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Mootinie

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    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    It's difficult to do that in that you have to keep Becky and Sasha locked away in development for far too long. Bringing them up together was the right move in that they got the NXT booking right and managed to get Charlotte and Becky out at the perfect time. Sasha obviously stuck around to do the Bayley matches and, if Becky was still in NXT now, can you do those matches? What does Becky do in NXT if she's not fighting for the title?

     

    You have to move them to the main roster when they're ready, not when the creative is ready. Otherwise you've got the Tyler Breeze situation in that he's stuck around way, way too long and now he's stagnant and probably very frustrated at having to put people over. And rightfully so, it stinks. He's ready, move him up whilst the act will still be hot for god's sake.

     

    Hype videos and vignettes are also very passé. I can understand it in NXT but considering some of the audience will have seen Sasha in NXT already, having videos to hype her debut is a cheap cop-out. Get her in the ring. We all know she's sitting around backstage, we've seen her on NXT, there's no reason she shouldn't be out there working a match. And thanks to the "Diva's Revolution", that's exactly what she's doing right now.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    I don't think they had too much choice though. They obviously wanted to bring in all three at the same time, not just Charlotte. You can't bring them in as individual singles wrestlers at the same time because then you get the same situation they had when they bought up Rusev, Bo Dallas and Adam Rose at the same time. You have to get these characters familiar with the audience and give them a reason to actually care about them. All three were given a winning streak (because god knows that's the best way to get people over! :rolleyes:). Inevitably, Dallas and Rose had to fall by the wayside because there's only so much spotlight to share and they were putting their eggs in the Rusev basket.

     

    The stables storyline with the Diva's allowed them to make Charlotte, Becky and Sasha instantly relevant, which was the operative goal in my opinion. The only alternative would have been to spread out the call-ups, but then you risk having Sasha or Becky in development for at least six more months and both are very clearly ready for the main roster.

     

    I don't think the story, nor the matches, have been great and it's a shame the perception hasn't changed but I think, long-term, this will be a good thing for the division. You can't just fire all the old diva's and bring in new ones. There has to be a steady transition from old to new and I think they're doing the best they can to make that a reality.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    It's very difficult to undo those years of bad service though (see: TNA's X-Division and NJPW's Tag Division). They've refocused on the in-ring stuff and given the women longer matches, which was what people asked for, but it's obvious that the perception hasn't changed one iota.

     

    You guys mentioned Chyna and AJ Lee, who, alongside Lita, Sable and Trish Stratus are the five most popular female competitors the WWE has ever had in my opinion. Am I wrong in saying that all of them got over because they were involved in a major storyline with the males? Obviously you can't do that for every female, so, what is the solution? All I'm saying is that people don't seem to care one way or the other and that's been the case for about 15 years now.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    They have to be given incentive to take it seriously. That's like saying that Kevin Owens could never get over on the main roster because the fans are conditioned to Cena and Orton. If it was booked well and had real storylines and people believed in it, it would be over

     

    It has nothing to do with fans not buying into women on the main roster, because they don't react to anything when it's booked as bad as the girls have been. Let alone being booked terribly and irrelevant for 20 years. You have to do more than just tell the audience that something is important if you want them to take it seriously

     

    What? How the hell are the fans conditioned to Cena and Orton? Sorry for being blunt but that made absolutely no sense to me and I'm curious as to what compelled you to write that.

     

    And it has everything to do with fans not buying into women. Booking hardly necessitates anything. Bryan was held down and got those insane reactions. Ambrose still, on occasion, gets the pop of the night and look at how badly he's booked. Reigns, the same. Bloody Dolph Ziggler has just had one of the worst feuds of the year with Rusev but look at his pop on the MSG show!

     

    If fans care for you, if they want to see you succeed, they will cheer you no matter what. They just don't care about Charlotte. They don't care about Paige. They don't care about Nikki. If the fans cared, if they truly cared about women's wrestling, they would pop for somebody like Paige irregardless of how badly she was being booked just like they do for everybody else they love. But they don't.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    The thing is, Sasha vs. Bayley can only ever happen in NXT because crowds on main roster shows just refuse to take women's wrestling that seriously. It's not the failure of the Diva's Revolution or the booking and what not, it's just a totally different wrestling climate altogether. One where fans turn up to see Brock Lesnar and not Sasha Banks.

     

    I thought the main event was good though. A bit sloppy and a bit overbooked, but the story more than covered it. ****1/4 on that.

     

    I loved Rhyno & Corbin vs. Gable & Jordan. That was a real sleeper-hit of a match, loved the back and forth and only one rest hold all match! Fantastic finishing sequence. How far improved is Baron Corbin all of a sudden? He was great all night long! **** on that match and I'm at around *** on everything else. All in all, I thought it was a good show.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    I personally feel it was below average, but okay...

     

    All that money and they are still capable of putting on a below average show, hahaha. How is that even possible? Just, yikes. 2.33 is just the tip of the iceberg.

     

    Edit: Alright that was a crap response. I'm just grumpy because I stayed up until the early hours to watch this show and didn't enjoy it nearly half as much as the Beast In The East special they ran. I still maintain that it wasn't a house show though, this was a televised network special and I was overly optimistic in my assumption that maybe they wouldn't run the same old crap and would freshen things up a little. They didn't. Shame!

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    Well, last night's show sucked. I get that it was a glorified house show, but oh boy was that a poor show. Let's list the things that made no sense (warning: could be here a while)

     

    • Sheamus delivering a Brogue Kick to Rusev. Why? Is this even gonna go anywhere?
    • Everything about the Stardust vs. Neville rivalry - well, I call it a rivalry, it's not is it? It's a series of non-descript matches.
    • Paige still teaming with Charlotte & Becky.
    • Alicia Fox still having a job. Alicia Fox being in Team Bella. Just, Alicia Fox.
    • The fact that somebody got paid to put together that Six Diva's Tag Team match. Just bear that in mind, Dean Malenko or somebody got paid actual money to put that together.
    • Charlotte & Becky acting like heels for the finish to that match. Why are all WWE faces such bad people?
    • Kevin Owens and Chris Jericho getting just eight minutes.
    • Chris Jericho being protected in 2015.
    • Big Show being perceived as a threat to Brock Lesnar despite coming out on the losing end of a feud with The Ryback and The Miz just a couple of months ago.
    • The WWE World Heavyweight Champion fighting for the WWE United States Title... and losing... several times...
    • Rollins not just climbing down the cage. So what if Kane's music has sounded, drop down and win the match you dolt. Who books this and thinks it's logical?
    • Sheamus not even attempting to cash in after Kane had laid Rollins out.
    • Basically everything about Rollins' booking.
    • Everything about this show.

    The Video Game Thread

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    Fifa 2016 should be called Fifa 15: Reskinned. I have noticed absolutely no changes, right down to the servers going down within an hour of getting Fifa (and that was 8 hours ago and they're still an unstable mess 7 minutes is the longest I've stayed on without a disconnect). Career mode is exactly the same, with the added bonus of training... which consists of skill games... oooooh. Even most of the free transfers are the same! The transfer system is the same, in other words, rubbish and unrealistic.

     

    The jump between Professional and World Class is as always, ridiculous. Professional is too easy, whilst World Class has me in "WTF" mode with decisions and mistakes by AI players on my team.

     

    There are NO new game modes, just the same tired old s*** they rolled out last year. Oh sorry... there's the much anticipated Womens Tournaments, because that was what every Fifa fan was screaming out for when it came to additions. Now I can give randomly generated free kicks away with boobs.

     

    The only other thing is Ultimate Team draft(?) I'd give my thoughts on it, except as stated above, I've not been able to get on to Ultimate Team because of the 8 hours the servers have been playing up.

     

    I'm sure there will be those fanboys who get a little hurt by my negative opinion towards the game, but look at it with an open mind because you can't tell me that there is a major difference in gameplay - not enough to charge £50 for anyway.

     

    Oh there is a positive however, I get to play as NEC in Holland again now they are back in the Eredivisie so that boosts my score rating for it.

     

    Day 1 Score: 3/10

    FIFA 15 was pretty horrendous too. An awful tackling system and an equally hot-cold passing system made it such a frustrating game to try and play seriously. Yeah I'm not blowing £50 on the new one, no thank you.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    Well for starters she's been employed since 2013 and has even skipped shows she was set to work and presumably improve on.

     

    Just because she wants to take wrestling seriously years later after already being handed PPV matches people work a decade for, on top of her being completely inept in the ring, on top of HHH trying to brand NXT as "developmental my ass" you can't use the developmental argument for Eva Marie.

     

    She's not Dana Brooke who only started wrestling matches in 2015 and is full of potential while being far ahead of Eva, who is lagging behind people who started wrestling 6 months ago. When you have people like Sasha Banks, Sami Zayn, Kevin Owens, Neville, etc just stored away in "developmental" for a very long time there becomes an expectation from the fans. When you tell them it's not developmental no matter how much of that is hype, people will see it as something else. You can't say this is its own brand or promotion and then expect people to accept people who clearly aren't up to par and have been portrayed for years as someone who didn't care to be.

     

    Well, Eva Marie has wrestled just 60 matches since her debut in August 2013. Dana Brooke, by comparison, has already wrestled 68 and she debuted a whole year later. It's hard to get better at wrestling, especially in front of a live audience, if you aren't ever actually in the damn ring working a match.

     

    With regards Seth Rollins, I really like him but considering his ring work is supposed to be his strong point (it sure as hell ain't those promos), he has a lot of improving to do. I'm not putting full blame on him for the injury, I just have to question why he was doing Buckle Bombs and pushing a 56 year-old man back first through a table. It was like they were trying to end Sting's career or something.

     

    Maybe it's because I watched La Sombra vs. Atlantis this weekend and saw a basic, yet absolutely fantastic match - one where La Sombra was absolutely phenomenal in not only his execution but also protecting the old legend he was working with. Sting vs. Rollins rubbed me the wrong way. It was something I'd expect to see in ROH between two 25-year olds that are trying to make a name for themselves. Two Buckle Bombs is a Michael Elgin vs. Tomasso Ciampa match, not a WWE Championship match. But that's WWE in-ring product in a nutshell to me. They only know how to kill themselves to wow the fans instead of actually working a good story and that's why half the roster is working through six injuries and needs a bloody break.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    I don't think it was a freak accident, it was a poorly executed Buckle Bomb on a man that shouldn't have been taking it in the first place (let alone taking two...) He tossed Sting basically neck first into the turnbuckle instead of doing it extremely safely back first.

     

    I'm not blaming Sting, a 56-year old man going out there doesn't want to veto spots. Pride gets in the way, if he has to admit to himself that he can't take certain moves, he probably has to ask himself what he's doing getting back in the ring. And if Sting wants to do the match like that, WWE have no real choice but to book it that way but Rollins? Rollins has all the power in the world to refuse those spots if he thinks they might be dangerous. He's the WWE Champion, he's the only man in the company that has the authority to stand up to creative. He absolutely should have veto'ed the Buckle Bomb, he had no business doing it if he couldn't guarantee that Sting would be completely safe.

     

    This isn't ROH where Sting is a 30-year old blue chipper in the best condition of his life. They booked him in a high work-rate match with a man that completely failed to adapt to his style. I think he gets put in the same class as Michaels, but watch the matches that Shawn had with Sid and Vader. Shawn always worked around his opponent and adapted his rather basic style to suit the people he was working with. This was really the first time Rollins was tested in that regard and he failed resoundingly.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    Why do people expect rookies to be like Sasha Banks or something? Eva Marie has more or less just finished basic training and is getting boo'ed out the building in a DEVELOPMENTAL territory. Imagine if you started a job, didn't do it at the level of somebody that has done it every day for seven years, and thus you got shouted at all day? That is how Eva Marie probably feels right now. But hey, at least she doesn't wrestle to silence, there's always that.

     

    Good workers are the ones that do their job safely and engage the crowd. That is the only criteria for it IMO. I would say that Nikki Bella is a good worker because her matches were always okay and people always cared about what she did this week on RAW. And, I don't think she's ever injured anybody. She also worked every date she was expected to as Diva's Champion and didn't get injured herself AND filmed Total Diva's throughout that time too. I tip my hat to her for doing that and not getting ridiculously burned out.

     

    Cesaro is a good worker. Ambrose is too and, contrary to popular opinion, so is Roman Reigns - he's extremely safe, he pops the crowd and he has a style that works. That's good enough for me.

     

    Seth Rollins on the other hand is a bad worker because he had one job at Night Of Champions, and that was to protect Sting. He failed. He didn't tone down or change his moveset one iota to protect a 56-year old man and has probably ended his career. And WWE is experiencing a massive ratings slump with him as the Champion. Yikes Seth, get it together.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    From this week's Wrestling Observer:

     

    The positives WWE has right now is that they are really the only game in town to all but a tiny percentage of a wrestling fan base. But in being the only game in town, the popularity of pro wrestling is declining, even as some media sources in recent weeks have made the laughable statements that it is the most popular of any period in history, being manipulated by irrelevant numbers. At the same time, to its most loyal audience, the product is hot when it comes to the big shows, which seems to be a worldwide pattern, since it’s the same thing that is going on with CMLL and AAA in Mexico and with New Japan. You could also argue that boxing, UFC and Bellator fall into this pattern. For the big events, such as WrestleMania and SummerSlam this year, WWE can charge far more than ever before, and be more successful from a live gate perspective. And even with the ratings decline, house shows have held up, although so far in September, the numbers have been, in the words of Big Cass, SAWFT.

     

    The issues are stated weekly and endlessly. The three hours isn’t going to change. The revenue difference, even when you erode overall interest with it, and long-term contracts in place, lock WWE into that.

     

    However, the show can change its predictable pattern. The opening interview segment to set up the show inherently isn’t bad, but it would be better most weeks with half the time. The interviews, with the exception of the elite few, need an overhaul. For one, the verbiage feels overly scripted and when it does, whatever goal or message is lost. The disaster of the Ryback promos the past two weeks may in some fault be his due to delivery, and perhaps somebody like Michael Hayes or Roddy Piper in their primes could have taken the wording he was given and pulled it off, but he is not them. The constant buzzwords may read great in a marketing textbook, but they don’t connect with the audience and are not effective in the goals of the interview, which is to generate more interest in the program.

     

    What’s weird is, and there are always exceptions, but as a general rule, the promos, both believability and effectiveness, of wrestlers in the non-scripted generation blow the current generation out of the water. Having seen this generation’s guys outside the scripted environment, while not all are great, almost all are better unscripted.

     

    There are also issues of context. Throwing out matches, even with big names and being of good quality, with no importance, has its limitations. My turn, your turn booking has created the generation of midcarders. Sting, a midcarder with some natural charisma, became an overnight superstar because he went to a 45 minute draw with Ric Flair on television. But the key was the follow-up. Had Flair then beaten Sting once each of the next two months on television, with a submission in the third match, Sting would have never been the enduring star he was. Similarly, if Undertaker, or Ultimate Warrior lost half the time on television in their first year, they’d have never gotten out of the blocks. Yet, even with Kevin Owens, a guy they were trying to make fast and the most promising talker in developmental, they gave him the big win first, and figured since they gave him that win, they could beat him constantly. So instead of being a top tier superstar, he joins the fun sea of very talented mid-carders, guys that fans know, think of as stars, have good matches, but their ability to move the needle is minimized.

     

    Even though it didn’t work, the creation of records like with Nikki Bella’s streak, put more emphasis on the Divas title than any time in recent memory. The Twin Magic screwjob finish which is fine in certain situations, but somewhat out of context given the type of emphasis on the match, did make sense to build the rematch on the PPV. But the follow-up has to be strong. This isn’t pure sport and shouldn’t be booked like sport. But within its context, it should have meaning. The idea that we’re entertainment and anything goes is fine, but when something isn’t working, it needs to be looked at as to why. The key right now is the ability to create interest and an emotional response. If things are presented as if they don’t matter, in almost every case, they won’t. If they don’t matter to the participant, it’s hard for them to matter to the fan. One of the reasons real sports work is the ramifications, the exhilaration of the win, the disappointment of the loss, and even more, the follow-up. The loser creates a story as to either the mistakes he’s made, what he’s learned and how he’ll change things, or, if it is legitimate based on what happens, blames an outside party for derailing his upward mobility. When upward mobility doesn’t exist, and the context of wins and losses don’t matter, you lose a key interest element.

     

    But you also need variety in a three-hour show. That is, very different personas, which WWE somewhat has, and a wide variety of styles, which WWE has less of than many other wrestling companies with far less resources. But all of those are minor points.

     

    The key is making larger-than-life superstars. Whether it’s Bruno Sammartino and Superstar Graham, or Dusty Rhodes, or Hulk Hogan, or Steve Austin and The Rock, or Randy Savage, Ric Flair, Antonio Inoki, Perro Aguayo, Konnan, Mistico, or Ali, Mayweather, Leonard, or today’s Rousey and McGregor, the boom periods are either created by technological changes or larger-than-life superstars. More then boxing or MMA, pro wrestling has more ability to create them, since they can fully script their storylines and control all their outcomes to maximum benefit. But they haven’t, and for whatever reason, have dropped the ball frequently when the seeds of momentum are there because of having pigeon-holed themselves into a mentality that while certain guys are fine on the show, only a certain type can be that larger than life star. And they’ve muted their value when they are either quivering geeks or guys who are good but not great in presentation who are being controlled or propped by up the authority figures who are the biggest stars on the show. It’s worse when those same figures slip from charming and philanthropic babyface who are the people responsible for giving you your wrestling, and then flip to being heels, almost telling you while watching that you are supposed to think, “She’s this really great person who has to play a bad guy in a few skits on this show.” And then they wonder why the other people in the skits, or the skits themselves, have minimal traction as compared to usual historical levels of the business.

     

    Yet, ironically, staring them in the face is a 5-foot-9 skinny Irishman and a woman who they are desperate to copy, yet the people in charge have absolutely no idea how she got there. And they don’t allow people to be themselves and tell their real stories enough to take advantage of what they are to have them connect at the same level.

     

    The excuse that wrestling isn’t real and thus can’t be as popular would ring less hollow if documentaries were kicking the hell out of screenplays at the box office. And while there are exceptions to every rule, and fantasies are prevalent in movies, you rarely see character and plotline inconsistencies and the muting of character development, or the general level of bad dialogue and poor delivery that you see on Raw. Wrestling at its best should be something you look forward to every week and when it’s over, can’t wait to see what happens next. It should not be something where you feel like you deserve a medal just for being able to sit through it and maintain interest in the third hour.

     

    Keep in mind, that in January, ratings will bounce back, to a degree. In actuality, the early year bounce back in 2015 felt like less than most years, and the pre-football decline was significantly lower to start with than any year since Raw was getting killed by Nitro. So record lows, as we’ve had already the past two weeks, should get even lower, particularly in October when the sports competition gets even stronger.

    Diary of the Month Awards

    in Total Extreme Wrestling 2005-2013 Dynasties

    Posted

    I don't like the idea of a "Rookie" DOTM.

     

    To me, the primary reason we have DOTM is to drive competition between writers. I know it was perhaps started to bring the community together but on another level, I think it motivates all of us to write better in order to try and beat those diaries written by the great writers that always seem to win. Same reason I don't like the idea of the C-Verse divide. I plan to run a C-Verse diary in the future and I want them to be put up against every other diary on the board, not just the other C-Verse ones. I want to be better than the best, not better than the best of the small group of people that write a mod I am also writing (see how ridiculous that sounds?).

     

    No, we don't need a sub-award for the new writers. Instead, they should be competing against the best diaries on the board in order for them to read the best diaries and get better at writing. They need to be taking bits and pieces from diaries they like and applying them to their own work. They need to be commenting and predicting - interacting with the other writers on the board in order for them to make friends and build a following of their own. A sub-award doesn't help a lesser writer, it only pigeonholes them into the lower echelon of a hierarchy that shouldn't exist in the first place.

    The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    Face it. They both proved it, neither woman was innocent in their shot to the top.

     

    Well... to be innocent, you have to have done something wrong in the first place. Neither Nikki nor AJ have done anything wrong, they were highly favoured by the office so they just rolled with it because you'd have to be an idiot not to. It's good business on WWE's part to keep them happy since they help keep their top male stars happy. Cena likes having Nikki on the road with him, Punk liked having AJ on the road with him so Vinny Mac does his best to keep all parties happy. It's just smart but simple business on his part.

     

    That and people always forget that being a wrestler is a job and being higher on the card usually means an increased paycheck. You have to ride that wave for all it's worth since wrestling is a short career and you need options after you retire. Nikki has probably made a good million or two off increased merchandise sales alone since becoming Diva's Champion. She sure as hell sells more than every other diva not named Paige, I know that much.

    The Official ROH Discussion Thread

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    She's done some relatively decent stuff on the indies. I liked her work with Samantha Starr and she had a good match against Cherry Bomb not too long ago too. I think she has that natural charisma in that you want to like her and want to support her but yeah, she has a ways to go yet. I dumb that down to inexperience more than anything else.

    The Official TNA / Impact / GFW Discussion Thread

    in The Dog Pound

    Posted

    It's a very odd situation because TNA haven't scheduled any tapings. One would believe that if are set to re-sign with Destination America, they would have already announced the tapings in order to sell tickets for them. Not unless they just re-signed, but I find that hard to imagine, especially since all the signs point towards them being booted. They really don't have time to tape anything for October 14th, unless they do a "LIVE" episode and then tape in the days after that, they've done that before. But again, those tapings haven't been announced...

     

    They could feasibly shut down for a month or so and then resume operations towards the end of the year. People over at TNAMecca think that that's what is happening. I know they have a few house shows in the build to Bound For Glory, maybe they could tape something then?

     

    If anything, they will probably just air Bound For Glory on free TV on October 7th. What kind of number will this PPV do anyway? A 4,000? If that? Destination America probably figure that the very last Impact Wrestling episode is guaranteed to do a good number, easily better than whatever else they air and then they can plug Impact Wrestling's replacement throughout the show.

     

    (I don't think TNA will land a deal on another network if Destination America cancel them, hence why I said it would be the very last episode.)

     

    That said, it's worth noting that TNA's ratings have increased dramatically over the last two weeks whereas ROH's have dropped. ROH is totally being booted soon, the ratings are so very bad. They're averaging around half of what they did when they debuted and that's what they get for appearing so bush league compared to bloody TNA of all products... I think Impact was up to around 400,000 this week - that's a massive positive. Maybe Destination America have seen that and now have cold feet about replacing them?

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