The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 Anyone hear any more on the news stroy that Vince Mcmahon was gonna open a cable network on the most expensive platform? It's just that it sounded like one of those things that would be a huge turnaround in the way WWE was run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remianen Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 Anyone hear any more on the news stroy that Vince Mcmahon was gonna open a cable network on the most expensive platform? It's just that it sounded like one of those things that would be a huge turnaround in the way WWE was run. It's the trend in sports overall but I'm not sure WWE can hack it, honestly. For those who live stateside in various parts of the country, they can tell you about the NFL Network and its programming (and its new second channel, NFL Red Zone), the Big Ten Network, the SEC network (if it's launched already. I know it was in the works), and the NBA and NHL have taken steps to start their own broadcast channels. The problem is, there is an immense amount of new programming that has to be created to support a channel. As a gleeful subscriber to NFL Network, I can think of 'NFL Total Access' (the studio show), NFC Playbook, AFC Playbook, America's Game, Best 4th Quarters, Best Comebacks, and so on and so forth. NFL Network went out and hired the most entertaining and knowledgeable former players and broadcasters and scouts to populate their network staff. WWE would have to do the same. I don't think they could produce a full network schedule without overexposing the entire product. Think about it. The NFL is "off" for like 4 months a year (since OTAs aren't typically broadcast). They have three 'peaks' in interest (the draft, opening weekend, the Super Bowl). WWE also has a subscription service that they'd have to scrap to support a network (they'd need that entire library for the network). And obviously, they have no 'off' time. I just don't think they have enough entertaining and knowledgeable personalities to really make the network closer to NFL Network than it would be to Big Ten Network. Stranger things have happened but I don't think a WWE Network would fly. Then again, I didn't (and still don't) think a Big Ten Network would fly (who the hell cares about anyone but Ohio State in the Big Ten? And who the hell cares about Big Ten sports besides football and basketball?) but there you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 They have a lot of tape libraries. They have a lot of footage from WCW, ECW, and a bunch of other old promotions that could each up the time. So potentially they could fill up a schedule. Not saying it would be good, but I'd hazard a guess that he could manage it. I can see how Vince would see this as a good move. Their shows are currently at the beck on call of networks now. Smackdown in particular is on a very rickety platform; MyNetworkTV, which from what I hear is doing quite poorly. I can see how Vince would like the idea of having his own network, to give his shows a guaranteed, stable home in case the other channels become less wrestling-friendly in the future. A home where he calls the shots. Original programming would be an issue. They'd need some beyond their 4 wrestling shows. Those Round Table discussions they had were pretty cool. There's a series in that. 'Shoot' or even Kayfabe lengthly interviews with their stars, or even past stars, could fill up some time and be interesting (although the lack of Vince-bashing may make it a tad off-putting to hardcores). ... but yeah, I'd say wrestling is too niche for it's own channel. If Vince could branch out with some non-wrestling programming to mix it up, maybe then it'll be something I could stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 If a network did open, expect to see Santino's Casa at three in the morning. And expect it to be an hour long. Hell they need to fill that schedule! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapa42 Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 In a basic sense, its doable. A few replays of the four "current" WWE shows per week per week, maybe FCW, some replays of old episodes, compilation shows of WCW and AWA, plus a bit of original programming as others mentioned... I think you could fill up a 24-hour network. Would people be willing to pay a premium price for that, though? I have my doubts if that many would. Moreso, some of that isn't going to happen. I doubt the WWE would reshow old Raw or SD episodes because they apparently don't want to make the current product look poor in comparison. How much would they really feature WCW or AWA, given that its supposed to be about the E? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comradebot Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 It'd be awesome if they did it right. Personally, I think they could air the weekly shows of WWF/E, WCW, and ECW un-altered and in order. Or, well, they should. I'd love to be able to plop myself down and see that we're currently watching through the mid-90s of WCW. Of course, that'd be too cool to do. God forbid the WWE actually do something ingenius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remianen Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 They have a lot of tape libraries. They have a lot of footage from WCW, ECW, and a bunch of other old promotions that could each up the time. So potentially they could fill up a schedule. Not saying it would be good, but I'd hazard a guess that he could manage it. Problem is, how popular would those libraries actually be? What demographic would each draw? All of this has to be figured out before you even think of moving forward. I dunno how it works in the UK but in the US, a new channel has to appeal to cable and satellite providers for carriage. They have to give those carriers a reason to pick up the channel. Furthermore, where they slot your channel is extremely important. If they put you in the premium tier (alongside HBO, Showtime, Penthouse, Playboy, Starz, Cinemax, etc), it would be the kiss of death because most people don't order those as packages. They cherrypick the channels they want and I don't think anyone's paying $25 a month extra for WWE Network. On the other hand, if they put you on a basic tier, it gives you access to tens of millions of people, which makes advertising much easier to sell. BUT if you get on a basic tier, you cannot have any "real" ECW or the old school WCW/WCCW shows on before midnight due to rating restrictions. It's really restrictive in what you can do or show. A year or so ago, the NFL got into a "fight" with Cablevision over this very issue. Cablevision wanted to put the network in the highest possible non-premium tier (which basically lops off almost 2/3 of possible viewers since few people subscribe to the 'Gold' package). They came to a compromise (though I don't recall what - I'm on Dish Network and wasn't affected ) but that just underlines the possible issue with launching a new channel for an entity that is not at the height of its competitive tier. Now before the screaming starts, lemme ask a question: What happened the last time Vince tried to go up against the NFL? WWE is not the competitive peer of the NFL or NBA. So while Roger Goodell can go to Comcast and say "Here's our demographic data, here's how much money is spent on merch, and here's how much money our sponsors make related to our programming" and blow their minds, Vince can't do the same. That's the major problem with starting a new network based on a limited part of a given industry. 24/7 was an excellent idea since it's self-contained and WWE (or their chosen subcontractor) controls the marketing and distribution. With a WWE Network, they'd be at the mercy of cable and satellite providers who will each want a slightly different thing for them to qualify for the tier they want. At the most basic tiers, you can't really have much bite or edge (basic entry level packages include channels like Cartoon Network, A&E, Nick, BET, Animal Planet, Food Network, Bravo, etc) and the further up you go, the less people you have access to. Also, how do you reassure your current broadcast partners that the new venture isn't going to kill the programming they're paying for (Raw, Smackdown, ECW, Superstars)? The NFL offers replays of the previous week's best games (essentially, rebroadcast rights) which WWE could do. There are many folks who would tune in to see whichever show they missed for whatever reason. That could be a major selling point. I keep going back to NFL Network because, from all I've read, it's regarded as the best example of this occurring. Their broadcast contracts are all designed around the network and it has grown into its own entity that has developed its own talent. The league actually offers broadcasting classes to players to help them make the move into that area when they retire (right Michael Strahan?). The network promotes the league and vice versa. BP, you bring up a very good point. Would people be willing to pay for it? That's where tiering comes in. If you're not on a low tier (usually called 'Family Basic' or 'Silver'), people are going to have to really want to pay the additional cost to get your programming. I don't think WWE's audience trends affluent enough to really think a few million of them will pony up $25 more for WWE programming (which is the typical cost difference between 'family basic' and 'gold', with another $20-30 to move up to 'platinum'). I recently went from Gold ($75 a month) to Platinum ($107 a month) because I wanted HBO and Showtime (adding the two by themselves would've been $22 extra. Adding the entire package was $32 extra. I'm not gonna die over $10 a month). Would I have done that to get WWE? Come on, that $10 is two cups of coffee (five at Dunkin' Donuts). I like coffee better. I don't think the question is 'Can they fill a full time schedule'. I think the pertinent question is 'Can they fill a full time schedule with programming people want (and will pay extra) to see, without eroding their current programming (including pay per views)'. The other sports channels don't have to worry about pay per view revenue because they don't do them (NFL, the conference channels, etc). Also, how much interest is there in their catalog offerings? Are there really enough people clamoring for WCW/WCCW/AWA (which, incidentally, also seems to be contracted to ESPN Classic) and such to justify large blocks of time on them? DVDs are also a concern, I'd think. Why buy a DVD when you can just watch it on the channel? They don't tend to do massive compilations like the NFL's 'America's Game' package. I dunno, I just would hate to see them roll something like this out and then have to shut it down two years later because it's not doing well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 Sorry Remi but I see a huge gap in your logic. Lots of WWE buyers spend nearly fifty dollars on Wrestlemania alone, why won't they spend up wards of twenty dollars for 24/7 WWE programming? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 For Britain, considering their relationship with Sky TV, I figure they'd get a place on their system, but naturally as a extra channel you have to pay for. Much like MU-TV, the official channel of Manchester United. That isn't lumped into any 'package' deal, it's an optional extra. For £6 a month (or thereabouts) you can watch this extra channel. Over here, I'd figure a WWE Network would work like that. £X a month. Get it if you want it. How much is WWE 24/7 a month? How many subscribers do they have for that? I'm sure your points are totally valid for America though, and that's the main area of concern. Well beyond my areas of expertise. EDIT: A big difference between a WWE Network and WWE 24/7 would be how restrictive it would be. I almost never watch 'normal' TV as it is. I download shows or record to DVR for my viewing at my own leisure. The WWE 24/7 system is a far more attractive prospect for me. Usually I'm not the target audience for WWE, but in a venture like this? Single guy. Disposable income. Access to satellite TV. Really likes wrestling. How many kids or casual fans would be into this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 http://www.wwe.com/inside/industrynews/11399224 This is an article on it. Two years huh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Casey Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 The Wrestling Channel here in the UK had TNA, ROH, NOAH, CZW and still ended up showing lame action movies for a big chunk of the day. Of course, that was partly because of the lack of recognition - TWC was buried in the schedules and didn't advertise on Sky Sports during WWE shows. Still, even with several active promotions to draw from, it wasn't enough and didn't hold fans' interest. It featured an increasing amount of MMA shows (some nights all prime time was MMA) and I think it foldedd a year or two back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderndaywarrior Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 To be honest,I really wouldn't get my hopes up too much on neccesarily seeing alot of wrestling on a WWE Network.Vince McMahon,by his own admission,doesn't care too much about wrestling....what he REALLY wants is to be a mainstream multimedia mogul,kind of like Ted Turner;professional wrestling is just a means to that end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AfRoMaN36 Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 To be honest,I really wouldn't get my hopes up too much on neccesarily seeing alot of wrestling on a WWE Network.Vince McMahon,by his own admission,doesn't care too much about wrestling....what he REALLY wants is to be a mainstream multimedia mogul,kind of like Ted Turner;professional wrestling is just a means to that end. But even if this were true and Vince got his channel, he would be foolish to not use the library that he spent millions of dollars to obtain. He would almost HAVE to use the old WCWs and ECWs, especially if he thinks he can fill up 24 hours of broadcasting every night. Let's face it, Vince will never be successful outside of his element, He failed at football, he is failing in the movie business and he failed with the ill fated WBF. But this... this could be wonderful if he did this right and all that footage is staring him in the face. I would love to see Nitro again from the first episode to the last, Hell, I'll even stay up late up till midnight to watch ECW (it IS what we used to do back then, right?) Not to mention the amount of ideas for original programming would be insane. They can have a show like the Yankees do on their own network. It's a series called Yankeeography and on each episode they go over a players life and career. This could work wonders with the WWE, mostly since they have had more notable wrestlers in their history than the Yankees have had players. I also think with this move, Vince is definitely going to target the 18-34 demographic. The same demographic that may feel ignored by todays product and by putting on things like ECW or WCW or AWA or pretty much anything that demographic may have grown up on, you hold onto their attention, while continuing to milk them dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrCanada Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 I dunno. I like it. Kinda like WWE 24/7 but networky makes it kinda fun. Would be a bitch for mod makers in TEW though. haha. If you are a big wrestling fan, just imagine some of the shows one could see. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WWE_Video_Library Classic ECW (likely late night, hopefully fairly un-edited) Classic Nitro Classic Thunder/Classic WCW (lots of regional stuff in their library) Classic RAW Classic SmackDown Classic B-Shows! (I could see them putting together a highlight show featuring matches from Heat/Velociy/Shotgun/other b-shows) Classic AWA Classic GCW Classic SMW Classic Stampede~! Classic WCCW Classic MLW Then one could imagine some original programming on the network. Easy to see them airing stuff from FCW, or even adding a taping or bonus matches under some new shows banner "WWE TV Live!". Also possibilites for other things, I know people jokingly said, Santino's Casa for an hour, but some stars getting their own air time would be fun. Could have a "Hour of Power" of just random stuff that is usually internet bound. Like 5-10 minutes pieces with Santino and stuff like the Dirt Sheet throughout an hour, but together almost like a sketch show. And they might even go outsidet the wrestling box, hire on that Dan Madigan guy (who wrote see no evil) and have him write a sitcom for the network or whatever. Not a terrible thing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 DAMN IT VINCE, DO IT NOW! sorry, this thread has made me realise I could watch WCW, AWA and ECW legally in good quality possibly with extra features (old stars talking about matches, trivia, new stars talking about matches), and the possibility for shows like The Dirt Sheet having TV time. People like Goldust could have surreal talk shows. Hornswoggle and Khali could host a WWEshop TV! hour, they could stop selling DVD's and just make them into TV shows (and if Tv shows are popular what do they end up with? bingo). I want to be Vince McMahon at this moment. There is so much you could do. Heck if I was Shane McMahon, I would beg to not be released from the contract and just be put in charge of original programming for the WWE network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AfRoMaN36 Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 DAMN IT VINCE, DO IT NOW! sorry, this thread has made me realise I could watch WCW, AWA and ECW legally in good quality possibly with extra features (old stars talking about matches, trivia, new stars talking about matches), and the possibility for shows like The Dirt Sheet having TV time. People like Goldust could have surreal talk shows. Hornswoggle and Khali could host a WWEshop TV! hour, they could stop selling DVD's and just make them into TV shows (and if Tv shows are popular what do they end up with? bingo). I want to be Vince McMahon at this moment. There is so much you could do. Heck if I was Shane McMahon, I would beg to not be released from the contract and just be put in charge of original programming for the WWE network. I don't think Vince would stop selling DVDS for the fact that they make money while tv will only make money based on the advertisement during your shows and of course the people buying the package.He can of course make DVD box sets of his shows as well. But I'm mostly pulling for old wrestling shows and the original programing can come second. I'm sure stuffing things from the videos section of WWE.com into a half hour would make for decent filler. I'm hoping for wrestler biographies though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Orange Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 He can of course make DVD box sets of his shows as well. Was sorta hinting at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 The thing is, knowing Vince Mac, he certainly knows how to screw things up. I won't get my hopes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remianen Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Sorry Remi but I see a huge gap in your logic. Lots of WWE buyers spend nearly fifty dollars on Wrestlemania alone, why won't they spend up wards of twenty dollars for 24/7 WWE programming? Umm, what? Lemme get this straight You're equating a one-off purchase of $50 (the number of which is dropping precipitously every year) to a payment every month of $5-15? Given the talk about the economy, you'd have to be a pretty diehard fan to do that. Besides, if you read the LA Times article, he's looking to get into the basic tier. Yeah, good luck with that. More than half of WWE's catalog isn't viewable prior to midnight in the US for channels on the basic tier (look it up). That means the PG programming is all you'd get during the bulk of the programming schedule. Yeah, that's a wonderful way to attract the 18-44 male demo. For Britain, considering their relationship with Sky TV, I figure they'd get a place on their system, but naturally as a extra channel you have to pay for. Much like MU-TV, the official channel of Manchester United. That isn't lumped into any 'package' deal, it's an optional extra. For £6 a month (or thereabouts) you can watch this extra channel. Over here, I'd figure a WWE Network would work like that. £X a month. Get it if you want it. How much is WWE 24/7 a month? How many subscribers do they have for that? It is my belief that if WWE 24/7 was a rousing success, they'd be shouting the numbers from the rooftop (like Blizzard does with World of Warcraft). Thus, I'm of the belief that the service supports itself and ekes out a meager profit but isn't a runaway success. Problem is, this isn't Field of Dreams. If you build it and they don't come, you've just experienced the phenomenon known as the money pit. EDIT: A big difference between a WWE Network and WWE 24/7 would be how restrictive it would be. I almost never watch 'normal' TV as it is. I download shows or record to DVR for my viewing at my own leisure. The WWE 24/7 system is a far more attractive prospect for me. Usually I'm not the target audience for WWE, but in a venture like this? Single guy. Disposable income. Access to satellite TV. Really likes wrestling. How many kids or casual fans would be into this? This is exactly my point. As it stands now, the premium channels don't sell on their own. That's why cable and satellite providers lump them into packages. It's also why your HBOs and Showtimes (and Starz and Cinemax) produce multiple channels to appeal to different demographic and interest groups (HBO Latino, HBO Black, HBO Comedy, etc) because it costs them little to nothing to do so but the benefits make it well worth it. Also, there seems to be relatively few people like you (or me) in the world now. But I don't think there's anything they could do to make me want to buy in. FCW stuff would be cool to watch, no doubt, but I don't think they'd include that. Right now, they're doing due diligence work. Hopefully at the end of that process, they'll drop this tomfoolery and concentrate on creating a good product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 McMahon's WWE has a pretty strong track record that cable and satellite operators will find hard to ignore. Whatever one thinks of WWE content, it does attract a big audience. USA Network's "Raw," for example, averages 5.5 million viewers and all of the WWE's shows on broadcast and cable combined average 16 million viewers per week. WWE is also starting bringing in more blue chip advertisers, including AT&T, Pepisco and Procter & Gamble. McMahon is also a force on pay-per-view. WWE does about 14 pay-per-view events annually that attract anywhere from 500,000 to 1.4 million buys. In other words, he has some juice with distributors. With a library of over 100,000 hours of programming, he's not lacking for content. "We have a lot of clout that most people don't," McMahon said. While WWE wants its own network, McMahon said he has no plans to take "Raw" off of USA or move any of his other properties. "It won't be a threat, it'll be an integration," he said, adding, "it's good for `RAW' to be on USA." Of course, McMahon also knows it will also help him in negotiations with his partners. "Having your own network allows you a lot of leverage." From LA Times, I highlighted the stuff in conversation. I'm with MDW kind of on this one though. I will believe it when I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basmat01 Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Why couldnt this be a channel owned by the WWE but not totally under the WWE banner? yer clearly its gunna show wrestling content but does it need to take up 100% of airtime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Why couldnt this be a channel owned by the WWE but not totally under the WWE banner? yer clearly its gunna show wrestling content but does it need to take up 100% of airtime? Nope... They could show whatever they get the rights to show. This could include old reruns of Hogans Hero's or anything at all really. Fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't start showing old cartoons and such... Perhaps a new gameshow or two, etc. And then they could change the name to the Initials WWE (World Wide Entertainment), lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Fenoli Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Nope... They could show whatever they get the rights to show. This could include old reruns of Hogans Hero's or anything at all really. Fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't start showing old cartoons and such... Perhaps a new gameshow or two, etc. And then they could change the name to the Initials WWE (World Wide Entertainment), lol. What if they digitally impose Hulk Hogan into the show as Col. Hogan.... that would mean instant ratings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masterded Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 What if they digitally impose Hulk Hogan into the show as Col. Hogan.... that would mean instant ratings... http://video.adultswim.com/robot-chicken/hogans-heroes.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Fenoli Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 http://video.adultswim.com/robot-chicken/hogans-heroes.html well, there ya go... man, they took my idea and ran with it quick! Didnt expect them to have that done with in minutes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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