The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[shawn michaels]

The "Putting HHH in charge" whole approach is supose to be the sign that this will be a new era? Damn, does that guy has to get himself involved in everything?? Jesus Christ!

[shawn michaels]

Also, if Punk wins and his title reign ends up beeing recognized, will John and Rey's reigns be considered null? That part of the storyline is confusing. Or was the title officially vacated when Punk left?

[evileddie10]

http://www.wwe.com/inside/titlehistory/wwechampionship

 

WWE.com is listing CM Punk's reign, and then Rey's and Cena's, so i'm under the impression the title was vacacted...don't quote me on that, I don't remember seeing or hearing Vince or HHH say it on TV or even online on WWE.com.

[djthefunkchris]

I knew JR was coming back, he tweated it or might even blogged it.

 

I read these pages with a little humor. Not everyone, but a few people seem to have been upset when JR come out, after HHH teased a Punk return, but later people seemed upset that they actually did have a Punk return.

 

I don't have any problems with the storyline at all yet. All this speculation of how it should go compared to how it's going, after everyone bassically said everything that happened wouldn't before we got this far into it... yet still think they can "guess" as well as that kid did on that link. Haven't seen alot of people getting anything right since this begun to be honest. ....

 

I don't see how bringing Punk back, after a TON (and I mean a TON) of place's called them fools if they didn't. The sooner the better, etc. Too soon now? I'm going to have to agree with the guy that made the most sense so far... This is the PERFECT time to bring him back, and keep him extremely relevant. CM Punk is RED HOT right now, and it would be criminal not to take advantage of that... You cannot just assume that he will be this hot in a month.

[20LEgend]

I was a little disappointed that the blockbuster superstar was JR. I didn't want it to be CM Punk though, I don't know who I expected, maybe Foley or Kevin Nash, and then when he announced the other person he'd "resigned" as JoMo, I was more upset. That said looking back I'm glad he's (Ross) back, I like his commentary

[tommyb]

I was a little disappointed that the blockbuster superstar was JR. I didn't want it to be CM Punk though, I don't know who I expected, maybe Foley or Kevin Nash, and then when he announced the other person he'd "resigned" as JoMo, I was more upset. That said looking back I'm glad he's (Ross) back, I like his commentary

 

In the heat of the moment I got over excited and was half expecting Y2J. Deep down I knew it wasn't him, but just the thought of it made JR's return (which I do think is good) seem a little less exciting.

[Prophet]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="shawn michaels 82" data-cite="shawn michaels 82" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Also, if Punk wins and his title reign ends up beeing recognized, will John and Rey's reigns be considered null? That part of the storyline is confusing. Or was the title officially vacated when Punk left?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Cole mentioned it last week during the tournament. When Punk left, McMahon vacated the title, to set up the tournament.</p>

[Jaysin]

http://iwantwrestling.com/2011/07/26/hall-of-famer-saved-cm-punk/

 

GREAT Read, I cannot recommend this enough.

[SaySo]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><a href="http://iwantwrestling.com/2011/07/26/hall-of-famer-saved-cm-punk/" rel="external nofollow">http://iwantwrestling.com/2011/07/26/hall-of-famer-saved-cm-punk/</a><p> </p><p> GREAT Read, I cannot recommend this enough.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Indeed it was. Great to see how far CM Punk has come in the WWE.</p>

[GhostDogg]

<p>OK</p><p>

I just saw the Jimmy Kimmel life clip with CM Punk. 3 Things. </p><p> </p><p>

1. A 6 year old is the Damn General Manager....</p><p>

2. CM Punk is actually entertaining and funny (and the 6 year old was awesome) </p><p> </p><p>

and 3. as everyone know...</p><p> </p><p>

John Cena is "Poopy" </p><p> </p><p>

<img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[Bull]

<p>I'm just wondering if I am the only one who thought it was complete awsomeness to watch CM Punk walk out to Cult Of Personality?<img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p>

I've actually watched ot multiple times just because I think it is that Badass.</p>

[TakerNGN74]

Yeah Dude it was fricken awesome, I knew right when the music hit that it was him but it was still cool regardless. I hope he uses it at Summerslam in his match with Cena.

[bigtplaystew]

<p>Yea I dont feel like they are rushing the Punk storyline at all. It's the hottest thing in wrestling right now and they gave him two weeks off after the PPV... what more do you want?</p><p> </p><p>

They brought him back very briefly on TV and teased the fans a bit. We all know he'll have stuff to say and we'll all tune it to hear it. If you legitimately thought they would rest Punk whiel he's as hot as he is... especially leading up to summerslam.... well... you simply deserve to be "disappointed".</p>

[milamber]

<p>I didn't mind Rey winning the title. He deserves it. However, unlike with Christian losing his belt to Orton after a few days where they made a storyline out of it, there was less reason for Rey to defend so quickly. I guess they wanted to go all out for HHH's first Raw in charge but it didn't make good sense.</p><p> </p><p>

As for Cena winning, yeah it sucked but I have faith it's only temporary. I believe Rey will win it back at (or before) SS and ADR will try to take it off him.</p>

[ShaunGBD]

When Ultimate Warrior was talking about Zack Ryder was he joking or serious?

[sebsy]

Don't think Mysterio is getting a title any time soon.

 

Hopefully it all ends up with Punk being rightfully recognised as the champion, which means Punk vs Cena at Summerslam.

 

Punk can come back next week and say he had to make his point that he is the champion and any one they've decided is new champion means nothing so Rey and Cena's reigns don't count. Punk says if Cena thinks he deserves to be champion then he should earn it by invoking his rematch at Summerslam. Hopefully Punk then beats Cena.

 

Cena can then feud with Del Rio and Mysterio with Punk whilst presumably Miz and Riley reignite for another match.

 

Depending on the situation of Punk's return it could lead to HHH giving Punk more desperate matches in an effort to 'reclaim' the title.

 

A triple threat match at Night Of Champions, a HIAC match at the similarly named ppv etc

[LoNdOn]

I'm just wondering if I am the only one who thought it was complete awsomeness to watch CM Punk walk out to Cult Of Personality?

 

I've actually watched ot multiple times just because I think it is that Badass.

 

I loved it, I had goosebumps and still do whenever I watch it back. Having said that, CM Punk could come out to Just Beiber and would still be badass.

 

A lot of people are complaining that they have pushed the story along too quickly. Maybe they should have kept Punk off of tv until Summerslam but I would be flat out lying if I said I wasn't loving this storyline all the same. I am actually optimistic about the future of WWE with the creative changes we have witnessed over the past couple of shows, things look quite promising.

[Fantabulous]

Considering it's Punk/Cena in a title vs. title match as the main event of Summerslam, which should have been more than just obvious given the ending of Raw, we're not getting any more WWE title changes until then. Rey was just the guy picked to keep the belt warm for two hours so Cena could get it back and they could set up the main event of Summerslam.

 

Even if they 'had to' bring Punk back, either because you felt he was hot and they had to keep the momentum going or you think the casual fan has the attention span of a flea and would forget all about him if he was off TV for more than a week, there are dozens of ways you can have Punk be part of Raw and not have it be as a member of the roster. Part of what made the angle special was Punk being the rebel, both with his words and actions, who didn't want to be on Raw, even as WWE Champion, and it's hard to portray that now that Punk is 'back in the fold'. It wouldn't have hurt to stick with Cena/ADR as the Summerslam main event and run angles leading toward Summerslam with Punk gatecrashing Raw or kicking up a fuss in some fashion and maintain the rebel part of the character for a while longer. Now, he's back to being a wrestler for WWE and there are lot of aspects of the character you've lost and can't make use of that would have made for great TV.

[kipfizh]

Two things really bugged me about the show this week, mainly because I get annoyed by continuity issues or things that just plain don't make sense.

 

1) The Cole 'contract' nonsense. So he can't be fired because of his severance package, and if he quits he forfeits it? Fine so far. But the next five minutes were the absolute definition of constructive dismissal, which means he could happily walk and sue.

 

Making an employee's work life horrible and goading them into leaving so you don't have to pay them off? Open and shut case. I know it is picky, but if you're going to mention contracts and clauses then don't leave such a gaping hole in your argument.

 

2) Assuming the new title is recognised, which it seems to be, Rey is owed a rematch. Chances of getting one?

 

This one really bugs me - people either get rematches or don't based on how it fits the purposes of where they are going, regardless of logic. But this one is just so contradictory - the whole point of the second title match was because Cena deserves a rematch (even though the new title is a different one) - by that same logic Rey CERTAINLY deserves one. He ain't gonna get it though.

 

But otherwise, good show. Yes, it feels rushed, but everyone's tuning in next week to see Punk's returning promo.

[Hive]

This one really bugs me - people either get rematches or don't based on how it fits the purposes of where they are going, regardless of logic. But this one is just so contradictory - the whole point of the second title match was because Cena deserves a rematch (even though the new title is a different one) - by that same logic Rey CERTAINLY deserves one. He ain't gonna get it though.

 

How can you be so sure about that?

[kipfizh]

How can you be so sure about that?

 

Can't be 100% certain right now, but it's a confident prediction certainly. Next week will all be about Punk/Cena and the build up, they won't let it get distracted by a rematch.

[Tha Black Phenom]

Considering it's Punk/Cena in a title vs. title match as the main event of Summerslam, which should have been more than just obvious given the ending of Raw, we're not getting any more WWE title changes until then. Rey was just the guy picked to keep the belt warm for two hours so Cena could get it back and they could set up the main event of Summerslam.

 

Even if they 'had to' bring Punk back, either because you felt he was hot and they had to keep the momentum going or you think the casual fan has the attention span of a flea and would forget all about him if he was off TV for more than a week, there are dozens of ways you can have Punk be part of Raw and not have it be as a member of the roster. Part of what made the angle special was Punk being the rebel, both with his words and actions, who didn't want to be on Raw, even as WWE Champion, and it's hard to portray that now that Punk is 'back in the fold'. It wouldn't have hurt to stick with Cena/ADR as the Summerslam main event and run angles leading toward Summerslam with Punk gatecrashing Raw or kicking up a fuss in some fashion and maintain the rebel part of the character for a while longer. Now, he's back to being a wrestler for WWE and there are lot of aspects of the character you've lost and can't make use of that would have made for great TV.

 

But there are always other aspects that can be gained. Punk will surely have his words to say next week, saying why he's back, what he intends to do, etc. And if Triple H gets into the fray, he can still pull off the rebel aura, only this time inside WWE doors, which sure sounds less riveting than what this potentially could've been, but if it's pulled off well, win/win and the angle overall will still look exquisite once it's a done deal.

[sebsy]

Hopefully as I say though Punk will make the case that neither Rey or Cena's reigns count as he is the champion and they can't just sweep his reign under the carpet meaning at Summerslam it's Cena getting his rematch against Punk for the MITB match.

 

Sure it makes the tournament seem pointless but there were reasons for doing it.

[shawn michaels]

“I’m a Paul Heyman Guy!” CM Punk – 6/27/11 Monday Night Raw.

 

"That one line in Punk’s promo kicked off this whirlwind ride we’re on in the “Summer of Punk” story. This period is being talked about as having lead to resurgence of interest in pro wrestling.

 

Over the next three days, I’m going to look back at three different periods in 2007 when CM Punk became the center piece of the ECW Brand. These stories will shine a little light on the frustration surrounding Punk’s early run in WWE.

 

On December 4th, 2006, Paul Heyman left the WWE Creative Team, for the final time. This also meant that for the first time ever, Heyman would not be involved in the creative process of ECW. Stephanie McMahon walked into the writer’s room to tell us Paul would no longer be involved and that I was now in charge of ECW. This was as much news to me as it was the rest of the team. As had happened with Alex Greenfield when he took over Smackdown, I wasn’t talked to about the new position. I wasn’t doing backflips about this because I knew the baggage that came with it. I had run Smackdown for four years before this and knew how Vince and Kevin Dunn viewed ECW. The world saw how they viewed the brand for the five months before this and especially the night before on PPV with December to Dismember.

 

The PPV from Augusta, GA featuring an Extreme Elimination Chamber match was the least bought WWE PPV in history. The show was handicapped by zero promotion from Raw and Smackdown and being the 2nd WWE PPV in eight days; following Survivor Series. The main purpose of the event was to crown Bobby Lashley as the new flag bearer for ECW. The event had only two matches announced before hand, the Elimination Chamber and the reuniting of MNM vs. The Hardyz. While Lashley was going to be the “man” that night winning the title, there was a pitch by Heyman to have CM Punk and Big Show start the Chamber and for Punk to eliminate the Big Show with the Anaconda Vice. Big Show was behind the idea and felt it was the right move to make. There were a few different long term pitches off of this including Punk vs. RVD at Wrestlemania. Heyman had protected Punk, including making sure his debut match was at the Hammerstein Ballroom. This pitch was meant to establish Punk as the “next” guy after Lashley. If you’ve seen the match, you know this didn’t happen.

 

The Anaconda Vice became one of the things that the agents picked on Punk for. Vince had mocked Punk in meetings by doing the wrist gesture and even instructed announcers to NOT mention his Muai Thai background. Everything that made Punk unique was questioned and mocked. “Don’t think people can relate to with a character who doesn’t have an occasional beer”, said one agent. In 2006, Vince McMahon looked at Punk and “didn’t get it”. Plus, when you have Paul Heyman pushing heavily for you in that environment – you get the stigma of being a “Paul Heyman Guy”. I had the stigma because I worked with Paul on every run he had on creative from 2002 – 2006. Punk suffered for those sins and that night in December, he did not make the Big Show tap out. The agents who didn’t like him made sure the audience would not get a moment from CM Punk that night; Punk was the first man eliminated in the match.

 

In under 24 hours, everything about ECW had changed. Heyman was out, Big Show was gone, and I was left with a mess. CM Punk, a lot like ECW, Goldberg, the NWO and especially WCW, were not WWE creations. The track record has shown that Kevin Dunn and Vince McMahon do not support ideas that were not generated inside their bubble. Punk got the tag line of “King of the Indies” and those agents who didn’t like him before Heyman was gone, they were out for blood now.

 

I’m no Paul Heyman. I won’t ever try to sell you that I’m a genius, instead just a guy who always wants to do the best for the talents and projects I work on. I had a connection with ECW, it’s what kept me excited about the business in 1994 and 1995 when there wasn’t much to be excited about. That spirit of ECW was what we tried to continue in the new ECW, including launching a new star like CM Punk. But I didn’t have an ally, especially a veteran voice, in that agent meeting.

 

The voices in that meeting room pushed for Hardcore Holly. Now, I am a fan of Hardcore Holly. When Brock Lesnar had broke Holly’s neck, it was Bruce Prichard and I who suggested Holly coming for revenge. (watch here) It was the hottest Holly ever got but he didn’t connect with the audience and they had a forgettable match at the Royal Rumble 2004. Here it was 2007 and the agents were pushing for Holly ahead Punk. In their matches during December and January, Holly beat down Punk in the corner, ignoring the ref’s count and getting disqualified. (watch here) And then Hardcore Holly hands Punk his first loss. (watch here) I had heard rumblings of agents pushing Vince to show Punk the door. ECW started to receive less and less attention and then we had the horrible show in Little Rock in mid-January. The matches were bad, the interviews were bad; the plane flight home from that show was worse. It was the longest flight of my life. The next day I sat down to talk with Stephanie about that flight but more importantly about what I thought ECW needed. I needed a veteran voice to help turn the tide. I needed an ally.

 

Fast forward to the agent meeting in Houston. Vince McMahon was scheduled to appear on ECW for the first time in the start of a new storyline. He was going to rid ECW of it’s “Original” stars and make the way for a “New Breed”. The meeting quickly turned into another CM Punk bash fest. My role was to run the meeting but dare not speak out of turn on the veteran agents. This was how the previous months meetings had gone but this day was different. It was a new voice in the room that changed everything. “Um, if you don’t like something the kid is doing, why don’t you work with him to fix it… instead of killing him” That voice belonged to Shawn Michaels.

 

In January of 2007, Shawn Michaels was my consultant on ECW. I was able to get in his input on the shows, thoughts on talents and in this situation the voice needed in that agent meeting. Like getting to work with Paul Heyman, Vince McMahon, Dusty Rhodees, working with Shawn was a dream come true. In that meeting in Houston, Shawn brought up that guys like him and Undertaker will not be around forever and, while everyone liked Holly, it was guys like Punk who were the future. The mood in the room changed, the den of negativity that existed was silenced for the time being. Punk wasn’t pushed strong that week or even the next week but the ship had turned. Punk was positioned better from that point forward.

 

Shawn Michaels was pulled back into active duty when Triple H was hurt and programmed to face John Cena at Wrestlemania 23. Dusty Rhodes ended up joining me to help book ECW. And CM Punk made Wrestlemania 23 as the only ECW guy in the Money In the Bank Ladder Match.

 

In that Money In the Bank ladder match, Punk was involved in the finish of the match. He was finger tips away from the briefcase only to have Mr. Kennedy knock him off and grab the case. This was just foreshadowing as Punk did go on to win the Money in the Bank briefcase in back to back years to win his first two World Titles.

 

Imagine if those agents would have gotten their way back in early 2007? We might have never gotten to see this at the 2011 Money in the Bank PPV.

 

WWE has even restocked the shirt that was going for 500 bucks on EBay! You can get it by clicking the banner below to get to WWEShop."

 

Source IWantWrestling.com

 

Nice reading, don't you think? Gotta like HBK! xD

 

Edit: I'm terribly sorry. I just realized someone already had linked this.

[shawn michaels]

Can't be 100% certain right now, but it's a confident prediction certainly. Next week will all be about Punk/Cena and the build up, they won't let it get distracted by a rematch.

 

I could almost bet my life that he will have a rematch. They sure know how to book him in title matches and number 1 contender matches, and do so frequently. The problem is when he actually wins them...that's when The E screws up... But yeah, i'm pretty sure they won't miss out on parading him on a title match that he will (as almost always) lose. Have you noticed how the man has a good offense and actually looks legit facing bigger guys in the matches he loses? Oh well...