How do you make money as a company small or lower

[gazwefc83]

How do you make money as a company small or lower?

 

I always tend to bleed even at small with a TV deal

[SirMichaelJordan]

Don’t spend more than you create. I’m assuming that you have a large expensive roster or run many shows? It’s really not hard to make loads of money with a small company if you’re not overspending.

[Scott Zodiac]

Have you started from scratch or jumped on straight to a small company? And, apologies for the geekiness of this post.

 

You really need to be brutal with your finances. Anything that is not required needs to go. Have your production at bare minimum until you are going for that tv deal. Most broadcasters require in-house music, which is $10k per month. I’m currently working my way up to being able to afford that.

 

Don’t run too many shows per month at first. I currently have ~500 attendance with two shows, but if I went to 4 shows, that would halve and I would cannibalise my own audience. I wouldn’t get any more ticket or merch revenue, but my per show costs would be the same. You end up losing money every show you run.

 

I would say you’ve grown too fast. Get rid of that TV deal until you are ready for it. Show costs jump up massively if it is broadcast. Insignificant companies have a per show cost of $350, tiny $1250, and small $3000. This is under ‘general’ in show costs on your balance sheet. Going onto TV increases those costs to $2750 for tiny and $6000 for small. If your sponsorship and ticket revenue cannot cover that, don’t do it.

 

As for making money, have a look at your roster. You don’t need announcers if you aren’t broadcasting your show. They are a massive expense early on. Any road agents on hundreds of $ per show can be released. You can get decent road agents for cheaper and maybe ask a veteran worker to become a road agent.

 

Limit your size with the maximum size button. This allows you to stay as insignificant or tiny and keep those associated costs while your pop still grows. Very cheap ticket prices are good for bringing in money as well as raising pop. I’ve been having +3 to pop every 4 shows on very cheap. I stalled out on cheap and have gone back to very cheap to increase pop. I don’t get as much in per show, but my sponsorship should go up.

 

Raise your merch level to level 3 as soon as possible. There are no running costs, so it’s pure profit. When you start making more than $750 per month on merch alone, upgrade again. The level after that is only $1250 per month cost, but it takes forever to upgrade, so you have to factor that into it.

 

Once you start pulling in merch sales as well as ticket sales, I’ve found cheap prices is the most profitable for early game. Your reduced per-ticket price (when compared to normal) is offset by gains to higher attendance and more merch. You also should get higher pop gains too.

 

I started at 10 pop and $2500. I’m at the end of May Year 2 still running two shows per month. I only can out of the red in September Year 1 after starting to turn a profit in July.

 

I currently make around $5k tickets and $1200 merch per show and have just gone over $5k per month sponsorship (23 economy rising from 0!). My wage cost per show is under $1500 per show and my production is still at $340 total per month. I’ve figured out that I need to be pulling in $26k revenue before I can make a profit on going onto Wrestleworld.

[gazwefc83]

Excellent, thanks.

 

It was more of a general question before I think about starting a game.

 

I do have a current 1996 save playing as ecw, losing around 125k a month but I'm very close to being able to sign a ppv deal.

[Scott Zodiac]

Excellent, thanks.

 

It was more of a general question before I think about starting a game.

 

I do have a current 1996 save playing as ecw, losing around 125k a month but I'm very close to being able to sign a ppv deal.

 

ECW losing money? Sounds accurate.

[phuzzee]

I have a couple of questions on starting a l2g how many shows did you start off with, where is the maximum size button and what is the best number of roster to have

[Scott Zodiac]

I have a couple of questions on starting a l2g how many shows did you start off with, where is the maximum size button and what is the best number of roster to have

 

Under the SIZE button where you can see your pop around the region and the world, at the bottom is a button that says MAXIMUM SIZE. You can set it to any size at your level or above. I have found that the popularity of your company keeps growing beyond the limit for moving up a size, which keeps costs at the previous level, but keeps increasing sponsorship and attendance revenue.

 

I believe there may be a cap eventually, as I kept mine at Insignificant but plateaued out at 29 pop.

 

Some people say to run free shows, as there is a cap on the amount of pop growth per month (perhaps 2?). I tend to run two shows per month on very cheap prices, and I gain 3 pop every 4 shows. You will make a loss, but you need to increase the pop to be able to start making money. The economy level makes a massive difference at the start too. I've started with rock-bottom economy and only had 1k sponsorship, but with a high economy, I've had 3k sponsorship from the off-set.

 

Don't get too many workers on your roster. Take a look at your spillover regions in the SIZE section. If you hire workers from your home region, or any of these spillover regions, you don't have to offer travel expenses. Saying that, my company in Britain brought over two great European workers from day one and have had no problem with costs.

 

As for roster size, I currently run 90 minute shows and have a roster size of 25, but I'm on small size and tend to have people either in matches OR angles. You could easily work with 10 or 15 to start off with. Ride anybody with high entertainment skills in your angles for higher ratings.

[Self]

Roster depends on what you consider an acceptable wrestling show. To me, five matches are the minimum (been to plenty of satisfying shows with that number) so my starting roster is 10 wrestlers + a referee. No announcers or road agents. No wrestlers over $100. I run shows with that and when I start making profit, I spend that profit to increasrmy setup. More talent. Better talent. Another match on the card. Etc.

[The Dynamite Sid]

You don't. Wrestling is a money losing venture by and large. Turning a profit is very tough at lower levels. The short answer is to be stingy. Only employ local talent to save travel expenses, only employ very low level workers and pay them peanuts and rely on one or two draws to bring the fans in.

 

In the short term though be prepared to operate at a loss until you develop a stable fanbase and can routinely generate sell outs at modest venues.

 

Of course you can help game by things by playing as a big star or a vital component like a road agent thereby saving on that expense while also being able to utilise your user character as a vital part of the show

[Remianen]

Roster depends on what you consider an acceptable wrestling show. To me, five matches are the minimum (been to plenty of satisfying shows with that number) so my starting roster is 10 wrestlers + a referee. No announcers or road agents. No wrestlers over $100. I run shows with that and when I start making profit, I spend that profit to increasrmy setup. More talent. Better talent. Another match on the card. Etc.

 

This is probably the best advice I've heard. First off, you should not have a TV deal. The costs associated with it are prohibitive if you're looking to remain profitable. Beyond the required facilities, time on TV is going to make worker popularity jump at rates far higher than your revenue produces. I would advise not to get a TV deal until you have a bankroll of 2-3 years of revenue (not PROFIT, revenue) to absorb the costs involved with running at a more frequent schedule. This way you don't run the risk of going into debt after a couple of months of losses.

 

Self points out several things that stand out. First off, when you're insignificant or tiny, you don't need road agents. Have one of your vet wrestlers pull double duty (wrestling and RAing). You're paying for them to appear anyway! Good road agents are typically EXPENSIVE, so cutting that can save you tons. When I'm playing from the ground up, I usually have my user character work as RA. Also, you don't need an announce team if the show isn't being broadcast. One other thing to keep in mind is that there's no such thing as a bad match at Insig/Tiny since pretty much anything will raise your popularity. You're not likely to get any 5-star classics from people making $20 a show, after all.

 

Oh yeah and NO TAG TEAMS. Self's example would suggest 5 1v1 matches per show and that's good (I'd go as low as 3 matches per show since I've been to several indie shows that filled the rest with angles to hype those three matches). Tag teams shouldn't be added until Small (at the earliest) because their cost is prohibitive when you don't NEED them. If you have 4 people that cost you $100 per show, why put them in one match when you can put them in two and get greater value?

 

Last thing, don't worry about developing talent. That's a rich man's game. Just get the ratings you need from the also-rans and never-weres you have access to and keep on truckin'. I'd also limit size in order to avoid unexpected jumps in size (and expenses!) and progress slowly. Slow and steady wins the race or something. Don't sit there forever but keep an eye on your popularity and move up when you're ready for it. Sucks to be making say $100 per show and then jump up and immediately be losing $500 per show without any ridiculous expenditures on your part.

[Thane of Fife]

First off, when you're insignificant or tiny, you don't need road agents. Have one of your vet wrestlers pull double duty (wrestling and RAing). You're paying for them to appear anyway! Good road agents are typically EXPENSIVE, so cutting that can save you tons.

 

One thing to note - if you're using workers this way, it is cheapest not to ask them to work as road agents. Just put them in. If you ask them to become a road agent and they agree, they will probably ask for a raise shortly after.

 

Oh yeah and NO TAG TEAMS. Self's example would suggest 5 1v1 matches per show and that's good (I'd go as low as 3 matches per show since I've been to several indie shows that filled the rest with angles to hype those three matches). Tag teams shouldn't be added until Small (at the earliest) because their cost is prohibitive when you don't NEED them. If you have 4 people that cost you $100 per show, why put them in one match when you can put them in two and get greater value?

 

While I would agree with this at extremely low popularity, I'm currently running a promotion with 8 popularity, 95% matches, not re-using any workers each show, and only running tag team matches, and I'm still turning a monthly profit. So I don't think it is especially necessary to avoid tag team matches while Tiny (I'm not even at Tiny yet).

[Historian]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Remianen" data-cite="Remianen" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="52099" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Oh yeah and NO TAG TEAMS. Self's example would suggest 5 1v1 matches per show and that's good (I'd go as low as 3 matches per show since I've been to several indie shows that filled the rest with angles to hype those three matches). Tag teams shouldn't be added until Small (at the earliest) because their cost is prohibitive when you don't NEED them. If you have 4 people that cost you $100 per show, why put them in one match when you can put them in two and get greater value?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> This is the part where I would disagree. I think it all depends on the type of company you want to run. I love tag team wrestling and I couldn't not book tag teams. There were plenty of territories that would run a card where each guy in a team would work a singles match and then the main event would be a tag team match.</p><p> </p><p> Main Event</p><p> Team One Versus Team Two</p><p> </p><p> Semi Main</p><p> Guy versus Guy</p><p> </p><p> Team One Rep 1 versus Team Two Rep 1</p><p> </p><p> Team One Rep 2 versus Team Two Rep 2</p><p> </p><p> And then you'd have three matches from one set of guys -- four guys instead of six. Sometimes they'd only do the one singles and the tag, but you're still getting two matches out of it and presenting something different. </p><p> </p><p> I'm very much in favor of having teams on a small show. I've been to plenty of indy wrestling shows that didn't have tag wrestling but the five singles matches would get very repetitive. Throw in a tag to keep it fresh!!</p>

[Self]

<p>Classic camp show formula that. 4 singles matches, then close with a tag match featuring 4 guys from earlier, or a battle royal if you have two trainees willing to work for free. Fans love seeing multiple guys in the ring at the same time, if you don't blow your load on it early. </p><p> </p><p>

Babyfaces over. Sell pictures with your handsomest babyface at the end. Then it's off to the next town to do it all again.</p>

[hailthebulldog]

This is the part where I would disagree. I think it all depends on the type of company you want to run. I love tag team wrestling and I couldn't not book tag teams. There were plenty of territories that would run a card where each guy in a team would work a singles match and then the main event would be a tag team match.

 

Main Event

Team One Versus Team Two

 

Semi Main

Guy versus Guy

 

Team One Rep 1 versus Team Two Rep 1

 

Team One Rep 2 versus Team Two Rep 2

 

And then you'd have three matches from one set of guys -- four guys instead of six. Sometimes they'd only do the one singles and the tag, but you're still getting two matches out of it and presenting something different.

 

I'm very much in favor of having teams on a small show. I've been to plenty of indy wrestling shows that didn't have tag wrestling but the five singles matches would get very repetitive. Throw in a tag to keep it fresh!!

 

This was WCCW's spot show format from its inception through most of the glory period.

[Historian]

This was WCCW's spot show format from its inception through most of the glory period.

 

Yes it was. It was also common on spot shows for a lot of the Southern territories when you were running multiple spot shows a night. It's a good way to have teams and not stretch the budget too far.

[Zero]

I just want to thank everyone for contributing to this post. I started a local to global save along with my other game. I will admit I gave myself nearly 400,000 to start though just to have some wiggle room.

 

The tips on this page have been fantastic and right now I'm only losing about 1200 per month as opposed to 15,000 the first several months.

[BobbyRogers]

All the good points were made on this thread to begin as insignificant/tiny.

Just want to add my thoughts because in many ways this strategy is core to the game if someone wants to work their way up from nothing.

 

I learned to cut costs starting out from scratch from a Youtube channel. I forgot his name. He would smoke cigarettes and sounded like a New Yawker. Down to earth guy.

 

One thing he did is have 30 minute shows at first. Do Triple Threats/Four Ways to fit everyone in. He also ignored stamina and production penalties. Hire one ref. He started with a monthly show and would test the finances to see if adding more shows per month down the road actually helps or not.

 

I can see how hiring only 10 cheap workers, not having road agents/announcers, do not worry about low show ratings, and playing it slowly for 2-3 years to grow pop and not overextend yourself can be counterintuitive to new players without getting help online.

 

Basically the early workers you hire are cannon fodder for your long term vision.

 

(By the way my local indie company in real life uses "students" from its training program to work for free and is able to lure some veterans due to the promise of autograph signings before and after the card. The old wrestlers get paid more on that then their match. Same with Stardom, truthfully.)