AAA appreciation thread: "where are they now"

[Matt_Black]

Performance Center is going to be tasty. Sucks you have to wait a whole year to get it up and running but the way it's described, max it out and it'll pop out little Emma Mays and Velvet Suarezs and Christy Higgins galore.

 

I'm still surprised Christy is unemployed. Just... How the heck does Lady Liberty land on her feet, but Christy is on the unemployment list?!?

[Rhysrob]

I can see how it is has improved compared to '16 through USPW and CWA expanding, integrated companies etc. and the mechanics of the game will kick in and speed skill building-- big thumbs up. And I do appreciate I can adapt the world to my liking through the editor.

 

I was really expecting a women's wresting explosion to have happened-- a viable scene in each region, a higher share of female workers against the overall, future hall of immortals capability (Alicia isn't a candidate...?). There are other compounding structural things that add to this feeling of inequality which feels behind the real women's wrestling scene for the first time in this series.

 

Anyway, with that said, I'm still a fan and will use the editor to adapt it! I did a QAW save (love the stables) and it has hooked me in-- Remi would love to hear how you took QAW to global!

[Blackman]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Remianen" data-cite="Remianen" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47833" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Blackman, I could not possibly disagree with you more.<p> </p><p> To quote the great philosopher, Dave Chappelle, yes they deserved to die and I hope they burn in.......... <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> And in comes Remi to destroy my OP. I guess some things never change. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p> The disrespect! Referencing hell when they of all people go to heaven. HEAVEN I TELLS YA!</p><p> </p><p> But as usual, I guess you're right. It was just an initial culture shock. Do keep in mind that 'evolution' is natural, and it was expected that they got some boosts. I personally expected them to improve more than the expected values, and perhaps I was focusing too much on pop, but pop in general seems more important to the ratings now that NOTB is no more.</p><p> </p><p> As for the HoI: no one even ticked it yet. You need to win primary titles. Only the player can potentially pull that off. There's only 2 primary titles in the C-verse: 5SSW's and QAW's, and both are pretty frickin' far from being national. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Floating titles at high prestige don't count. If you get 2 decent runs with the main title you're halfway into the HoI. Then it becomes tricky as you most likely need A pop at one point and headlining "mania".</p>

[Thane of Fife]

AAA never moved (up) in any save I played in TEW16, unless I was running them. Not a single one. We're talking 325 completely separate save games. I've seen 5 Star get to Cult but AAA was always Regional. The very definition of dead weight.

 

I can't say I have as much experience as that, but how fair of a comparison is that? I almost never see companies move from Regional to Cult unless they started the game with a wide popularity base already in place. 5SSW has that in the default data, and AAA doesn't. While a player can overcome that pretty easily, the AI doesn't seem to do it.

 

I mean, how often have you seen CZCW grow to Cult? For me, the answer is the same as with AAA - zero times. What stops CZCW from being dead weight?

 

(I will also note that every company I have ever seen rise to Cult goes out of business or gets bought out and closed in short order.)

[Remianen]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Thane of Fife" data-cite="Thane of Fife" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47833" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I can't say I have as much experience as that, but how fair of a comparison is that? I almost never see companies move from Regional to Cult unless they started the game with a wide popularity base already in place. 5SSW has that in the default data, and AAA doesn't. While a player can overcome that pretty easily, the AI doesn't seem to do it.<p> </p><p> I mean, how often have you seen CZCW grow to Cult? For me, the answer is the same as with AAA - zero times. What stops CZCW from being dead weight?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Not counting the times I bought out CZCW, I've seen them rise to Cult once (and then immediately drop back down). That has to do with the owner. Cliff Anderson died and someone else took over and I'm guessing made changes to the product. Also, CZCW regularly produced talent that winds up in SWF (or RIPW), TCW, NOTBPW, CGC, and/or WLW. AAA, with only a few exceptions (Sara Marie York, for example) does not, by and large. CZCW also serves a role where talent released from those bigger companies go there to rehab their images and get signed elsewhere. Coastal Resort regularly produced decent talent that developed and moved on. Feeder leagues have value. Cat's Lair wasn't nearly as prolific. Now granted, that could very well be because they're competing with me (and I largely make their roster untenable by "sharing" many of their top workers, making them WAY too expensive for AAA to use), but even in watcher games, they never progressed. They were happy to run shows in the North West, occasionally in the South West, and rarely in the Mid South or British Columbia. That, along with an outdated product that <strong><em>does not fit their personnel</em></strong>, makes them dead weight, in my view. Again, if you're not moving forward, you're falling behind.</p>

[Matt_Black]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Remianen" data-cite="Remianen" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47833" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Not counting the times I bought out CZCW, I've seen them rise to Cult once (and then immediately drop back down). That has to do with the owner. Cliff Anderson died and someone else took over and I'm guessing made changes to the product. Also, CZCW regularly produced talent that winds up in SWF (or RIPW), TCW, NOTBPW, CGC, and/or WLW. AAA, with only a few exceptions (Sara Marie York, for example) does not, by and large. CZCW also serves a role where talent released from those bigger companies go there to rehab their images and get signed elsewhere. Coastal Resort regularly produced decent talent that developed and moved on. Feeder leagues have value. Cat's Lair wasn't nearly as prolific. Now granted, that could very well be because they're competing with me (and I largely make their roster untenable by "sharing" many of their top workers, making them WAY too expensive for AAA to use), but even in watcher games, they never progressed. They were happy to run shows in the North West, occasionally in the South West, and rarely in the Mid South or British Columbia. That, along with an outdated product that <strong><em>does not fit their personnel</em></strong>, makes them dead weight, in my view. Again, if you're not moving forward, you're falling behind.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The AI in 2016 would rarely replace talent that got poached by USPW or NOTBPW, and similarly not sign any talent released by those companies. Especially befuddling when you consider that Alicia was often cut, and with her stats and pop you'd think AAA would be all over that.</p><p> </p><p> But then, the only companies I'd reliably see increase in size and not immediately drop back down were FCW and QAW. Occasionally GCG, but that was a bit rarer.</p>

[Capelli King]

 

So let's recap: with arguably the 2 most prestigious women's titles (NOTB & AAA, USPW is still relatively new) put on the shelves forever, women's wrestling is not exactly "on the rise". Quite on the contrary.

 

Women's wrestling basically got buried. When the main org goes out, NOTB has one of the most historic titles and that is gone as well. Essentially women's wrestling got rebooted. If they would close 5SSW, you could say it simply died. I noticed that for an org of it's level, 5SSW gets pretty good ratings with the AI, so their roster will probably move up pretty fast, but still, the talent pool is pretty weak overall. Worse of all? With the new products

[Remianen]

The AI in 2016 would rarely replace talent that got poached by USPW or NOTBPW, and similarly not sign any talent released by those companies. Especially befuddling when you consider that Alicia was often cut, and with her stats and pop you'd think AAA would be all over that.

 

Alicia was way too expensive for them. I would imagine she would demand creative control and hiring veto to make that move. I've seen her go to Canada and semi-main event Big City Brawl vs Lauren Easter. But I think she's in the rare category where she can only go to the player's promotion or 5 Star if she's a free agent for long enough. I don't know that for sure, of course, since I always grab her ASAP and I don't do too many watcher games after the data collection process post-launch. But seeing as how worker requirements tend to recede the longer they're unemployed, it would make sense.

[Thane of Fife]

Also, CZCW regularly produced talent that winds up in SWF (or RIPW), TCW, NOTBPW, CGC, and/or WLW. AAA, with only a few exceptions (Sara Marie York, for example) does not, by and large.

 

But that's largely because there were so few places for women to go up to. It was only USPW and NOTBPW. And I feel like they both pretty reliably poached AAA talent. But there aren't many spots above AAA, so there aren't that many places for their talent to go.

 

but even in watcher games, they never progressed. They were happy to run shows in the North West, occasionally in the South West, and rarely in the Mid South or British Columbia.

 

I guess that my point is that - in my experience - that's true of pretty much every company. It's very rare for Regional promotions in the game to rise up to Cult. I don't see anything unique about AAA failing to make the jump.

 

That, along with an outdated product that does not fit their personnel, makes them dead weight, in my view. Again, if you're not moving forward, you're falling behind.

 

For one thing, AAA has very nearly the same product as the largest wrestling company in the (game)world, so I'm not sure it makes sense to say that it's outdated.

 

For another, Catherine Quine's data says that her style preference is Cutting Edge Wrestling (in contrast to Farrah Hesketh, who prefers Sports Entertainment).

 

All said, though, I don't want to come across as complaining about AAA closing - time passes, things change (and as I think I said earlier, I was expecting them to close). I just disagree with you on the merits of AAA - I think your opinion is being shaped more by the game's AI rather than the situation that the game sets up in 2016 (which I would argue suggests that Catherine is preparing to modernize and expand AAA).

[Remianen]

But that's largely because there were so few places for women to go up to. It was only USPW and NOTBPW. And I feel like they both pretty reliably poached AAA talent. But there aren't many spots above AAA, so there aren't that many places for their talent to go.

 

I guess that my point is that - in my experience - that's true of pretty much every company. It's very rare for Regional promotions in the game to rise up to Cult. I don't see anything unique about AAA failing to make the jump.

 

I've seen MAW rise to Cult on more than one occasion.

 

MAW!!

 

It's actually pretty common once you get to around the 10 year mark.

 

For one thing, AAA has very nearly the same product as the largest wrestling company in the (game)world, so I'm not sure it makes sense to say that it's outdated.

 

For another, Catherine Quine's data says that her style preference is Cutting Edge Wrestling (in contrast to Farrah Hesketh, who prefers Sports Entertainment).

 

It makes perfect sense to say it's outdated. It's outdated for them. It's like trying to say you're a 'gamer' but having a PC running on a processor that still has 'Pentium' in its name. It's outdated for your purposes. QAW, from its inception, has had a far superior product because it's inclusive. This isn't hyperbole, I've run tests on this (when developing my favorite product. See how their growth changes if you change their product to (Key-Traditional, Mainstream, Modern; Medium-Lucha, Daredevil, everything else at none). That makes the product more inclusive and means that people who don't have a ton of popularity can still produce ratings by their in-ring prowess, which then makes it easier for them to generate popularity.

 

Oh and the reason their product is outdated for them is financial. How much money does USPW have? They've always been heavily capitalized going way back to when Sam Strong bought the promotion. That money allows them to afford signing workers with tons of popularity. In a product where popularity is the be-all, end-all, if you don't have that popularity and you can't reliably generate it, you fail.

 

You make many salient points and I'm not arguing with you. You're correct that the AI is abysmal at growing companies when human players can do it effortlessly. I'm just saying that I think AAA was set up to fail because it wasn't set up to succeed. It's no secret that I soured on AAA the moment QAW became available (TEW07?) and that was due to a lot of other factors. The fact that neither owner (Anne Stardust or Catherine Quine) would allow you to change the product, is definitely one. AAA was overtaken by QAW as a better women's promotion. If the US isn't big enough for the both of them (and it obviously is), looks like the best women won.

[Blackman]

Still, I would've liked a different reason, like Cat somehow getting some other deal or something similar. In TEW16, the company page made it look like they were (finally) set to expand, and they fold just like that. I guess it's Reverie.

[Matt_Black]

At the very least, I'm surprised USPW didn't buy them to be a development company for their women's roster.

[Thane of Fife]

Alicia was way too expensive for them. I would imagine she would demand creative control and hiring veto to make that move. I've seen her go to Canada and semi-main event Big City Brawl vs Lauren Easter. But I think she's in the rare category where she can only go to the player's promotion or 5 Star if she's a free agent for long enough. I don't know that for sure, of course, since I always grab her ASAP and I don't do too many watcher games after the data collection process post-launch. But seeing as how worker requirements tend to recede the longer they're unemployed, it would make sense.

 

I doubt that Alicia is too expensive for AAA. To give a vague, roundabout example:

 

One of my current saves started with a custom local women's fed (Wrestlevania, by Vampella). Rapidly bleeding money, I formed a profit-sharing alliance with AAA and QAW (and I assure you that I have not been pulling my weight in that agreement). Even with USPW and NOTBPW stealing pretty much all of AAA and QAW's top stars, the money I was getting from that agreement was enough that I could hire Tiffany Jade when USPW let her go and still have more than enough left over that my funds were going up at >$10,000 per month. And that's just me mooching off of them (and note that I was not playing it frugal).

 

At game start, the employment tab suggests that Strong wants about $1000 per appearance more than Jade does. I think they could easily afford her, they just choose not to for some unknown reason.

 

It's no secret that I soured on AAA the moment QAW became available (TEW07?) and that was due to a lot of other factors. The fact that neither owner (Anne Stardust or Catherine Quine) would allow you to change the product, is definitely one.

 

TEW13. I think TEW07 might be where BSC became available.

 

And it's interesting to me that you say Catherine won't let you change the product, because my experience with TEW16 is that she totally will. You can go straight from Low Modern to Key Feature Modern on Day 1 and she won't say a thing. I think you're thinking of the limits set on the product in the editor. Almost everything in AAA is locked either to Heavy and up or to Low and down; only Modern and Realism have much flex. But Catherine will let you go straight to the maximum of both of those immediately.

[Matt_Black]

Catherine's big thing, I noticed, was some restrictive hiring goals. She would often throw out "No Luchadors" or "No Spot Monkeys", which put a damper on the available talent pool in 2016, especially if you were looking to bolster the tag division with established teams.

[Thane of Fife]

Catherine's big thing, I noticed, was some restrictive hiring goals. She would often throw out "No Luchadors" or "No Spot Monkeys", which put a damper on the available talent pool in 2016, especially if you were looking to bolster the tag division with established teams.

 

I think that that sort of thing has to do with the product. By default, AAA is Traditional/Mainstream, where Aerial is penalized. If you add Modern into the product on Day 1 (before the goals are set), I think that you will be less likely to see goals like that.

 

Source: I just ran about two dozen sims of the first day of an AAA game where I did that, and while I saw "No Psychopaths" very frequently, I didn't get any goals pertaining to other styles.

[Remianen]

And it's interesting to me that you say Catherine won't let you change the product, because my experience with TEW16 is that she totally will. You can go straight from Low Modern to Key Feature Modern on Day 1 and she won't say a thing. I think you're thinking of the limits set on the product in the editor. Almost everything in AAA is locked either to Heavy and up or to Low and down; only Modern and Realism have much flex. But Catherine will let you go straight to the maximum of both of those immediately.

 

You know, you're right. I always started by raising Lucha to Medium (because I wanted to immediately bring in Electric Blue and Mystery Pink). And I've never edited AAA to have more flexibility in their product.

 

Also, AAA gets a lot of money from sponsorship due to their product. Only running one small show a month means they don't spend much either.

[Rebby]

<p>Reviving this thread since I saw it late. Thank you Blackman, you and I are always on the same page when it comes to our priorities in TEW.</p><p> </p><p>

RIP AAA <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/frown.png.e6b571745a30fe6a6f2e918994141a47.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[Matt_Black]

You know, you're right. I always started by raising Lucha to Medium (because I wanted to immediately bring in Electric Blue and Mystery Pink). And I've never edited AAA to have more flexibility in their product.

 

Also, AAA gets a lot of money from sponsorship due to their product. Only running one small show a month means they don't spend much either.

 

Sometimes. Sometimes, they'd lose a lot of money. Once in 2016, I saw them go out of business before SAISHO or ACPW.

[Blackman]

RIP AAA

 

In a way, Remi is right in saying their product was a bit... out of touch with reality. But it was hard understanding they'd go out of business given they made truckloads of money. It must've been a conscious choice. Too bad we didn't get any information as to why. It didn't actually free up anything or change things up. 5SSW was free to sign their workers anyway, and USPW... well, they can always poach.

[Matt_Black]

In a way, Remi is right in saying their product was a bit... out of touch with reality. But it was hard understanding they'd go out of business given they made truckloads of money. It must've been a conscious choice. Too bad we didn't get any information as to why. It didn't actually free up anything or change things up. 5SSW was free to sign their workers anyway, and USPW... well, they can always poach.

 

J-Ro pulling a Becky Lynch and subsequently retiring probably hurt them quite a bit. Gonna be a bit harder to draw a crowd when a top draw ain't around.

[Remianen]

Oh and that Grace Harper re-render is by Trell, not J Silver.

[Riotnrrd]

A AAA stable in 5SSW has been a fun and effective way to go for me...Higgins in particular seems to be an excellent fit in my current game. Pretty much all of the unemployed women will agree to work in Japan immediately, as far as I can tell.

[paulskln]

I was going to start a new save with AAA but after realising they are not in the game, i have not brought the game, im undecided what to do.... i will buy the game just need something to inspire me to do so...

[Matt_Black]

I was going to start a new save with AAA but after realising they are not in the game, i have not brought the game, im undecided what to do.... i will buy the game just need something to inspire me to do so...

 

Well, you can always buy the titles and do AAA Reborn or something.

[Blackman]

Well, you can always buy the titles and do AAA Reborn or something.

 

There's some options but I always dismiss buying the titles as the continuity is completely gone. It's nicer to integrate a company and unify the titles, and that option is long gone.

 

If I were you, paulskln, I'd just play the '97 or '05 mod, where you can build them up from the ground.