More Flexibility In Weight Size

[ChrisPMWBenoit]

I think we need more flexibility in the different sizes of weight class. Not all wrestlers go through their career the same weight size (Eddie Guerrero mid 90s = Lightweight, 2004 = Middleweight) and there is also no way you can tell the difference between a Middleweight Tazz (Small, Fat) and a Middleweight Edge (Tall, Toned). My idea would to have a static size stat, ranging from Midget to Giant, as wrestlers aren't going to grow or shrink over time. Then the game will also have a body type stat that varies, ranging from Skinny to Fat, wrestlers body shapes change over time whether from growing extra muscle or becoming fat due to old age or injury. This way if you want your skinny, average sized midcarder to get a bit bigger to improve his look so he can be pushed into the Main Event then you can tell him to hit the gym to gain a bit of added muscle mass. If he does it over time, wham, his body type changes, he's now still average height but his body type has now changed to muscular and his look attribute has shot up a bit making it easier to push him to Main Event. Maybe his menace attribute could increase as well. Downside is the wrestler may be insulted by your proposal to gain more weight and become unhappy and want to move to another promotion that doesn't care too much how he looks. Likewise you can tell someone who is fat to lose some weight, they do, stamina and athleticism goes up. This is a very aesthetics-heavy business yet the wrestlers never change their look in the game.

[ChrisPMWBenoit]

Height Sizes Midget: Speaks for itself (eg. Hornswaggle) Very Small: Under 5'5" (eg. Most women, Rey Mysterio) Small: 5'6" - 5'9" (Dean Malenko, Eddie Guerrero, Jamie Noble) Average: 5'10" - 6'1" (Shawn Michaels, Christian , Chris Jericho) Tall: 6'2" - 6'6" (Randy Orton, Triple H, The Rock) Very Tall: 6'7" - 6'11" (Kane, Undertaker) Giant: Over 7' (Big Show, Great Khali) Body Types Skinny/Lean: (Spike Dudley) Toned/Athletic: (Edge, Randy Orton, Cody Rhodes) Muscular: (John Cena, Triple H, Batista, Brock Lesnar) Fat: (Rikishi, A-Train) Weight Class Rey Mysterio (1999): Very Small & Toned = Small Rey Mysterio (2008): Very Small & Muscular = Lightweight Eddie Guerrero (1998): Small & Toned = Lightweight Eddie Guerrero (2004): Small & Muscular = Middlewight Christian (1999): Average & Skinny = Lightweight Christian (2008): Average & Toned = Middleweight Chris Jericho: Average & Muscular = Middleweight Edge: Tall & Toned = MIddleweight Brock Lesnar: Tall & Muscular = Heavyweight Rikishi: Tall & Fat = Large Heavyweight Undertaker: Very Tall & Toned = Heavyweight Kane: Very Tall & Muscular = Large Heavyweight

[Adam Ryland]

EDIT - Misread the post.

[BurningHamster]

I don't know, we could just replace the World Heavyweight Championship with the World Tall and Fat Championship.

[Akki]

I think this is a very good idea. It would definetely help in the realism department, and allow for greater customization of wrestlers, as well as making it possible to switch weight divisions like some wrestlers have done, as well as having a large combination of body types and sizes. Very Small & Fat: Big Dick Johnson.

[mad5226]

just think of all the midget feds that would pop up lol

[Akki]

[QUOTE=mad5226;365512]just think of all the midget feds that would pop up lol[/QUOTE] Yeah, that would actually be a possibility, where you can set as part of a fed's Product a certain height or body type. Such as only midgets, or only muscular guys, or whatever. Right now, the different between someone who is a midget and someone who is just short and skinny.

[JP317]

I like the fact that it seems th be thought out a little. A small little equasion (done in game) and we have a what seems to be added on idea for what the weightclass should be like. P.S. I hope that all makes sence I'm like half asleep right now, sorry.

[tommytomlin]

As a modder, I would probably kill myself if I had to give a second weight stat to every single person in a database for a feature that only impacts upon itself. The combination of size + looks takes into account most of this. Tazz was a middleweight with an average looks, Orton is a middleweight with a great look. Anything beyond that is complicating the game and then putting an artificial limit on certain feds that they can only push muscular guys, when we've seen in the past that isn't true.

[praguepride]

[QUOTE=mad5226;365512]just think of all the midget feds that would pop up lol[/QUOTE] I want one :D

[Akki]

[QUOTE=tommytomlin;365902]As a modder, I would probably kill myself if I had to give a second weight stat to every single person in a database for a feature that only impacts upon itself. The combination of size + looks takes into account most of this. Tazz was a middleweight with an average looks, Orton is a middleweight with a great look. Anything beyond that is complicating the game and then putting an artificial limit on certain feds that they can only push muscular guys, when we've seen in the past that isn't true.[/QUOTE] There are feds with only midgets, just as there are feds with only women, or only masked wrestlers. But I couldn't for the life of me find a fed that loves to push Muscular guys... except three days a week on TV. The :artificial" limits could be added to the limits that your Owners give you. I understand that Look is meant to reflect this in a way, but the problem with it being just a stat is that it doesn't reflect what kind of look it is, really. Like for a guy, he could be ripped, or he could be just a pretty face. I would like to think that they should get high looks, but under the current system, it's way more likely for the muscular guy to have a high Look stat. And for women, I would give both Stacy Keibler and Torrie Wilson a high score in the looks stat, but for different reasons. Torrie pretty much for being stacked and having a nice face, Stacy for having a more classic beauty. Why not be able to tell which is which in-game? With this stat, the Looks stat could truly reflect how a person looks instead of how they're built. (I know that might not make sense, but I can't really think of another way to explain it.) As a modder, I would think you'd prefer anything that can add more realism to a mod. I understand that it's extra work, but with the sizes of some of the databases, changing one more stat on every new wrestler you make can't be that big of a problem when you consider that you're adding 20 or however many more wrestlers, anyway.

[Akki]

[QUOTE=praguepride;365921]I want one :D[/QUOTE] A midget fed, or a midget?

[D16NJD16]

Booking a giant against a giant or a giant against a midget should add some entertainment value, even if minimal to match ratings.

[Rob4590]

[QUOTE=D16NJD16;365990]Booking a giant against a giant or a giant against a midget should add some entertainment value, even if minimal to match ratings.[/QUOTE] Yeah, cos Khali v Hornswaggle was definitely MOTY candidate :rolleyes:

[BurningHamster]

[QUOTE=Akki;365926]There are feds with only midgets, just as there are feds with only women, or only masked wrestlers. But I couldn't for the life of me find a fed that loves to push Muscular guys... except three days a week on TV. The :artificial" limits could be added to the limits that your Owners give you. I understand that Look is meant to reflect this in a way, but the problem with it being just a stat is that it doesn't reflect what kind of look it is, really. Like for a guy, he could be ripped, or he could be just a pretty face. I would like to think that they should get high looks, but under the current system, it's way more likely for the muscular guy to have a high Look stat. And for women, I would give both Stacy Keibler and Torrie Wilson a high score in the looks stat, but for different reasons. Torrie pretty much for being stacked and having a nice face, Stacy for having a more classic beauty. Why not be able to tell which is which in-game? With this stat, the Looks stat could truly reflect how a person looks instead of how they're built. (I know that might not make sense, but I can't really think of another way to explain it.) As a modder, I would think you'd prefer anything that can add more realism to a mod. I understand that it's extra work, but with the sizes of some of the databases, changing one more stat on every new wrestler you make can't be that big of a problem when you consider that you're adding 20 or however many more wrestlers, anyway.[/QUOTE] Does it really matter how specifically a person's looks are reflected within the game? I can see Tommy Tomlin's point of view, as someone who is currently working on a mod which may never see the light of day I know all too well how much time it takes. As cool as it is to have a lot of stats and a lot of details I would rather be able to set a promotion to have different hiring criteria (say if WWE likes muscular guys, have then favour guys with a good look and who are above a certain weight limit, and who have a certain amount of power for example.) It would be much easier to set some more detailed hiring criteria stats for a promotion or a promotions owner than to have to update every individual workers looks. Not that I dislike the idea on the surface or am trying to have a go, I just don't think we'd see too many mods completed if we keep adding more stats to workers.

[Akki]

[QUOTE=Rob4590;366208]Yeah, cos Khali v Hornswaggle was definitely MOTY candidate :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] It might at least have some appeal for advanced booking or something. But Giant vs Giant matches, built up right, a good draws. And if the guys aren't horrible, it can turn out to be a pretty OK match. If this feature is added, it could have something where people of similar height can work better with each other than with those of other heights, almost like a built in chemistry.

[BurningHamster]

[QUOTE=Akki;366221]It might at least have some appeal for advanced booking or something. But Giant vs Giant matches, built up right, a good draws. And if the guys aren't horrible, it can turn out to be a pretty OK match. If this feature is added, it could have something where people of similar height can work better with each other than with those of other heights, almost like a built in chemistry.[/QUOTE] I'm not sure that always works out. Not sure I've seen a good match between two big power guys because usually they are both too big for the other wrestler to use his power moves on. But a big guy against a smaller guy usually lets the bigger guy look strong by doing his impressive moves, and the smaller guy look brave to keep coming back from a beating. Other circumstances two similar guys do work well together. Benoit and Angle are fairly similar size and had good matches, Rey and Psicosis or Juvi back in the day. I do agree with you though that matches between unusual sized workers should draw some kind of entertainment just through the novelty value of it.

[Dolfanar]

The only problem I have with the weight classes in TEW is that you can't really do weight divisions using them. I've suggested the following before: Suggested 100-120 Tiny 121-140 Very Small 141-160 Small 161-180 Lightweight 181-200 Middleweight 201-220 Light Heavyweight 221-240 Junior Heavyweight 241-260 Mid Heavyweight 261-300 Heavyweight 301-360 Large Heavyweight 361-450 Super Heavyweight 451+ Giant Any more detailed then that, and you may as well put Height and Weight back in and allow Weight Divisions the way WMMA does things which would ROCK MY BRAIN!

[Self]

[QUOTE=Rob4590;366208]Yeah, cos Khali v Hornswaggle was definitely MOTY candidate :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] That only sucked because they were sub-par workers. Imagine if they were both awesome. It would be like Yoda vs Dooku, but... real... and extra awesome because of the size difference.

[Blackman]

[QUOTE=Rob4590;366208]Yeah, cos Khali v Hornswaggle was definitely MOTY candidate :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] It is. :D Or has the potential to the least. :D As for the idea, it's ok, but it's not crucial to the game imo.

[rodzillahotrod]

i don't see the difference as it is now in the game does it really matter if we put down the guys body type besides is size and muscle? imo if i put down very small and is strength above b- i already know it is a midget, women, or a rey misterio type of size it doesn't matter if hes fat because the game doesn't tell u if wrestle a was able to body slam wrestle b because he wasn't strong enough to pick his fat body wait up now if this was smackdown vs raw 07 then yea it matters but here i just don't see y its just another add on thats going to make modding longer to make. but i like the idea of wrestlers changing from lightweight to middleweight

[Vladamire Dracos]

I like this idea. As the weight system in TEW currently stands, it can be hard to decide where on the scale to put a guy with an unusual build for a wrestler. To use an example from my own area, there is a wrestler built like a pro basketball player: 7'+ but lean for his height. Where would I put him in the current system? As a Giant or Large Heavyweight (although he would be much lighter than the majority of either groups) or a Heavyweight (although he stands much higher than them)? Being able to select his Height Range (Giant) and his Body Type (Lean) and having the game assign his size category from a matrix would take a ton of guess work out of creating mods, and just as importantly, make integrating additions to existing mods slightly easier as the size categories would finally be universal.

[rodzillahotrod]

how many guys are really that tall and under 300lbs? i really don't know but i still can't picture a guy being 7' fighting for a middleweight or smaller title...

[Sigilistic]

I think the idea is nice, and could serve to reflect real life instances, such as JBL, Chris Harris, and others getting notably fat. Still, that could just as easily be reflected with the already-existing Looks attribute, and I believe it already is in fact.

[tommytomlin]

[QUOTE=Akki;365926] I understand that Look is meant to reflect this in a way, but the problem with it being just a stat is that it doesn't reflect what kind of look it is, really. Like for a guy, he could be ripped, or he could be just a pretty face. I would like to think that they should get high looks, but under the current system, it's way more likely for the muscular guy to have a high Look stat. [/quote] When have booking decisions ever been made on a guy's face alone, and not his entire look? What impact would saying 'Randy Orton is pretty' have on the simulation? [quote]And for women, I would give both Stacy Keibler and Torrie Wilson a high score in the looks stat, but for different reasons. Torrie pretty much for being stacked and having a nice face, Stacy for having a more classic beauty. Why not be able to tell which is which in-game? [/quote] What use is it? How have Torrie and Stacy been booked differently because they have slightly different hot bodies? [quote]With this stat, the Looks stat could truly reflect how a person looks instead of how they're built. (I know that might not make sense, but I can't really think of another way to explain it.)[/quote] But looks IS how someone is built. It is whether they are attractive or unique or look like a star. If you add your original suggestion, where we say that Rey Mysterio is a small/muscular/lightweight, then what does the looks stat measure? [quote]As a modder, I would think you'd prefer anything that can add more realism to a mod.[/quote] I'd prefer anything that makes the game play better. I don't think having to worry about whether we give Randy Orton an 80 for 'chiseled jawline' and a 75 for his muscles is really going to add much to the game, when we already have a general looks and superstar quality stat that cover every single one of these scenarios. It's adding needlessly complex detail to an area of the game that has a minimal effect on gameplay. [quote]I understand that it's extra work, but with the sizes of some of the databases, changing one more stat on every new wrestler you make can't be that big of a problem when you consider that you're adding 20 or however many more wrestlers, anyway.[/QUOTE] It's not changing one stat. I'm cool with new stats. It's trying to figure out a completely subjective stat, that will just lead to people whinging about how Batista's cheekbones mean he should get a 72 in looks over the 71 Cody Rhodes.