The All Elite Wrestling Discussion Thread

[Makhai]

Match card
AEW Championship: Jon Moxley (c) vs. CM Punk (Punk gets outside help from Hangman no MJF anywhere on the show)
Bryan Danielson vs. Chris Jericho (Claudio turns on Danielson)
Interim AEW Women's Championship: Toni Storm vs. Jamie Hayter vs. Hikaru Shida vs. Britt Baker. (Could go a lot of ways, but with TK he tends to go the most chalk with interm belts)
AEW Tag Team Championships: Swerve in my Glory (c) vs. The Acclaimed. (Ass Bois run in)
AEW World Trios Championship: Kenny Omega and The Young Bucks vs. Adam Page and The Dark Order. (Clean as a whistle, no outside interference)
Ladder Match for AEW Championship shot: Claudio Castagnoli vs. Rey Fenix vs. Rush vs. Dante Martin vs. Andrade El Idolo vs. Penta vs. Wheeler Yuta vs. a mystery entrant. (David Otunga rides his She-Hulk fame into AEW and captures the brass ring)
TBS Championship: Jade Cargill (c) vs. Athena. (why is this on the show?)
Wardlow and FTR vs. Jay Lethal, Chris Sabin and Alex Shelley. (Why is this on the show, Why is FTR in a match I don't wanna watch?)
Christian Cage vs. Jungle Boy. (Tell me again this hasn't been a dud? It's 3rd off the bottom on an 11 match card)
Ricky Starks vs. Powerhouse Hobbs. (why is this on the show?)
House of Black vs. Darby Allin, Sting and Miro. (Gotta try and keep them happy)

Preshow card
AEW All Atlantic Championship: Pac (c) vs. Kip Sabian. (Why does this belt exist?)
Eddie Kingston vs. Tomohiro Ishii. Double DQ/CO (Why the hell is this not on the show?)
FTW Championship: Hook (c) vs. Angelo Parker. (Why is this not on Dark?)
Mixed tag team match: Tay Melo and Sammy Guevara vs. Ruby Soho and Ortiz. (Why is this on the show?)

Edited September 4, 2022 by Makhai

[CGN91]

Mox
Danielson
Storm
Swerve In Our Glory
Page & Dark Oder
Andrade (or the sexy pick as a random entry Kota Ibushi lol)
Jade
Wardlow & FTR
Jungle Boy
Starks
HoB

PAC
Eddie
Hook
Sammy & Tay
 

[Dalton]

Punk
Danielson (Dynamite is in Garcia's hometown next week and he's going to get a monster reaction. He has to turn face)
Baker (short run before losing to Storm, methinks)
SIOG (bold prediction for the Acclaimed Kam!)
Elite (another interesting one, I doubt this is just a clean win)
Claudio (by default mostly, who else will face Punk/Mox? Andrade maybe) Unless the Joker is ANOTHER debut)
Jade
FTWardlow
JACK PERRY (but the feud continues)
Stroke Daddy (incoming title run for the Strokester)
Sting's Squadron
PAC
Kingston
HOOOOOOK (I think the following is likely: HOOK wins here, then beats Big Magic on Dynamite. Jericho joins 2.0 in beatdown, Starks makes save. That's how we pivot to the Starks vs. Jericho feud that was hinted at this week)
Sammy & Tay
 

Edited September 4, 2022 by Dalton

[The Blonde Bomber]

Match card
AEW Championship: Jon Moxley (c) vs. CM Punk(Punk turns heel, love his face run but AEW needs a top heel)
Bryan Danielson vs. Chris Jericho (He better win cause I don’t want to see past his prime Jericho beat him again. Plus I want DANIELSON and PUNK!!)
AEW Tag Team Championships: Swerve in my Glory (c) vs. The Acclaimed. (It’s time Acclaimed is hot af, I feel like the Gunn Club will get involved.)
AEW World Trios Championship: Kenny Omega and The Young Bucks vs. Adam Page and The Dark Order. (These titles were made so the Bucks and Kenny could have. Belt lol.)
Ladder Match for AEW Championship shot: Claudio Castagnoli vs. Rey Fenix vs. Rush vs. Dante Martin vs. Andrade El Idolo vs. Penta vs. Wheeler Yuta vs. a mystery entrant.(only person I wanna see win. Please stop the mystery entrants. You’re prostituting them.)
TBS Championship: Jade Cargill (c) vs. Athena.
Wardlow and FTR vs. Jay Lethal, Chris Sabin and Alex Shelley. (Wardlow was so over after MJF… FTR has been number one ranked team for months, do the rankings even matter?)
Christian Cage vs. Jungle Boy. (Luchasarus heel turn, it’s late and weird but that’s what I think will happen. Plus Christian is the top heel right now imo)
Ricky Starks vs. Powerhouse Hobbs.(sympathetic baby face loss, Hobbs looks dominant)
House of Black vs. Darby Allin, Sting and Miro. (Make fans happy open)

Preshow card
AEW All Atlantic Championship: Pac (c) vs. Kip Sabian. (Why does this title even exist?)
Eddie Kingston vs. Tomohiro Ishii. (A new Japan legen ain’t beating Kingston)
FTW Championship: Hook (c) vs. Angelo Parker. (Parker is a tag team wrestler)
Mixed tag team match: Tay Melo and Sammy Guervara vs. Ruby Soho and Ortiz.

[Makhai]

2 hours ago, The Blonde Bomber said:

Match card
AEW Championship: Jon Moxley (c) vs. CM Punk(Punk turns heel, love his face run but AEW needs a top heel)
Bryan Danielson vs. Chris Jericho (He better win cause I don’t want to see past his prime Jericho beat him again. Plus I want DANIELSON and PUNK!!)
AEW Tag Team Championships: Swerve in my Glory (c) vs. The Acclaimed. (It’s time Acclaimed is hot af, I feel like the Gunn Club will get involved.)
AEW World Trios Championship: Kenny Omega and The Young Bucks vs. Adam Page and The Dark Order. (These titles were made so the Bucks and Kenny could have. Belt lol.)
Ladder Match for AEW Championship shot: Claudio Castagnoli vs. Rey Fenix vs. Rush vs. Dante Martin vs. Andrade El Idolo vs. Penta vs. Wheeler Yuta vs. a mystery entrant.(only person I wanna see win. Please stop the mystery entrants. You’re prostituting them.)
TBS Championship: Jade Cargill (c) vs. Athena.
Wardlow and FTR vs. Jay Lethal, Chris Sabin and Alex Shelley. (Wardlow was so over after MJF… FTR has been number one ranked team for months, do the rankings even matter?)
Christian Cage vs. Jungle Boy. (Luchasarus heel turn, it’s late and weird but that’s what I think will happen. Plus Christian is the top heel right now imo)
Ricky Starks vs. Powerhouse Hobbs.(sympathetic baby face loss, Hobbs looks dominant)
House of Black vs. Darby Allin, Sting and Miro. (Make fans happy open)

Preshow card
AEW All Atlantic Championship: Pac (c) vs. Kip Sabian. (Why does this title even exist?)
Eddie Kingston vs. Tomohiro Ishii. (A new Japan legen ain’t beating Kingston)
FTW Championship: Hook (c) vs. Angelo Parker. (Parker is a tag team wrestler)
Mixed tag team match: Tay Melo and Sammy Guervara vs. Ruby Soho and Ortiz.

Tell me you use light mode, without telling me you use light mode. 

[Makhai]

TK: We need to bring MJF back, without bringing MJF back. 

Jim Ross: How much money can I spend on the Stones?

TK: All of it....

Pretty sure that's Daniels doing his best MJF. But I could be wrong.  

[Makhai]

3 hours ago, Makhai said:

TK: We need to bring MJF back, without bringing MJF back. 

Jim Ross: How much money can I spend on the Stones?

TK: All of it....

Pretty sure that's Daniels doing his best MJF. But I could be wrong.  

The weird bait and switch makes a lot more sense now. 

Good PPV overall, 5 hrs was absolutely unnecessary. Who had The Acclaimed vs. Swerve and Lee for match of the night? I think it's time to sunset Jericho from the ME. 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Makhai

[Matt_Black]

Some... questionable booking choices, but the PPV was saved by that ending. How HOT was the Chicago crowd for that reveal? Who woulda thunk it?

[Makhai]

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1566651044087611396/pu/vid/720x1280/MSyTti8jj_BRVQgR.mp4?tag=12

This is just a taste of the greatest burial fest I've ever seen in my entire life. Seek out the presser in full. Not just Punk either, everybody pretty much poured gas on the floor and had matches for teeth. 

Better than the PPV. 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Makhai

[The Blonde Bomber]

27 minutes ago, James The Animator said:

Well, it’s funny, but I also find it pretty sad. Punk was one of my first favorite wrestlers when I was a kid, and he inspired me to live the straight edge lifestyle. So seeing him embarrass his company and rip on people like Adam Page, who have genuinely kept their heads down and helped the company this whole time, strongly disappoints me.

If TK is a competent boss, he’ll strip Punk immediately and send him home until his contract runs out. That would send the locker room a strong message that he’s willing to stand up for himself and his company. Otherwise, TK will be remembered as Dixie with a fatter wallet.

I have the complete opposite opinion than you. Punk inspired me as well and I see this as a complete work in the sense of calling out Page. But even if it wasn’t I still don’t have a big problem with it considering how Page acted in their feud.

[Mootinie]

Tony Khan said that the buy rate for All Out 2022 will be in the Double or Nothing region, which did 155,000 buys. All Out 2021 did 205,000 buys. At this time last year, they were doing 0.45's and 0.50's for Dynamite. Now they're doing 0.35's.

However you slice it, this is it a work, is it a shoot era of AEW is not conducive to generating good business. I sincerely hope his blaming of WWE's "counter-programming" is just an elegant spin and not an opinion that he genuinely holds.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Mootinie

[milamber]

- Ruby & Ortiz vs Tay & Sammy - Fun backstage skit to start. Ortiz ring gear lol. - *** 3/4

- Cool Hand Ang vs HOOK (c) - Action Bronson living up to his name. *** 1/4

- Sabian vs PAC (c) - Kip's new character is interesting. OC/PAC hype. - *** 3/4

- Ishii vs Kingston - **** 1/2

- Casino Ladder Match - Sloppy match overshadowed by the Joker. Rolling Stones! - *** 1/2

- Cowboy Order vs The Elite - Surprised this went on so early. - **** 3/4

- Athena vs Jade (c) - She-Hulk! They worked hard but it felt rushed. Bad result. - *** 1/2

- Lethal & MCMG vs Wardlow & FTR - Dax's daughter! Joe! Sign MCMG for ROH. - ****

- Hobbs vs Ricky Longbois - Right result but too short. - *** 1/4

- Acclaimed vs Swerve in Our Glory (c) - MOTN. Crowd treated the Champs like heels. Injury worked me at first. Best Acclaimed match ever. - **** 3/4

- Shida vs Storm vs Hayter vs DMD - Britt screwing over Jamie was perfect. - **** 1/4

- Christian vs Jack Perry - Right result but too short. Not surprised Luchasaurus turned - *** 1/4

- Danielson vs Jericho - Garcia not happy about Jericho cheating. - **** 1/4

- Miro, Darby & Sting vs House of Black - Cool HoB intro. Sting mist was cool. If Malakai is on sabbatical HoB should enter the tag division. - ****

- Punk vs Mox (c) - Crimson mask! MJF! The TK contract offer recording was genius. - **** 1/2

 

Strong pre-show. Main card was pretty good but went a bit long. Hobbs and Christian squashes could have been moved to Dynamite. A lot of the booking didn't go the way I expected but some of the feuds are going to continue at Grand Slam & Full Gear. Jade retaining was bad, though. Wouldn't put in my Top 5 PPVs.

[The Swanton825]

1 hour ago, Mootinie said:

Tony Khan said that the buy rate for All Out 2022 will be in the Double or Nothing region, which did 155,000 buys. All Out 2021 did 205,000 buys. At this time last year, they were doing 0.45's and 0.50's for Dynamite. Now they're doing 0.35's.

However you slice it, this is it a work, is it a shoot era of AEW is not conducive to generating good business. I sincerely hope his blaming of WWE's "counter-programming" is just an elegant spin and not an opinion that he genuinely holds.

I don't know why bookers keep trying this strategy. Worked shoots function on the law of diminishing returns. Not to mention it's frustrating watching something and having to question whether or not you'll see a conclusion to this story or if this time someone stormed out for real. Imagine watching a TV show where the actor's real life contract dispute played out in the middle of a normal episode. It'd kill your suspension of disbelief.

[Blodyxe]

Punk: "Shares a bank account with his mother, it tells you all you need to know about him..."



Tony: *Wincing in pain, thinking about a bank account he is sharing with his father*

 

[Makhai]

2 hours ago, Mootinie said:

Tony Khan said that the buy rate for All Out 2022 will be in the Double or Nothing region, which did 155,000 buys. All Out 2021 did 205,000 buys. At this time last year, they were doing 0.45's and 0.50's for Dynamite. Now they're doing 0.35's.

However you slice it, this is it a work, is it a shoot era of AEW is not conducive to generating good business. I sincerely hope his blaming of WWE's "counter-programming" is just an elegant spin and not an opinion that he genuinely holds.

It's important to remember that cable TV this summer has had a massive exodus, and the majority of that is with the younger demo. WWE's audience is much, much older. So cord cutting is going to hit them much less hard. This is one of the reasons I feel that AEW is in danger. It is also losing a lot of its luster with the younger crowd because they are moving away from Hangman and the Elite, and their push for workers' rights, unions and the such, and towards anti-union, independent contractor-WWE guys, who appeal to the older WWE audience and don't want to rock the boat on changing the model that they are benefiting from. 

When I say that AEW are in a rough spot, I feel that way because I don't see a landing spot for them on streaming, yet, and they don't have the built in brand cache the WWE have to get a big deal with one of the prime carriers. There's a real threat to wrestling again, it's a very cyclical business. Cable is dying faster than anyone anticipated, and I don't know if a 10-year plan where your revenue coming from TV is very wise anymore. 

[Makhai]

2 hours ago, The Swanton825 said:

I don't know why bookers keep trying this strategy. Worked shoots function on the law of diminishing returns. Not to mention it's frustrating watching something and having to question whether or not you'll see a conclusion to this story or if this time someone stormed out for real. Imagine watching a TV show where the actor's real life contract dispute played out in the middle of a normal episode. It'd kill your suspension of disbelief.

I very much don't think any of this is a work, or a worked shoot. This is the real thing. Battlelines were publically drawn last night, and that wasn't about business. That was a Punk boilover, that he has been saving up since May, and if you looked around the room last night. It's very clear that the era of "All Friends Wrestling" is long over.

Toni Storm buried Thunder and outright implied that the injury is fake to get out of dropping the belt. Swerve bristled at what he took as disrespect from the crowd. Nobody from the Elite got to speak either. Not even The Bucks and Omega, who won the belts they made for themselves tonight. Very telling as to where Tony is on all of this. And what that likely means going forward for the EVPs. That presser is probably the biggest news moment in AEW history. Where the fault lines are and how the earth will shift in the next 3-5 years for the company. 

You go back and you re-watch that infamous promo Hangman cut and the line "I love this place, this is my home. And for the first time in my life, I'm not defending the title, I'm defending All-Elite Wrestling FROM you."

Seems rather eye-opening now. Cody might be owed a massive apology. He might have been absolutely right when he texted Big Dave "It's time to leave the territory." 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Makhai

[The Swanton825]

52 minutes ago, Makhai said:

I very much don't think any of this is a work, or a worked shoot. This is the real thing. Battlelines were publically drawn last night, and that wasn't about business. That was a Punk boilover, that he has been saving up since May, and if you looked around the room last night. It's very clear that the era of "All Friends Wrestling" is long over.

Toni Storm buried Thunder and outright implied that the injury is fake to get out of dropping the belt. Swerve bristled at what he took as disrespect from the crowd. Nobody from the Elite got to speak either. Not even The Bucks and Omega, who won the belts they made for themselves tonight. Very telling as to where Tony is on all of this. And what that likely means going forward for the EVPs. That presser is probably the biggest news moment in AEW history. Where the fault lines are and how the earth will shift in the next 3-5 years for the company. 

To clarify, I was talking about the "Is it a work, is it a shoot?" era moot referred to. Where Tony, Omega and the Bucks seemed to encourage everyone to air their problems publicly in the interest of ratings. That press conference was absolutely a shoot, proof Tony has lost all control over his employees and the natural end point to running your promotion like this. I may have never achieved a thing in my attempt at wrestling, but I learned very quickly that pro wrestlers are by-and-large gossip hounds and drama queens who have to be reined in by management. Seriously, a wrestling locker room is the living embodiment of Bowling for Soup's High School Never Ends.

[Dalton]

Sucks that a solid-to-good PPV immediately got overshadowed by childish BS

[The Blonde Bomber]

Was glad to hear someone call out the BS of the Elite.

Edited September 5, 2022 by The Blonde Bomber

[Makhai]

37 minutes ago, The Blonde Bomber said:

Was glad to hear someone call out the BS of the kids in AEW.

I still find the whole thing very bizarre because I don't understand this 10 year bad blood Punk has with Colt Cabana stemming from a misunderstanding over who was paying for lawyers in a BS lawsuit from WWE that never had a hope in hell of going anyway than it did. 

Punk was always gonna get that money back, so who had to pay what for who and how, seems absolutely silly to me because, frankly, it's just easier for Punk to cover everything and then be reimbursed by WWE, eventually. 

I also do not understand how him being broke enough to need a joint account from his mother helps his case much here. If he's got no money, then why are you asking him to cover $800/hr lawyers, Phil? How is that anything but cruel? How does that make you look anything but petty? Especially when your boss is a trust fund baby. Sitting right beside you. 

I understand everything else, the heat with the EVPs for standing with their friend, the heat with Hangman, all of that. Entirely on his side in that whole barrel of chuckleheads. But the Cabana thing doesn't completely add up with me. And he keeps coming back to it. 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Makhai

[The Blonde Bomber]

1 hour ago, Makhai said:

I still find the whole thing very bizarre because I don't understand this 10 year bad blood Punk has with Colt Cabana stemming from a misunderstanding over who was paying for lawyers in a BS lawsuit from WWE that never had a hope in hell of going anyway than it did. 

Punk was always gonna get that money back, so who had to pay what for who and how, seems absolutely silly to me because, frankly, it's just easier for Punk to cover everything and then be reimbursed by WWE, eventually. 

I also do not understand how him being broke enough to need a joint account from his mother helps his case much here. If he's got no money, then why are you asking him to cover $800/hr lawyers, Phil? How is that anything but cruel? How does that make you look anything but petty? Especially when your boss is a trust fund baby. Sitting right beside you. 

I understand everything else, the heat with the EVPs for standing with their friend, the heat with Hangman, all of that. Entirely on his side in that whole barrel of chuckleheads. But the Cabana thing doesn't completely add up with me. And he keeps coming back to it. 

I feel like the story goes deeper as there were more severe wounds in the friendship than just this one occurrence. It’s the straw that broke the camels back.

[Makhai]

7 hours ago, The Swanton825 said:

I don't know why bookers keep trying this strategy. Worked shoots function on the law of diminishing returns. Not to mention it's frustrating watching something and having to question whether or not you'll see a conclusion to this story or if this time someone stormed out for real. Imagine watching a TV show where the actor's real life contract dispute played out in the middle of a normal episode. It'd kill your suspension of disbelief.

Wrestling isn't an episodic TV show.

It's Sports. It always has been, and it always will be. And in sports contract disputes, suspensions, front office decisions, etc. are value adds, not value subtracts. Look at the pop MJF got. Do you honestly think that goofy mask was the reason? 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Makhai

[BrokenCycle]

1 hour ago, Makhai said:

I still find the whole thing very bizarre because I don't understand this 10 year bad blood Punk has with Colt Cabana stemming from a misunderstanding over who was paying for lawyers in a BS lawsuit from WWE that never had a hope in hell of going anyway than it did.

You do not personally know these people. 😐

[Makhai]

5 minutes ago, BrokenCycle said:

You do not personally know these people. 😐

Nor do I want to. 

https://www.f4wonline.com/news/aew/cm-punk-ace-steel-fight-with-young-bucks-kenny-omega-after-aew-all-out

[The Swanton825]

2 hours ago, Makhai said:

Wrestling isn't an episodic TV show.

It's Sports. It always has been, and it always will be. And in sports contract disputes, suspensions, front office decisions, etc. are value adds, not value subtracts. Look at the pop MJF got. Do you honestly think that goofy mask was the reason? 

Note that I said "plays out in the middle of a normal episode". As in, the actual story is interrupted to do this bit to "create controversy". MJF's dispute and return was the story, same as the Summer of Punk except not half as rushed.

And wrestling is absolutely serialized entertainment in the guise of a sport. If it wasn't, then kayfabe and storylines wouldn't matter at all and every promotion would resemble UWFi and Shooto.