jesterx7769 Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 It'd make it even easier if someone compiled a list of everybody who submitted pictures into the pack, otherwise I still have to go through all the threads making sure I have permission from everyone. Well these are all mine http://s355.photobucket.com/albums/r461/jester_x7769/TEW%20Alts/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Ideally whoever compiles the pack would go through the arduous task of painstakingly reorganising and renumbering all of the alts. I don't envy them. Perhaps a way to do it, killing multiple birds with one stone, would be to name files along the lines of "Ricky DeColt_Self1". Putting the name of the creator in there. Perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjacko Posted December 16, 2008 Author Share Posted December 16, 2008 You might be onto a great idea there Self, certainly make it easier for listing who did which ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedew Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 You're right, that's fantastic, gives a bit of recognition too. I'm all in favour of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sebsplex Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Just downloaded the pack. I don't stop by the alt thread enough, but great work guys. I'm not the only one who appreciates you putting in a bit of time to give so many C-Verse favourites an extra dimension or eight (no matter how bizarre some of them maybe). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINisher Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Every alt that I have made can be seen/collected/taken from here: http://koti.mbnet.fi/sadhappy/, atleast I think so. And Adam has every permission to use whatever picture in what ever context, as do others. All my alts are for everyone to use. But the talk about renaming every alt? I mean sure, I can edit all my pictures if that's necessary? benjacko and FINisher for Grey Dog Forum MVP's of 2008! Heh.. That would be awesome but I doubt if altmakers will get such recognition as modmakers/legendary diary writers.. But if it were to happen, I would be more than thankful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benneto Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Hey all thanks for the pack been waiting for somebody to come up with this great idea. Ive only made around 10 alts but your welcome to use what ever you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ping von Erich Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 This pack works picture perfectly if you just copy / paste ontop of a fresh download of the C-verse base picture pack.. doing that eliminates any hiccups it might have screwing up pics assigned to existing alter egos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nachtfalter Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Nice to see 3 of my alts in that main picture and of course the rest of them in the pac that makes it more convenient for peope to get their hands at them. As for the naming, I've always tried to make the name fit whatever the pic shows, but I guess putting the creators name in there is an even better way to make sure there are no duplicate names. I'll do it that way from now on but I don't know when/if I feel like going through what I've done already and rename all of them. And Adam, you can of course use whatever alts I made. I've been playing (and greatly enjoying) your games ever since EW9000, it would be my pleasure to be able to contribute to a future release! EDIT: Every picture my photoshop ever touched (that wasn't so abysmal I immediately deleted it ) can be found here... http://s410.photobucket.com/albums/pp186/Nachtfalter2099/TEW/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 here are all of the alts that ive done use them as you see fit. http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff206/freebird8818/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedew Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 It appears to be rather in vogue to whore your alts out in this thread (alongside a hearty declaration of free rights to them), so here's mine! http://s99.photobucket.com/albums/l304/Weden7/TEW%20Alts/ Use to your hearts content! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtlant Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Feel free to use mine as well... http://s263.photobucket.com/albums/ii145/jtlant/TEW%20-%20Alts/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpion Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 Okay I know that I am going to come off as the heel and the jerk in all this, but it wouldn't be the first time. I take exception to the fact that this was released without giving any credit to those who did the work or without asking their permission. Posting in the forum is giving permission to use in private games and diaries, not to be released separately with no credit. There should be no need to put together a list of who did these alts, it should have been done in the first place. If Adam takes the time to ask permission before using the alts, I don't see why you should not also have the same respect. Just because a mod maker posts a mod, doesn't make it free for other people to release w/o credit or permission and that is clearly stated. Shamlessposer released, or was working on, a mod and both asked permission to use my pictures and gave credit. That is the appropriate way to do things. If at this time I asked you (though I'm not) to remove all of my work from this pack, I doubt it could even be done. I realize the desire to put this together and have it for the community, and I respect that. But, in the hurry to get it done, I think you overlooked some key steps to keep everyone happy. One final complaint. When I released an alt of an alt done by Marcel Fromage, I both asked permission and gave credit. There are two alts in the package which are essentially my creativity, that someone else re-did with no improvement or credit. (which I admit I did not say anything at the time they were released because the alt maker misunderstood what the person was asking for, as they wanted one like my alt for another character, not a repeat of it) However, my originals are not in the set, and I can only think that they were overlooked because the repeat was chosen over mine, which is unacceptable. (There is just enough difference in them that I know which are mine) Had permission been asked and not assumed I would gladly have given it. And I certainly give that permission to Adam to release any of my work with the game. However, by not asking you aren't "helping" the community by rushing through things and not taking the time to do the work, you are hurting it. At this point I don't know if I want to demand that all my alts be removed or not, I guess I'll wait and see how this is handled going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 One final complaint. When I released an alt of an alt done by Marcel Fromage, I both asked permission and gave credit. There are two alts in the package which are essentially my creativity, that someone else re-did with no improvement or credit. (which I admit I did not say anything at the time they were released because the alt maker misunderstood what the person was asking for, as they wanted one like my alt for another character, not a repeat of it) However, my originals are not in the set, and I can only think that they were overlooked because the repeat was chosen over mine, which is unacceptable. (There is just enough difference in them that I know which are mine) This is an interesting little subject. I know from glancing at one of the above Photobuckets that there's at least one Alt which is essentially my work. I took a character, gimmicked him up to high heaven, and then, at the request of the alt board, some third party removed part of that gimmick. Does that final alt belong to the third party? He did work on it. That alt was indeed required by and used by someone. Or is it mine? Would have been less confusing to actually tell you which alt, but I'm really not trying to tie things up in legalities. Just backing up scorpion a bit. I agree that maybe some of us got ahead of ourselves. A bit more time and care taken could make this pack official and law abiding, as well as pure awesome. P.S. Try to prune out the original images out of this pack. Make it purely an add-on. 3,000+ images is scaring me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 technically is everyone(including myself) redoing other peoples work without asking them if we can? I mean I understand that if one person does the majority of the work and then someone changes one small thing and takes credit for the whole thing it not really fair to the person who did all of the work. The way I see it is that everyone is using somebody elses work in a sense and if you dont want your work being used do like they do in the render thread and say so or dont post it. I just dont see it as that big a deal. I see it as the majority of the alts are being done at the request of someone so i dont know why its such a big deal that all the alts that are pretty much already out for the public be put together to save people from requesting something that has already been done. and to save all the people who dont take the time to look for them or who dont look hard enough the hassle of having to hear about how if they would have look they could have seen that it had already been done. not tryin to make anybody mad but thats just my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Wolf Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 I was pretty sure Ben asked if anyone would be against him putting all the alts together in the actual alt pictures thread. All of the alts are effectively the alt maker adjusting some one else's work with our any explicit permission and posted on a public forum for use. So why I can see why their may be legal issues if they're say added to a came you pay for, having Ben just compile all the alts for ease of use and release them as a pack, for public consumption without receiving compensation shouldn't be that big a deal as they have basically already been released for public use by posting them in the thread already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpion Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 I was pretty sure Ben asked if anyone would be against him putting all the alts together in the actual alt pictures thread. All of the alts are effectively the alt maker adjusting some one else's work with our any explicit permission and posted on a public forum for use. So why I can see why their may be legal issues if they're say added to a came you pay for, having Ben just compile all the alts for ease of use and release them as a pack, for public consumption without receiving compensation shouldn't be that big a deal as they have basically already been released for public use by posting them in the thread already. I agree, its not a legal issue, just a respect issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpion Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 This is an interesting little subject. I know from glancing at one of the above Photobuckets that there's at least one Alt which is essentially my work. I took a character, gimmicked him up to high heaven, and then, at the request of the alt board, some third party removed part of that gimmick. Does that final alt belong to the third party? He did work on it. That alt was indeed required by and used by someone. Or is it mine? Would have been less confusing to actually tell you which alt, but I'm really not trying to tie things up in legalities. Just backing up scorpion a bit. I agree that maybe some of us got ahead of ourselves. A bit more time and care taken could make this pack official and law abiding, as well as pure awesome. P.S. Try to prune out the original images out of this pack. Make it purely an add-on. 3,000+ images is scaring me. If the question is about who should be credited, my opinion is that the person who did the creative work should be credited. If all someone does is remove a piece (which is the difference in my case) the credit should go to the original. For example, if I sing 3 verses of a 4 verse song, I can't claim I wrote a new song. But if I change all the words, then it falls under a different category. In my case I wouldn't have had an issue if my originals had been included, but I was bothered that my work was essentially left out while the copy was included (though like I said, the person who did it, I don't think he knew he was copying). Please don't get me wrong, I appreciate what everyone was trying to do, and I put my work out there just like everyone else to help the community, I just felt like I needed to say what I said. I thought it was wrong in the alt thread that someone just said, "well its posted here so its free game." If Adam doesn't treat it that way, neither should we. (Though I realize he may be in a different situation) Like I said before, its just respect for the people that do the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 I thought it was wrong in the alt thread that someone just said, "well its posted here so its free game."(Though I realize he may be in a different situation) Like I said before, its just respect for the people that do the work. I believe it was me who stated something like that, and I do apologize for my poor choice of words. I in no way meant for it to be taken like that so that is my fault. I meant that so long as they have not specifically stated that it cannot be added to the alt pack then it should be ok to put it in there. this thing(the alt pack), i think, is just for ease, so that people dont have to search for all the alt picture and rerequest alts that have already been done, it is unfortunate that some of alt where left out for someone else version of the same thing, that is very understandable. I just dont see this as giving away someones work without giving them credit for it but more as a time saver i guess. anyway sorry again for what I said before thats me saying something without thinking how people would take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINisher Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 Should we just put our name to the end of every picture from now on? Natsuhisa_Tamura_alt2FIN? Interesting subject, I don't really know where I stand. People have credited the makers so many times in the thread itself and in this thread also. Altough I'm with scorpion on that respect issue and someone taking alts that someone made, edited them a little and then calling them their own. I for one have to be more careful from now on, I will always try to mention the original alt maker when I release alts from already edited pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 My official stance is that every alt that I post is free to use for games, diaries, and further alt pics. You can use them in mods as long as you drop me a quick PM to ask permission. Once a pic is used in an official TEW release, I lose all rights and you can use them wherever you want. I'm sufficiently credited by Adam for it to become his problem, not mine. My only problem... concern... curiosity... is when you introduce an all-powerful system of credit, such as the naming scheme I suggested. If I put a hat, smile and tutu on a guy, I don't want someone else to put the original mouth back on and be able to call that his work. I'm more than happy that it's done. If someone wants an alt like that it's great that they can get it. The guy who put that original mouth back only probably deserves some partial credit. It's tricky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedew Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 I think to push this as a matter of respect is overstating it, to say the least. It's a bit of photoshop work for the fictional characters in an obscure wrestling game, not graphic design for jesus christ himself. When I edit, as much as i like people to go "aww shucks fella, that sure makes me feel good!" i'm not going to be heartbroken if someone else changes it a bit and gets that credit. The alts are for me as much as anyone else. I just think it's a bit pompous or at the least naive to put so much moralistic value into, well, re-touched pictures of 3D models of muscly men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabataged Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 Much ado about nothing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedew Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 Much ado about nothing? Bingo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabataged Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 Kinda my thoughts on the subject but I didn't make any of the alts so... I just look at it like if you didn't want everyone to use them then don't post them on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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