not caring about him.

5) Antonio Inoki: Maybe the first on my list that are going to get a few eye brow raised. Inoki was a FANTASTIC worker. But he was an even better booker. NJPW might be more important in the wrestling world then the wwf at one time.

6) The Great Muta: Muta was the first wrestler to make my say wow that is something special. I had never seen a worker like muta when i was a kid. I can't tell you the first match i seen him in but to be honest i remember being young. It was in wcw and it was a fantastic match. I knew at that point i was hooked on wrestling. While he might not be huge in the united states or other parts of the world in japan he is a legend.

7) Andre the giant: The best big man of all times. He was a draw everywhere he want and was a great guy from what i understand. I hate stated in other threads he might be the best seller of all times.

8) Tiger mask: The man that in my opinion created the juniors style. So many men have said that tiger mask is the reason they do what they do. There are not many more influencial men in wrestling today. Again he might not be world famous but he is a true legend.

9) Shawn Michaels: He was a good worker. Not a great one but what he got over on his his pure charisma and pretty boy looks. He was never hogan huge or flair in the ring but he did everything good enough to become a mega star.

10) Steve Austin: I know alot are going to wonder why he is so low. It is simply a matter of how long he was really at the top. Like has been said it was only four or five years. He got over on his gimmick along in my opinion. Yes i do believe it was his gimmick and his feud with vince.

11) The midnight express: They are what a tag team should be. I was such a huge mark for the express *stan lane and bobby eaton by the way*.

12) The freebirds: The team everyone loved to hate. They brough the show to wrestling. Music video's, entrence music, flashy outfits. They changed wrestling and most people don't even know it.

13) Mick Foley: He might be a man who never drew a ton of money but he did do things that will never be forgotten. Foley had a passion for the business and will do anything to get over.

14) Bruiser Brody: What a talent he could have been. In his short time brody was a true legend and he changed what a "brawler" was.

15) The Rock: I have no idea what it is about the rock. He was in a time where there were so many great talkers. I don't know what it is about the rock that stood out to me. He wrestled for such a short time i can't put him higher up the list though.

16) Dusty rhodes

17) Jushin Thunder Lyger

18) John Cena

19) Somoa Joe *Shocker hu?* He could have been the future of the business

20) Triple H

Self · November 15, 2010

This may be a controversial list... NO Bret Hart, NO Owen Hart, NO Randy Savage

I wouldn't say leaving out Owen is controversial. He was talented, and I placed him highly because he was my favourite growing up, but he's far from a surefire Top 20 guy.

FlameSnoopy · November 15, 2010

This may be a controversial list... NO Bret Hart, NO Owen Hart, NO Randy Savage

I agree with Self. I doubt Bret & Savage would make it into my Top 50 or Top 100.

Stennick · November 15, 2010

1. Hulk Hogan, anyone that says Hulk Hogan isn't the biggest, most successful, most influential pro wrestler of all time is either too young to know any better or two an idiot.

2. The Rock, do you know why people mention Austin over The Rock? I don't. I was going to point out all the things that Austin didn't do better than the Rock but I'll do that when I get to him. The Rock had zero in ring experiance before what? 1996? Two years later he was World Champion and supposed to be the biggest heel in the company but he was getting as many cheers as Austin was. Three years later he main evented Wrestlemania 15, then 16, then 17, for all intent and purpose he may as well main evented 18. Every Wrestlemania The Rock was involved in outside of 19 and 20 (he was already in Hollywood making cameos in wrestling) he main evented. Who can say that? Who can say they main evented four Wrestlemania's in a row? Austin only main evented three Wrestlemania's period. I could go on and on but the bottom line is this. If you gave the fans a poll and said "only one of these guys can come back to wrestling" between Austin and The Rock I'd be shocked if the Rock didn't just win but won in a landslide. The guy was flat out the most entertaining pro wrestler ever.

3. John Cena, I'll wait while the internet loses its mind. Hulk Hogan had Ted Dibiase, Andre the Giant, Randy Savage, even Warrior later on. Point is Hogan was surrounded by guys that would make a first ballot hall of fame on any wrestling message board. The Rock and Steve Austin had guys like Triple H, Kurt Angle, even Chris Jericho, Mick Foley, The Undertaker, and many more guys. They had an even wider range of guys that would be anointed in any hall of fame. They had help with drawing. I'm not taking away from what they did but they did a lot of it with help. John Cena do you know who he's had? Batista, Randy Orton, Sheamus, Triple H (not good Triple H but Son in Law H), Bobby Lashley, Umaga. Sure he's had guys like Undertaker, Shawn Michaels and Triple H but nobody can say he's had these guys in their prime. Flat out what John does he has very little help with. He's surrounded by Cody Rhodes, Randy Orton and other guys that aren't jumping onto anyone's Hall of Fame ballot anytime soon. He's done what he has done with the lowest supporting cast of any of the three "generations" so far. For that alone I put what John has done higher than others.

4. Steve Austin, Austin won the championship at Wrestlemania 14 and raised hell all the way through Wrestlemania 15, shortly after that he got hurt and sat out for an entire year. He came back at Wrestlemania 17, his popularity had been passed by The Rock at that point and he was turned heel. He never truly got going again after that. Really Austin should be given praise for his ability to kick start the WWF's comeback but Shawn Michaels invented the attitude era with DX while Austin was feuding for the IC title. Steve Austin had a fantastic year and a half from March of 98 to November of 99 but beyond that his popularity didn't sustain itself in the same way others on this list did. I really think in later years Austin will slip down this list even more once everyone puts things in perspective.

5. Shawn Michaels, Shawn was never a proven draw and his attitude was spotty at best. He had fantastic matches but his near refusal to play a heel at all coming back really hurt his legacy. One truly great heel run would have been amazing to see. If he was willing to do the DX stuff then I see no reason why he wouldn't do some heel stuff with his religion. That being said Shawn Michaels invented the attitude era. Well really the nWo created it but none the less. Hall and Nash went to WCW and since nobody told them what to do they just start acting like they were acting backstage (douches). Shawn saw what they were doing and decided to do the exact same thing in the WWF. It was his actions in mid 1997 that created the attitude era. Who can forget him flying around the ring in his under wear or showing his bare ass. If it weren't for Shawn doing these things I'm not sure we ever get an attitude era. So really Shawn being a brat and thus creating the attitude era is really to me what puts him on the list. If it weren't for Austin's succesful year in 1998 I wouldn't put him on there either so if I'm putting Austin on here for a year's worth of accomplishments I should put Shawn on here for his 1997 alone. Oh yean and he single handedly re invented the Cage Match for the modern era. (Taker helped but without Shawn falling off the cage and flying around it doesn't work.)

The rest of my list is not going to get explanations.

6. Andre the Giant

7. Sting

8. Ric Flair

9. Randy Savage

10. Dusty Rhodes

11. Bobby Heenan

12. Roddy Piper

13. The Undertaker

14. Ultimate Warrior

15. Kurt Angle

16. Kevin Nash

17. Bret Hart

18. Honky Tonk Man

19. Diamond Dallas Page

20. Vader

brashleyholland · November 15, 2010

I wasn't going to have a go at this, as I haven't really been a 'wrestling fan' for about 10-12 years in terms of following everything that goes on. Then I saw ChrisKid's post and realised that he must be pretty young, as I don't even recognise some of the names on there! Made me think that unless you're hell bent on being a 'snob' or 'know it all' your list is more likely than not to be the guys you watched growing up, and those that have endured since that time.

So here's my list, the best as I saw them when I stopped watching wrestling at about 14-16, and those I've 'kept an eye on' since

1-Hulk Hogan - I was a Hulkamaniac as a kid, I remember the whole 'Come Back Hulk' thing when he was destroyed by someone (I want to say Earthquake?) genuinely upsetting me. At the other end of the spectrum, his match against the Rock at Wrestlemania is, IMO, the best wrestling match of all time.

2-The Undertaker - This guy has been around forever. Scarred me as a kid, great gimmick, great wrestler, still going after all these years and still as popular (or nearly) as he ever was.

3-Stone Cold - Just trumps the Rock for me on my list. I guess I've always gone for the anti-hero over the hero. The Mania match with Brett was one of my all time favs, and the first time I really remember seeing that much blood in wrestling. That image was definitely a keeper. Great finisher, great promo's, and the feud with Vince was awesome.

4-Brett Hart - He was my hero after Hogan as a kid. Awesome good guy, even better bad guy. I particularly remember his bout in London with British Bulldog, the Hart Foundation with Jim Neidhart and the Hart Foundation stable with Owen, Neidhart, Bulldog and Pillman.

5-Sting - Every time I try to write The Rock on this list, another name pops into my head. Sting for me was always the 'cool' character in wrestling. WCW used to be on in the UK on Saturday afternoons in the early 90's, and I always stayed in to see the surfer Sting do his thang. Lost track for a while then got back involved for the Crow years (The Crow was my favourite movie at the time), which I thought was one of the coolest things in wrestling. I doubt many people could remain one of the top guys in a company without actually wresting for a year.

6-The Rock - I probably missed most of the Rock's best stuff, but being in that one match with Hogan at Mania, seeing how he went from good guy to bad guy as soon as the bell rang...that left an impression as to just how good he was. Great song with Wyclef Jean too!

7-Ultimate Warrior - Another one from my young youth...I dunno, I think it must have been a facepaint thing, because I thought he looked cool as hell at the time :-p

8-Ken Shamrock - I discovered MMA (well, NHB as it was known back then) in the mid-90's. I'd heard of the UFC by 96, but it was only seeing Ken Shamrock show up in the WWF that forced me to check it out. I now make a living in the MMA business, so Ken has some fond memories attached for me. Loved his run in the WWF.

9-LOD/Demolition - I'm grouping these guys together purely because many years were spent by myself and my buddies acting out tag-team bouts between the two teams. Getting to the last level of the WWF arcade game with Demolition was a childhood goal that I've yet to accomplish.

10-Jake The Snake - At the time, I didn't really appreciate Jake as much as I should have. Loved the snake, obviously. Whenever I look back at old wrestling though, I realise just how good this dude was. The fact that he was such a clearly disturbed and haunted human being only makes him more interesting to me.

11-The Rockers - Now, don't get me wrong, I loved HBK on his own, but again, some of the fondest memories of my youth involved 'being' Marty Jannety while my mate was Shawn when we played wrestling. I realise that Shawn did so much more on his own, and I loved his ladder match with Razor, but personally, I have better memories of The Rockers.

12-Scott Hall/Razor Ramon - The bad guy was, for me, one of the best of all time. Loved the look, the attitude and his work in the ring. I never really got on board with Nash, so I've not lumped Hall in with The Outsiders. I think this is the one guy in wrestling that would have seriously benefited from not being a drug and drink-addled mess.

13-Macho Man - OOOOOOOOOHHHHHH YEEEEAAAAHH!!! Nuff. Said.

14-Mick Foley - Hated Dude Love. Loved everything else. I never saw the old ECW stuff at the time, but I remember him in WCW and especially WWF. Cactus Jack was always my favourite character, and even in the post-Jacked, tamed down years - I love getting a glimpse of the wild-eyed psycho. When he punched Bubba The Love Sponge and exited the building with a 'Bang Bang!' I saw it again and it reminded me how much I enjoyed Foley.

15-Golddust - Just a brilliant character, and a guy who has endured for so long. I remember his debut (I think on RAW), the gold tinted 'movie camera' entrance, being surprised at the wig and the general weirdness that followed. The later comedy years were also, for want of a better term, solid gold.

16-William Regal - Yeah, I'm a Brit and I'm biassed, but as someone who was never really one of the 'workrate above all' gang, Regal was a wrestler who made me appreciate what he did in the ring. A great talker/actor outside it as well...never understood why he didn't get a chance at the top, even if only for a short time.

17-HHH - Enjoyed 'Hunter Hearst Helmsley' the blue blood character back in the day. For me, one of the best 'bad guys' in wrestling, all said and done. His match with the Undertaker at WM 17 was off the hook, one of my favourites, even though I wasn't really following wrestling at the time.

18-Chris Jericho - My main memories of Jericho were from his WCW days, feuding with Mysterio, Juventud Gurrerra and Dean Malenko as a heel. One of my favourite guys to watch in the ring, and great on the mic.

19-Raven - IMO, the best 'dark' character outside of the Undertaker in wrestling. Loved his 'Raven's Rules' bouts in WCW, loved his mic work and he was pretty good in the ring to boot.

20-Ric Flair - I just didn't see enough of Flair to realise how good he was. Even in his old age, I still can't think of a bad match I've seen him on off the top of my head and the 'Nature Boy' character (although how much of it is a character I'm not sure) is just incredible. I'll probably remember him more for his charisma than his wrestling. Even of late in TNA he's dropped a one-liner that has made me think "Yeah, you're the MAN"

SPECIAL MENTION - Bobby Hennan - I don't know (or care, to be honest) if this list is limited to guys in the ring or not, but I hear that he was a wrestler at some point, so nerr :-p Obviously he's on my list for being one of the best and sharpest guys behind the mic, ever.

TheKenwyne · November 15, 2010

This is only from matches I have watched/stories I have followed. Clearly we have to moderate it somewhere - if we only went my hearsay where have such legends as Lou Thesz, Bruno Sammartino and Antonio Inoki got to on these here lists?

The following is based on whether I like them and THEN ability etc.. I have to like them (or have liked them) at least a little bit before I even consider the other category

1. Ric Flair - Partly cos I cried a little in his match vs. Michaels at WMXIV. Yeah, I'm a wuss. But if a man can move me at his age, I can only wonder at what he managed in his prime. (Yes, I have since looked up his matches vs. Steamboat, please don't suggest this now.)

2. Undertaker - A major player in the industry for so long. You may argue backstage politics have effected his rise, but you can't deny the popularity he has achieved.

3. John Cena - Undisputed MVP of the noughties. Anyone who disagrees is a tool - look at his merch numbers over the past five years - anyone who sells that much must have an incredible following.

4. Shawn Michaels - Another long time and very succesful superstarm Michaels is undoubtedly talented in the ring. I have already mentioned my tears during his match vs. Flair a few years back ('I love you'... THUNK) but ever since I first saw the guy wrestle I made a connection. Yeah, I'm biased and probably very wrong with most of this list, but I liked him, I connected with him, and therefore I rate him.

5. Chris Jericho - Probably bias again here cos I love a good heel promo artist, and Jericho's got it down to an art. I just enjoy so much about his current character prior to him dissapearing on tour - ****y, intelligent, weasely, but undeniably talented, he's definetly the heir to Ric Flair's mantle as the best heel on the scene in my eyes.

6. Eddie Guerrero - Memory probably makes me glos over ol' Latino Heat as better than he was, and I only saw a few of his matches. Maybe it was because I was so young, but I damn near worshiped this guy. Probably helped he had that cool car thing in his entrance. 'Can you feel the heat?' :D

7. Rob Van Dam - Another guy I just connected him. He'd be higher up this list if it wasn't for his mediocre TNA run.

8. Kurt Angle - So versatile, so talented, so with TNA and therefore down here as opposed to up there.

9. Christian - Yeah, I'm a peep. Get over it. Loved what I saw of his team with Edge (who's on lower down) but Christian was always the guy I connected with better. Plus I find his promo work much more entertaining than Edge's rather dull delivery.

10. CM Punk - One of the truly great modern talents. Excellent on the mic as a face and a heel and solid in ring. In 5 years time he'll be right at the top of my list if he carries on like he is at the mo (pre hip injury)

11. William Regal - Possibly the best pure wrestler in the E today. Can tell a great story in ring, and a fellow countryman to boot. No world title means no further up list.

12. Chris Benoit - Another personal favourite. Wonderfully talented in ring and very scary for a man of his size. Pity it ended the way it did.

13. Edge - See Christian. Enjoying his current run though. SPEAR!

14. The Miz - I'm a mark for good heel mic work. Miz is superduper on the mic. Hence his position here. In a few years he may be higher for me.

15. Rey Mysterio Jr. - The best (read only) modern luchador on the scene. Really enjoyed his run to the gold in 2006(?)

16. MCMG - They wouldn't be on this list on their own but their matches as a pair is some of the best tag team stuff I've seen (yes, I wasn't into wrestling in the days of the great late 90s/early 00s WWF tag teams.)

17. Mr. Anderson/Kennedy - The only guy I like more in TNA than WWE. Such a great gimmick, and such a talented guy. Pity his injuries have held him back.

18. Bryan Danielson/Daniel Bryan/American Dragon - In a few years he will be near the top, I expect. A Hall of Famer in the making - brilliant in ring and underrated on the mic.

19. Beer Money - See MCMG

20. AJ Styles - His in ring work is genius, his promo stuff's come on in leaps and bounds. Pity he's held back by a company who stupidly promote old, past it, drugged up looneys over it's own brilliant home grown talent.

Honourable mentions: Wade Barret (not established enough. Really considered him though). Randy Orton (hate his guts, not gonna lie. Plus he's just so stale. Gah.) Jeff Hardy, Big Show, Mick Foley, Kaval/Low Ki. Lots of others but those were the guys I really considered.

Pampero Firpo · November 15, 2010

1. Ric Flair

2. Hulk Hogan

3. Andre the Giant

4. The Rock

5. Steve Austin

6. Shawn Michaels

7. Rick Rude

8. Jake Roberts

9. Randy Savage

10. The Undertaker

11. Sting

12. Vader

13. Bret Hart

14. Mick Foley

15. Triple H

16. Raven

17. Kurt Angle

18. John Cena

19. Roddy Piper

20. Pampero Firpo

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