The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[hrdcoresidebrns]

I didn't see that at all, I mean sure Rock and Austin stood out in their own ways, and even there that depends on your own perception, but sucking the heat out.. I definitely didn't see it. The actual roster had their range to shine, Miz was prestiged with an amazing video package, Cody got his time to shine, Del Rio looked good, even if he was the opener. I'm not a fan of Swagger, but I enjoyed him last night probably more than ever before. It might be really you seeing it that way if the involvement of those guys sticks out so sorely to you.

 

I concede that my dislike of the Rock may sway my judgement, but I don't see how you can objectively say that Cena and the Miz ended up with more or even the same level of heat that they had going into the match after the Rock's involvement. In fact, I can barely see how you can say that the match itself had any heat at all.

 

Miz (again, who I don't enjoy) was nonetheless doing an amazing job as champion and being the sniveling heel that you wanted to see get his. Cena (while never the full crowd favorite) at least had the role of being the would-be toppler. However, once the Rock became involved, it became Cena vs. the Rock. The Miz became a complete afterthought, and any face heat that Cena had up to that point was immediately sucked dry by the Rock.

 

Aside from covering up whatever perceived lack of progress Miz/Cena had made, I don't see what benefit Rock's involvement had to either of the other participants in the angle with him. Remember, it's about elevating everyone involved, not just one (part-time) wrestler at the expense of everyone else. I can say that Cena is primed for a big angle, but without turning him heel, I don't see what benefit it will be for him.

[GhostDogg]

A.Ri= Punching Bag for the Stars

[Jaysin]

Jon Moxley just signed a developmental deal with WWE...my reaction is my jaw hitting the floor. I hope they know what they have in their hands now. He's one of the best on the mic that I've seen.

[Tha Black Phenom]

I concede that my dislike of the Rock may sway my judgement, but I don't see how you can objectively say that Cena and the Miz ended up with more or even the same level of heat that they had going into the match after the Rock's involvement. In fact, I can barely see how you can say that the match itself had any heat at all.

 

Miz (again, who I don't enjoy) was nonetheless doing an amazing job as champion and being the sniveling heel that you wanted to see get his. Cena (while never the full crowd favorite) at least had the role of being the would-be toppler. However, once the Rock became involved, it became Cena vs. the Rock. The Miz became a complete afterthought, and any face heat that Cena had up to that point was immediately sucked dry by the Rock.

 

Aside from covering up whatever perceived lack of progress Miz/Cena had made, I don't see what benefit Rock's involvement had to either of the other participants in the angle with him. Remember, it's about elevating everyone involved, not just one (part-time) wrestler at the expense of everyone else. I can say that Cena is primed for a big angle, but without turning him heel, I don't see what benefit it will be for him.

 

And they were elevated, in their own fashion. Things aren't all black and white, it is about elevation.. but it's not necessarily about benefitting everyone and making sure everyone goes home with 10+ points overness or something.

 

I'm not talking about the match itself, the match wasn't all that(Cena looked off last night) but everyone had their role inserted and it worked off well. Cena has a bone to pick, Miz retained in opportunistic heel fashion at the biggest stage of all. Even if Miz was an afterthought, they tried to salvage it by having Rock stomp on him too. But afterthought or not, in the grand scheme of things, it didn't hurt him all that much. Stuff like the video package helped set the stage and allow people to see where Miz has gotten today, shoddy win or not.

 

Nothing was sucked dry by The Rock since everyone is now awaiting for Cena's rebuttal, and if you took close attention to the angle, there's been a good fan contrast taking sides which is even more cemented after the ending. If anything, The Rock is keeping things interesting. Cena has dozens of ways to go from this, ball's in his court and how things continue will determine on whatever "heat" was sucked off or not.

[critical-23]

Don't know if it has been said but I will say it: I am not a big fan of Kurt Angle anymore. I still like to see him wrestle but after whining about WWE wrestlers using his moves...I just see him as a big baby now.

[The Final Countdown]

Don't know if it has been said but I will say it: I am not a big fan of Kurt Angle anymore. I still like to see him wrestle but after whining about WWE wrestlers using his moves...I just see him as a big baby now.

Didn't you hear? His twitter account was hacked!

 

Yeah, nice try Kurt...

 

Also, way to bury Daniel Bryan on commentary, Booker.

[critical-23]

Didn't you hear? His twitter account was hacked!

 

Yeah, nice try Kurt...

 

Also, way to bury Daniel Bryan on commentary, Booker.

 

Hacked? Doubt it! And I don't think Booker buried Bryan--just put over Sheamus more than Bryan. And Sin Cara? I thought it was a nice Sports Entertainment way to debut him.

[Eisen-verse]

Sin Cara's debut was pretty great; short and sweet. That said, Sheamus? That's who he comes out to attack? I'm really hoping there's more to that than just 'hey, I'm coming out to attack you'. If so, something more that is, then that'd be pretty interesting. If not, then a, somewhat, boring way to bring in a major-player.

 

Cheers.

 

E-V

[critical-23]

Sin Cara's debut was pretty great; short and sweet. That said, Sheamus? That's who he comes out to attack? I'm really hoping there's more to that than just 'hey, I'm coming out to attack you'. If so, something more that is, then that'd be pretty interesting. If not, then a, somewhat, boring way to bring in a major-player.

 

Cheers.

 

E-V

 

Yeah that's true but Sheamus (from my POV anyways) is a great starting point: 2-time WWE champion, current US champion and the guy can really move for someone his size just like Averno down in Mexico. Averno became highlighted in his losses to Mistico/Sin Cara and I believe Sheamus can do something similar here in the States if enough of the WWE universe can get behind Sin Cara like his Mexican fans did in Mexico.

 

My fingers are crossed. I know Sin Cara won't be the WWE champion, but I the guy has mystique about him and plenty of athleticism in him. So once again--my fingers are crossed lol.

[GhostDogg]

So..basically... we have to WAIT...FOR A YEAR?????

[Tha Black Phenom]

..I did not expect this. But it makes sense, WM is the only place that can host such a match-up. People on the streams were crying out of impatience as if we'd wanna see this match at a throwaway PPV like Extreme Rules, haha.

[critical-23]

So..basically... we have to WAIT...FOR A YEAR?????

 

I hate it but love it too: big money match that SHOULD be held in Florida.

[Eisen-verse]

So..basically... we have to WAIT...FOR A YEAR?????

 

Could be good though?

 

If he wrestles at Summerslam then the next night the Rock is gone... again.

 

In this case, while I don't expect him to be on RAW any more than once a month, this way we have him for much longer?

 

Cheers.

 

E-V

[borman_48]

Not surprising at all. Miami, FL. Rock's hometown. Wrestlemania. That is going to be huge, and WWE knows it. They have a year to build it. Of course, they also have a year to drop the ball with it I'm sure.

[Master Gilmore]

Anyone watching Tough Enough? That girl saying she "lost her basics" immediately made me think of TEW, of course.

[GhostDogg]

As I was talking to my friend on the phone, I realize something,

WWE can pull this off. but they have to be VERY CAREFUL. I mean hyping a match like this is like building a house out of matchsticks. Too much glue, it globs together, too little, it collapse.

 

Now, personally. I want the "E to turn Cena heel. And when he turns heel, I want him to go after EVERYONE! I mean I want him run rampant in the WWE, and destroy every Face in the roster calling out the Rock, actually being "haunted" by the fact he is never going to be good enough to be BETTER than the Rock. And also, he can turn against the fans. Saying that he gave the fans his blood, sweat and tears and even went so far as to get his pect (?? Is that right?) torn off for them. And what thanks does he get when the Rock comes back? Being hated on, so SCREW the fans!

 

I mean it worked before, Remember DIE ROCKY DIE?

 

 

I could be wrong, but I DOUBT IT..

 

(BTW: What do yall think of this new Tough Enough Show?)

[The Final Countdown]

Hacked? Doubt it!

Yeah, CM Punk didn't buy it either. Here's what he tweeted earlier:

 

"my twitter account was hacked", is the new: "I'm a sloppy drunk douche".

 

I love CM Punk.

[Gouge]

Although I personally would like to see a Cena heel run, I don't think it'd work for this at all. Turning the new gen fans against Cena when they're already pissed at the Rock probably isn't a good way to go about it.

 

Loved TE too. I was a big fan of the original series and I can confidently say that this installment is already much better. Guys & gals who WANT to be there (Well... most of them, anyway) and not just a bunch of failed actors trying to get on TV again. End was hilarious as hell - Melina vs. Alicia Fox?! Good to see the ones there for attention getting called out nice and early.

[Save_Us.Necro]

rock/cena will no doubt be botched in terms of buildup...i'm not really expceting much from it.

 

but wwe signing mox is a huge deal. he's easily (IMO) the best indy wrestler out there today and unlike most of the roster can cut a tremendous promo. i really hope they do nothing to his character and give him the Punk bring in (which won't happen sadly)

[ShaunGBD]

I love TE. love that she said what her favorite match was. LOL

[Slim Jim]

To the people complaining about the "filler" during Mania... how would you book it differently? A full on, four hour action-packed extravaganza? Well, good. But you'd have a tough time selling that to WWE; they have those lulls so people at the show can go to the concession stands and spend some cash.

 

Also gives people at home a chance to go to the toilet or grab some food, and since it's a four hour show, I'm grateful for that.

[Prophet]

I hate it but love it too: big money match that SHOULD be held in Florida.

 

Ahh, but Extreme Rules is in Tampa, Florida, so they didn't have to wait a whole year!

 

I'll admit, when Rock first said they were meeting, I was a little shocked ... what with it being a "dream match" and all. Wasn't until he mentioned the biggest stage that it made sense. Now it can simmer, with occasional reference, to keep it in our minds, until the full on press next December/January.

 

Also have to admit that Sin Cara jumping into a feud with Sheamus is kind of awesome. Unexpected, but awesome. At least if it is a feud, where he shoots for the title. Makes Bryan's dropping it seem a little more sensible.

[Zeel1]

Not too bad a Raw. Really liked Sin Cara's debut. I must say, I'm a little surprised they didn't debut him on SD! to have a match or two with Mysterio - partly because it's a dream match, partly because I feel him going over there would be a good way to establish him as the new top high flier, and partly because Mysterio's supposed to be on his way out and some hot matches with Sin Cara would be a nice way to go out. But I'm cool with him going right for Sheamus and the US title, that could make for a nice match.

 

Also, damn, the merch department works fast...

[Remianen]

To the people complaining about the "filler" during Mania... how would you book it differently? A full on, four hour action-packed extravaganza? Well, good. But you'd have a tough time selling that to WWE; they have those lulls so people at the show can go to the concession stands and spend some cash.

 

Also gives people at home a chance to go to the toilet or grab some food, and since it's a four hour show, I'm grateful for that.

 

*shrug* IMO, if you can't sit still for four hours without needing to potty, that sounds like a personal problem. I believe for something of this magnitude, the bathroom breaks should be kept to a bare minimum. Those angles would fit, given the quality of them (or lack thereof). And how much merchandise can you buy in, what was it, less than 2 minutes for the 8-man tag match? People aren't doing 4.2 40s to get to the concession stands.

 

How would I have done it? Simple. Sheamus-Bryan gets on the main show. Cole-Lawler gets the amount of time the 8-man tag got (if that). Rhodes-Mysterio gets 10 minutes (tops), Orton-Punk gets 13, and in TEW fashion, HHH-Taker would close the show (with the sight of Taker being stretchered out as the final moment). But then, I don't like Miz and didn't much care for that match. In fact, I went and made food for everyone (bacon wrapped scallops) when that match came on. I got back just before the double countout but watched it later on DVR. I'm glad I didn't pay for it (friend did so he could watch it on my bigscreen) because, even though $60 isn't much, I don't think this particular event held that much value to me. Others loved it so that's fine but besides HHH-Taker (a match that would've played well anywhere in the world), I wasn't impressed. Though I do think that HHH passing out in the Hell's Gate would've fit the "win or die trying" mantra better. But they seemed to have wanted the image of HHH "alive" and Taker near death so, tapout it is.

[Slim Jim]

*shrug* IMO, if you can't sit still for four hours without needing to potty, that sounds like a personal problem. I believe for something of this magnitude, the bathroom breaks should be kept to a bare minimum. Those angles would fit, given the quality of them (or lack thereof). And how much merchandise can you buy in, what was it, less than 2 minutes for the 8-man tag match? People aren't doing 4.2 40s to get to the concession stands.

 

It's not that I can't but given the choice, I'mma go. And I'm more grateful for the food/drink break without having to miss anything. As for how much merchandise you can buy during those skits... well, not that much (especially with a crowd that big) but 1) the Snoop Dogg segment got a fair bit of time as I recall, and Rock/Mae Young followed by Rock/Austin so you have time there and 2) even if you can't get there and back during those segments, it still limits how much you miss if you have to miss things.

 

How would I have done it? Simple. Sheamus-Bryan gets on the main show. Cole-Lawler gets the amount of time the 8-man tag got (if that).

 

I'd agree with this. I might even have bumped the 8-man from the main show, rather than do it the way they did.

 

Rhodes-Mysterio gets 10 minutes (tops), Orton-Punk gets 13

 

Hmm. Thought they were both good as they were; maybe shave a few minutes from Cody/Rey.

 

and in TEW fashion, HHH-Taker would close the show (with the sight of Taker being stretchered out as the final moment). But then, I don't like Miz and didn't much care for that match.

 

I thought that but... the biggest show of the year, I think they HAVE to have the main title on last. Even if the crowd are dead because it doesn't live up to a much better match earlier on. Still, it would have changed the post-show feeling totally if Taker/HHH ended the show, and in a good way.

 

But yeah, I think the point I was trying to make was that they book the way that is best for business and not to put on the best individual show possible. Sure, it's a shame but that's the way it goes. There's been a "cool down" match late on in Mania for a while now (usually a divas match) and it isn't because they think they're worthy of being amongst the Main Event; it's because they know people don't care and will use the time to go and buy stuff.