Product Creation Thread

[Skywalker1976]

Maybe we can use this thread to discuss how to set up certain production styles and discuss production settings, as I believe quite a few like to start with their own company or create one later in the game.

 

I will start then

 

Maybe we can also keep a certain format to make it easier:

 

Company Description: I want to bring back South Championship Classic Wrestling, which was closed in I believe 2003. My background story will be that while keeping traditional aspects of classic Wrestling and still being appealing to the old school "Southern" wrestling fan the product also needs to be appealing to younger fans and be a bit modern aka more successful. Tough to describe but maybe a modern Smokey Mountain Wrestling (which btw. I think SCCW is a mock off), with old school angles but no penalties for good wrestling matches. Maybe be also early ECW or NWA 88-89 with match based performances a la Flair but also some old school angles etc.

 

Angles: Yes, but maximum 20-25% and mainly brawls, skits and interviews

 

Managers: Yes, occasionally

 

Woman Division: No

 

Hardcore: Maybe a Cage match here and there and 1-2 times but no barbed wire matches etc.

 

Match Style: That is where I have my most difficulties, as I would like to have brawl matches but also technical matches. Maybe some highflyers in tag team action but other than that nothing crazy.

 

Popularity and Skill based

 

Thanks!

[Teh_Showtime]

actually most of the dead companies have profiles in the database, including SCCW but here goes my own attempt:

 

Key Feature: Traditional

Medium: Mainstream, Realism

Low: Modern, Hardcore, Comedy

Very Low: Cult, Risque

 

Not their exact product as specified by the editor but I think it would work.

[Remianen]

pffft, try coming up with an actually HARD request.

 

What you describe is essentially QAW's default product. Perhaps take the lucha libre down to Medium and raise the Realism to Medium but essentially, that's it.

 

Cage matches are not hardcore, they're brawl based (which should be a strength of the promotion, no?). Hardcore is only worth putting in your product if you intend to feature those kinds of matches. Otherwise, you pay for a product feature that you don't use. Literally. Hardcore reduces your promotion's attractiveness to sponsors (making you earn less sponsorship money).

 

Copy QAW's product, make the suggested changes, change 'women's wrestling' to 'none' and the match ratio to 80% and have at it.

 

EDIT: By the way, your product has almost nothing to do with what types of angles you can run. So specifying that you want to run 'skits, brawls, interviews' isn't necessary. Your match ratio determines your fans' angle tolerance, nothing else. The main exception I can think of is T&A and Sex Appeal based angles. But you wouldn't run any of those anyway since they're so severely capped and penalized (in every product) that they're not worth running.

[Skywalker1976]

actually most of the dead companies have profiles in the database, including SCCW but here goes my own attempt:

 

Key Feature: Traditional

Medium: Mainstream, Realism

Low: Modern, Hardcore, Comedy

Very Low: Cult, Risque

 

Not their exact product as specified by the editor but I think it would work.

 

First of all thanks! My story will be that the new owners have learned from the past mistakes and want to bring back SCCW a bit more modern and appealing for modern fans, while still having the traditional aspects!

[Dartell]

pffft, try coming up with an actually HARD request.

 

 

 

EDIT: By the way, your product has almost nothing to do with what types of angles you can run. So specifying that you want to run 'skits, brawls, interviews' isn't necessary. Your match ratio determines your fans' angle tolerance, nothing else. The main exception I can think of is T&A and Sex Appeal based angles. But you wouldn't run any of those anyway since they're so severely capped and penalized (in every product) that they're not worth running.

 

What kind of penalties for T&A? Setting it to high has drawbacks?

[Remianen]

What kind of penalties for T&A? Setting it to high has drawbacks?

 

Not for the T&A part itself but angles with ANYONE rated on Sex Appeal are both capped (can't hit 100) AND penalized, solely due to having a sex appeal rated person in the angle. Without exception, it is always better to have a diva rated on something else (often entertainment, otherwise overness) other than sex appeal. So while high T&A increases your fans' tolerance for those types of angles, it doesn't make up for the fact that those angles are sledgehammered in the face, penalty wise.

 

If you want to test it, fire up a SWF game. Have Hannah Potter shoot t-shirts and see what it rates. On the exact same show, have her featured in a hype video (by herself). Read the dirt sheet notes for each segment. It's even worse with Emma Chase (due to her high overness and entertainment skills - you don't need her sex appeal, it's counter productive).

[LordJaguar]

any ideas on a XDW product?

[Dartell]

Ok, never noticed because I use rock bottom created companies. Thanks!

[D-Lyrium]

Not for the T&A part itself but angles with ANYONE rated on Sex Appeal are both capped (can't hit 100) AND penalized, solely due to having a sex appeal rated person in the angle. Without exception, it is always better to have a diva rated on something else (often entertainment, otherwise overness) other than sex appeal. So while high T&A increases your fans' tolerance for those types of angles, it doesn't make up for the fact that those angles are sledgehammered in the face, penalty wise.

 

If you want to test it, fire up a SWF game. Have Hannah Potter shoot t-shirts and see what it rates. On the exact same show, have her featured in a hype video (by herself). Read the dirt sheet notes for each segment. It's even worse with Emma Chase (due to her high overness and entertainment skills - you don't need her sex appeal, it's counter productive).

 

This is true for girls who have entertainment skills or overness in the first place, sure.

 

Yes, Hannah Potter or Emma Chase will do much better if she actually DOES something in an angle than if she doesn't. Common sense could probably tell you that much. It's more more interesting when popular girls with mic skills do something other than stand around looking pretty.

 

That's not the point of Sex Appeal angles though. Sex Appeal alone never truly got anyone over. Not truly over (in the real world. It did in TEW2008 ). To elaborate on the points you were trying to make, a Hannah Potter or Emma Chase Sex Appeal angle will get you around a C or a C+, which is enough to eventually make them a midcarder knocking on the door of upper midcarder in the SWF.

 

A Hannah Potter or Emma Chase promo involving nobody else at all will get you around a C (Potter) or B- (Chase). Wow, shocker, right? Entertaining girls you've heard of get better ratings for appearing in angles where they do stuff that's entertaining. In fact, contrary to your point, Potter actually got the exact same for her promo as for her sex appeal angle.

 

Now take Kristen Pearce. She gets an E for the promo, because nobody knows who she is. That's very slightly better than her starting popularity and has just killed the crowd and (albeit very slightly) harmed your overall grade. But put her in a Sex Appeal angle, C-! Tadaa, she gains popularity, is well within the average range of midcard promo grades, and all it cost was her dignity. I should also point out that while Emma and Hannah have A* sex appeal, poor Kristen "only" has B+. Just imagine what those sex appeal angles could've done for Emma before she was famous.

 

You throw around phrases like "Sex Appeal angles are useless" (actual quote from elsewhere), but you forget the important caveat. Let's rewrite that quote: "Sex appeal angles are useless if the people involved are already over". And even then, as Hannah Potter proved quite nicely in this (albeit one-card-only) test, not entirely.

 

Sex Appeal angles work well 'up to a point'. Then you have to rely on actual skill. Think of them like comedy gimmicks; they get a worker over pretty well up until they hit the midcard, then they stall. They are not, by any means, useless.

 

It's also worth pointing out something else you got wrong (because it doesn't happen often ), you're NOT penalised for being rated on sex appeal if the number of roles NOT rated on sex appeal outweight the number that are. For example, a guy cutting a promo (entertainment) on another guy (overness) with his sexy valet doing her thang (sex appeal) is not penalised for the sex appeal role at all.

[Skywalker1976]

Which value determines if fans would accept an occasional count out or DQ finish?

[D-Lyrium]

Which value determines if fans would accept an occasional count out or DQ finish?

 

Modern, Realism, Hyper Realism and Pure. Those are the "performance" product aspects.

 

To have screwy finishes, you need to be above medium in more of the 'popularity' product aspects than performance ones. So if you have medium Modern, you'll need medium Traditional and Mainstream to cancel it out. If you have medium Modern AND Realism, you'll need medium Traditional, Mainstream AND Cult, etc, etc.

[Irish Wolf]

Which value determines if fans would accept an occasional count out or DQ finish?

 

Usually the higher you put up the product parts that give you performance over pop (realism, Hyperealism, Modern and Pure) the more likely fans are going to want to see clean finishes.

 

Edit D-L beat me too it.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

Wow, Remi just got served some TEW knowledge? And it's with regards to female workers? Never thought I'd see the day.

 

And thanks for the tip on having less people rated on Sex Appeal than not in an angle to avoid the penalty... That just gave me a few ideas for angles to run in my Hardcore/Risque key-featured promotion!

[D-Lyrium]

Wow, Remi just got served some TEW knowledge? And it's with regards to female workers? Never thought I'd see the day.

 

And thanks for the tip on having less people rated on Sex Appeal than not in an angle to avoid the penalty... That just gave me a few ideas for angles to run in my Hardcore/Risque key-featured promotion!

 

Oh dear, I can see bikini contests with five hosts in your future.

[Derek B]

To put D-Koiso's excellent knowledge into a different point of view... at first glance you might like the look of a girl (high grades for sex appeal angles relative to what you know about them) but it's only once you truly get to know them that you can love them for who they are (limit on how far looks can get you). Using overness as analogous to a strength of relationship, looks might make a great first impression but there's only so far it can go and you've gotta have something else to back it up if you want to get all the way to the top.

[Remianen]

You got me. I will admit that when I tested, the environment was a lot different and I didn't check for ratio. The angles I used (diva magazine promotion and bikini contest) wouldn't have shown me anything. Just ran a movie parody skit (2 ENT, 1 SA) and didn't get the penalty note.

 

But let me define 'useless' in (meta) gamer terms: If an option is so situational that the situations in which it is the superior option occur less often than Halley's Comet passing Earth, that option is useless. Now, that option might be useful for someone not looking for the best solution to a particular problem or quandary. If I said 'a spatula is useless for felling trees', that too would be technically incorrect but most people would agree (since the choice of superior implements for accomplishing the task is so large).

 

Now to see if sex appeal is any good for skill/overness improvement in as linear a fashion as rating the diva on entertainment (or acting or microphone or even straight overness).

[Derek B]

Remi, your middle paragraph doesn't make sense. Sex Appeal based angles probably only fail to help the top few women in the SWF (Hannah, Dawn, Jessie, Emma) and the unattractive women (Gorgon, L-W-A, probably some others)... for pretty much every other female in the entire Cornellverse, sex appeal angles will get you better grades than rating them on anything else. That's not useless by any stretch of the imagination, that's about a 98% success rate!

[D-Lyrium]

You got me. I will admit that when I tested, the environment was a lot different and I didn't check for ratio. The angles I used (diva magazine promotion and bikini contest) wouldn't have shown me anything. Just ran a movie parody skit (2 ENT, 1 SA) and didn't get the penalty note.

 

But let me define 'useless' in (meta) gamer terms: If an option is so situational that the situations in which it is the superior option occur less often than Halley's Comet passing Earth, that option is useless. Now, that option might be useful for someone not looking for the best solution to a particular problem or quandary. If I said 'a spatula is useless for felling trees', that too would be technically incorrect but most people would agree (since the choice of superior implements for accomplishing the task is so large).

 

Now to see if sex appeal is any good for skill/overness improvement in as linear a fashion as rating the diva on entertainment (or acting or microphone or even straight overness).

 

How is it inferior?

 

Put Kristen Pearce in an entertainment-based angle, you get an E.

Put Kristen Pearce in a sex appeal-based angle, you get a C-.

 

The last time I went to school, C- was better than E. It certainly was the last time I played TEW.

 

Sure, she doesn't gain any skills, but that's what she's been in development for. Her skills are pretty good, it's her overness that's the problem, and you don't get that with E-rated angles every week.

[LucianCarter]

How is it inferior?

 

Put Kristen Pearce in an entertainment-based angle, you get an E.

Put Kristen Pearce in a sex appeal-based angle, you get a C-.

 

The last time I went to school, C- was better than E. It certainly was the last time I played TEW.

 

Sure, she doesn't gain any skills, but that's what she's been in development for. Her skills are pretty good, it's her overness that's the problem, and you don't get that with E-rated angles every week.

 

If you hold a bikini contest with one person rated on Entertainment and the rest on Sex Appeal those rated on Sex Appeal can improve their Entertainment skills.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

Oh dear, I can see bikini contests with five hosts in your future.

 

I'm thinking 3-person bikini contest, third contestant turns out to be a man with a "gay" gimmick, "Sandman" style worker comes out and hits him with a weapon... various branchoffs from there.

[AlaricRose]

Here's what I have for nearly every "home brew" company that I've created. Please note that I pretty much only create them in my real life home region, the Northwest USA, specifically Washington.

 

Company name: Depends on settings.

Style Name: Seattle Underground.

Key Features: Traditional, Mainstream, Cult, Modern.

Heavy: Daredevil.

All other set to Low.

Women's Wrestling: Division.

T&A Level: Low

Face/Heel Divide: None. The crowd chooses who they boo and who they cheer.

Pushes are determined by a wrestler's overall skill.

[Jaded]

But let me define 'useless' in (meta) gamer terms: If an option is so situational that the situations in which it is the superior option occur less often than Halley's Comet passing Earth, that option is useless.

 

Remi, I just booked an event with EWA. A bikini contest got me a score of 57. My next highest angle scored 45. That's hardly useless, surely?

[3rdStringPG]

Not for the T&A part itself but angles with ANYONE rated on Sex Appeal are both capped (can't hit 100) AND penalized, solely due to having a sex appeal rated person in the angle. Without exception, it is always better to have a diva rated on something else (often entertainment, otherwise overness) other than sex appeal. So while high T&A increases your fans' tolerance for those types of angles, it doesn't make up for the fact that those angles are sledgehammered in the face, penalty wise.

 

If you want to test it, fire up a SWF game. Have Hannah Potter shoot t-shirts and see what it rates. On the exact same show, have her featured in a hype video (by herself). Read the dirt sheet notes for each segment. It's even worse with Emma Chase (due to her high overness and entertainment skills - you don't need her sex appeal, it's counter productive).

 

Sort-of tried that in TEW 2010 with BJ O'Neill (who doesn't have much sex appeal compared to Hannah and Emma) and I got a C+ for the t-shirt shooting angle. But she never did better than D+, I believe, when hyping American Machine.

 

I'm thinking 3-person bikini contest, third contestant turns out to be a man with a "gay" gimmick, "Sandman" style worker comes out and hits him with a weapon... various branchoffs from there.

 

Or a male wrestler with a comedy gimmick...like Santino Marella pretending to be "Santina."

[EuchreJack]

I've found that some product mixes are actually toxic. For instance, high values in realism and any of the entertainment products leads to the conflicting "Fans want to see everyone in a proper gimmick, but fans hate gimmicks" scenario. How does the game even deal with that? Does such a promotion mix just guarantee penalties?

[Jaded]

I've found that some product mixes are actually toxic. For instance, high values in realism and any of the entertainment products leads to the conflicting "Fans want to see everyone in a proper gimmick, but fans hate gimmicks" scenario. How does the game even deal with that? Does such a promotion mix just guarantee penalties?

 

From what I recall, you'll get penalties, but they won't be particularly bad ones. It represents the fact that you'll have a mixed crowd - fans who are there for the entertainment will like gimmicks and find guys without them boring, fans who are there for the realism will hate the gimmicks and prefer the non-gimmicky guys.