The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[Teh_Showtime]

<p>I got a kick out of Billy missing the stinger splash just like Ziggler a few weeks back</p><p> </p><p>

Now that he's back from his concussion I don't think they can deny the fans that dream match <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[shawn michaels]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I just finished the Triple H documentary. Pretty good watch and funny. I have never been a big fan of him, but I am looking forward to when he takes over for Vince. <p> </p><p> One of the funniest lines was Batista saying Triple H is the Michael Jordan of wrestling. <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I like HHH, but Thy Kindgom Come has made nothing to change (or help a bit) the notion that already exists from him. The Batista comment saying he's the Michael Jordan of wrestling just makes it worse. All & all, it was a fun watch, and a good thing to see if you're a HHH fan, or if you're a fan of the mainstream style DVD's from WWE. But at the end of the day, no matter how many times HHH wanted to say he was "in love" with wrestling, blah blah blah, no one's really going to believe it. And I'm not saying it's not true. Just saying or implying it 50.000 times along 3 hours won't help him at all. Just my 2 cents.</p><p> </p><p> Ps: I can even imagine Hunter writting the hole thing and sitting on his director chair, instruting people on how to compliment him. Now that would be fun to watch. <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[Comradebot]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Teh_Showtime" data-cite="Teh_Showtime" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I got a kick out of Billy missing the stinger splash just like Ziggler a few weeks back<p> </p><p> Now that he's back from his concussion I don't think they can deny the fans that dream match <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I demand a double clothesline that sends both men flying out of the ring from the most amazing dual overselling the world has ever seen.</p>

[shawn michaels]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Comradebot" data-cite="Comradebot" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I demand a double clothesline that sends both men flying out of the ring from the most amazing dual overselling the world has ever seen.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> As Seth Rollins would say..."I can fall over a barricade to this!" <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[Arrows]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I just finished the Triple H documentary. Pretty good watch and funny. I have never been a big fan of him, but I am looking forward to when he takes over for Vince. <p> </p><p> One of the funniest lines was Batista saying Triple H is the Michael Jordan of wrestling. <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It'll be GREAT!</p><p> </p><p> It's not like two of his boys aren't tag team champs. It's not like one of his boys isn't THE MAN. It's not like one of his boys got brought back to be handed the title for doing jack.</p><p> </p><p> Trips in charge will give so many new people cha........../stopspretending.</p>

[Teh_Showtime]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Arrows" data-cite="Arrows" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>It'll be GREAT!<p> </p><p> It's not like two of his boys aren't tag team champs. It's not like one of his boys isn't THE MAN. It's not like one of his boys got brought back to be handed the title for doing jack.</p><p> </p><p> Trips in charge will give so many new people cha........../stopspretending.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I never understood people acting like the outlaws were even HHH guys. The first thing they did when they went to TNA was crap all over him and Vince. Even back in DX he wanted to break up the stable to go solo against their wishes. People get worked way too easily when it comes to HHH which is hilarious to me because since his turn last year he has cemented himself as the greatest heel of all time in my opinion. Yes I said that</p><p> </p><p> And as for when HHH gets control, look at NXT. There are actually characters, there is basic storytelling, and it is widely considered the best weekly wrestling on TV all while being a 100% HHH product. Since he took control of developmental in 2011 it has improved tremendously not to mention people debuting now have a MUCH higher success rate. Compare the Shield or Wyatts to the debuts of any of the mid 00s failures from Kizarny, Eric Escobar, numerous others and hell Drew McIntyre is the only one left pretty much and he's in this generation's job squad.</p>

[bigtplaystew]

The tag team division revival is all HHH too from what I understand. That's been some good stuff.

[lazorbeak]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Teh_Showtime" data-cite="Teh_Showtime" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>People get worked way too easily when it comes to HHH which is hilarious to me because since his turn last year he has cemented himself as the greatest heel of all time in my opinion. Yes I said that</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm not a Triple H hater, but that opinion is pretty far out there. He's not even the best heel in his immediate family. He's not an all-time draw over a period of time the way Flair is, he never drew huge the way that the Rock did, his times as #1 heel have seen pretty big drops both in terms of business and entertainment... he's just not even on the board for top heels. I mean he's the definition of a "B+" guy. It's just that he's a B+ guy who didn't retire due or leave the business or work a part time schedule the way every other main eventer from WWF's last boom period did.</p>

[dpoolez]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm not a Triple H hater, but that opinion is pretty far out there. He's not even the best heel in his immediate family. He's not an all-time draw over a period of time the way Flair is, he never drew huge the way that the Rock did, his times as #1 heel have seen pretty big drops both in terms of business and entertainment... he's just not even on the board for top heels. I mean he's the definition of a "B+" guy. It's just that he's a B+ guy who didn't retire due or leave the business or work a part time schedule the way every other main eventer from WWF's last boom period did.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The first few years that he was on top (99-00) the WWE did great business. As for 2002-2004, the WWE had to deal with a brand split splitting their star power, Rock and Austin leaving, and to blame the ratings drop on HHH is partially disingenuous because ratings started slipping in 2001, a year that he was gone for most of. You're also forgetting that DX was and still is a huge draw and Triple H was a major component of that for all of its important incarnations.</p><p> </p><p> Triple H is easily a top 5 GOAT heel just on how greatly he can work both marks and smarks. Anybody that can get adults on FB acting like marks when he screws DB over deserves a GOAT heel nod IMO. Then you have the smark conspiracy theories about Triple H's backstage powers whenever he gets a win, understating when he does put somebody over or his NXT involvement, etc.</p><p> </p><p> I admit that I am a big Trips fan when I say this, but his ability to work everybody is second to none right now.</p>

[lazorbeak]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="dpoolez" data-cite="dpoolez" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The first few years that he was on top (99-00) the WWE did great business. As for 2002-2004, the WWE had to deal with a brand split splitting their star power, Rock and Austin leaving, and to blame the ratings drop on HHH is partially disingenuous because ratings started slipping in 2001, a year that he was gone for most of. You're also forgetting that DX was and still is a huge draw and Triple H was a major component of that for all of its important incarnations.<p> </p><p> Triple H is easily a top 5 GOAT heel just on how greatly he can work both marks and smarks. Anybody that can get adults on FB acting like marks when he screws DB over deserves a GOAT heel nod IMO. Then you have the smark conspiracy theories about Triple H's backstage powers whenever he gets a win, understating when he does put somebody over or his NXT involvement, etc.</p><p> </p><p> I admit that I am a big Trips fan when I say this, but his ability to work everybody is second to none right now.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> He wasn't a heel in most versions of DX, so that doesn't effect what I'm talking about anyway. You're right that in part the business started falling off a bit while he was gone, but that just goes to how little he moves the needle- Austin's turn hurt business, Rock's leaving hurt business, Triple H never really had any appreciable positive effect on business in any way, and my point is it's pretty short-sighted to say he's the "greatest heel of all time" when he's never been able to sell a PPV or fill a house the way Ric Flair, Harley Race, Billy Graham, Gorgeous George, Roddy Piper, Jerry Lawler, or plenty of others did before him. And that's just off the very top of my head.</p><p> </p><p> Realistically, he's a tier below all of those guys.</p>

[Teh_Showtime]

<p>DX was heel for the bulk of it, especially considering that Kane was a face during the interactions with HHH in early 1999</p><p> </p><p>

From 94-2001 here is an interesting list</p><p> </p><p>

Average Buyrate, by people in singles matches for the WWF title (minumum three matches):</p><p>

Rock: 1.44</p><p>

HHH: 1.29</p><p>

Austin: 1.24</p><p>

Angle: 1.24</p><p>

Foley (all forms): 1</p><p>

Undertaker: 0.89</p><p>

Shawn Michaels: 0.87</p><p>

Bret Hart: 0.87</p><p>

Nash: 0.78</p><p>

Sid: 0.61</p><p>

Bulldog: 0.44</p><p> </p><p>

Now I'm not saying HHH is a bigger draw than Austin by any stretch of the imagination because it's obvious Austin is pulled down a bit from 96-97 when business was in the crapper but let's not act like HHH didn't draw money. HHH also worked in an era where he didn't NEED to be able to draw tons of people like the territory days because the WWE/F has always been about faces driving the ticket sales anyways. You won't hear people trying to give Piper credit for drawing 20,000 when they were clearly due to Hogan. Backlash 2000 featured Rock vs HHH in a singles match with no Austin even on the card (he made a run in) and got the largest non WM/SS buyrate ever at that time</p><p> </p><p>

Instead of notorious HHH haters (like Jim Cornette) constantly spouting that he didn't draw, he was far and away the 3rd biggest draw of the attitude era and it's just facts that nobody would be able to prevent the kind of fall they had in 2002 when the top 2 stars of all time leave at the same time... it's called a peak for a reason. And furthermore if HHH wasn't a draw what do you consider Kurt Angle? Foley? Undertaker? So because he's not in the bracket as the top 3 draws in the history of the business (including Hogan) means he is irrelevant?</p>

[Truly]

<p></p><div style="text-align:center;"><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;">LONG WINDED RAMBLE ALERT</span></strong></p></div><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p>

I recently gave WWE 2k14 a try after seeing that it was available for rent through Redbox. I dabbled in a few areas of the game but the main feature that held my attention was 30 Years of Wrestlemania mode and I was pleasantly surprised by how it had drawn me in. WM9's ending however caught me completely off-guard.</p><p> </p><p>

I'm not nearly one to claim to be a true pro wrestling historian, the first match that Shelton Benjamin and Triple H had together back in '04 was what really sparked me into becoming an actual fan. As I got older and more appreciative of the form of entertainment, I looked for older videos that gave me an idea of how the Monday Night Wars were, what made ECW the revolutionary underground phenomena it was, and just how big of an impact WWF's Attitude Era had on the boom in the late '90s.</p><p> </p><p>

I never looked back further than that however. Not to discount or disrespect the legendary greats, but I just never saw a reason or had an urge to look further back than the '90s as I thought it could get no better than that. Boy was I impressed. As I started playing the 30 years of Wrestlemania Mode what immediately hit me as I started out in the period of Hulkamania were simply the characters and their larger than life, over the top personas that just screamed "unforgettable".I can't lie and say I had seen a lot of Macho Man Randy Savage videos prior to playing the game; in all honesty more than 75% of my knowledge of him I had learned was from this game itself via the cutscenes and the promo vignettes (the promo they show Savage delivering prior to his match with Hogan in WM5 was masterful).</p><p> </p><p>

Fast-forward, I really balked at how the ending of WM9 turned out (my WM knowledge is kind of foggy before WMXII), I was shocked to see Hart lose the title to Yokozuna only for Hogan to immediately be challenged by Mr. Fuji and the outcome being Hogan's the new champion afterwards! I was thinking to myself, "Wow, Hogan's ego had to be out of this world for management to make that happen", but eventually from a business perspective and after some online research I could see how it made sense. With the company in a transition stage, management knew Hulk Hogan was on his way out and the WWE was left without a legitimate top guy. Bret Hart may have been the champion going into Mania 9 but he won the title at a house show and hadn't defended the title against any big names. He was the world champion but not really an established top guy that the WWE could ride with.</p><p> </p><p>

The only way that a new set of main eventers could be established would be for Hogan to help create them because at the time he was the only guy in the company capable of doing that. Yokozuna was establishing himself as a dominant heel but defeating a 1 time World Champion who held the title for 6 months with no major defenses wasn't going to make him the unbeatable monster that the company wanted him to be. Bret Hart had the potential to be a top guy but he needed to defeat someone that would get him over as a legitimate top guy.</p><p> </p><p>

Cue the Mania 9 ending. Yokozuna with a little help from Mr Fuji defeats Bret Hart for the title. Hulk Hogan comes to check on Bret and the cocky champion's manager issues a challenge to the Hulkster for an impromptu title match. A very tired and worn down Yoko is then caught off guard early and Hogan comes away with a quick victory. This did not bury Yoko. He had just been through a grueling match and then the greatest champion in WWE history came out fresh and got a quick, kind of fluke victory over him. This also allowed the fans to go home happy which up until the Attitude Era was the case at every single Wrestlemania. It wasn't until Mania 16 that a heel would be victorious to close Wrestlemania.</p><p> </p><p>

A couple moths later in a one on one match with both men fresh Yokozuna defeated Hulk Hogan. He kicked out of a leg drop and got the victory in a one on one match up against the greatest WWE superstar of all time. Hogan left the WWE after this and Yokozuna basically became the guy who ended Hulkamania. If that isn't getting someone over as a top, domiannt heel then I don't know what is. Just beating Bret at Mania would not have had nearly the same effect.</p><p> </p><p>

This not only helped Yoko but also Bret Hart. As the story goes, Hogan did not want to lose the title to Bret because he didn't want to be pinned cleanly by another face. The only other way to get Bret over as a top guy would be to have him pin a seemingly unpinnable superstar. At Wrestlemania 10 Bret did just that. Yokozuna had been WWE Champion for nearly a year, he was known as the guy who ended Hulkamania, and he had never been pinned before. Bret pinning him in the main event at Mania was the big win he needed to truly establish himself as "the man."</p><p> </p><p>

I know this was a lot of rambling but basically what I'm getting at is that while the Mania 9 ending may have seemed awful it really wasn't that bad and it did exactly what it was supposed to do in the long run. If the ending doesn't happen that way then the fans go home pissed, Yoko doesn't become as dominant as a heel because he may not have ended Hulkamania a few months later, and Bret isn't able to get that huge victory to truly establish himself at the top.</p>

[lazorbeak]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Teh_Showtime" data-cite="Teh_Showtime" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>DX was heel for the bulk of it, especially considering that Kane was a face during the interactions with HHH in early 1999</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Zuh? He specifically left DX when he turned heel in '99. And his babyface runs in the 2000's with HBK were longer than either?</p><p> </p><p> I'm not crapping on HHH, but the reality is that he's a B+ talent who benefited immensely from working with not one but two all-time huge stars. The idea that that somehow makes him the "greatest heel of all time" is the part that's just not supported by anything. Nowhere did I or anybody call him "irrelevant." And I mentioned six guys off the top of my head that I'd put ahead of him off the top of my head.</p>

[djthefunkchris]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Truly" data-cite="Truly" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div style="text-align:center;"><div><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"><snip></span></strong></div><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> </span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> I know this was a lot of rambling but basically what I'm getting at is that while the Mania 9 ending may have seemed awful it really wasn't that bad and it did exactly what it was supposed to do in the long run. If the ending doesn't happen that way then the fans go home pissed, Yoko doesn't become as dominant as a heel because he may not have ended Hulkamania a few months later, and Bret isn't able to get that huge victory to truly establish himself at the top.</span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> </span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> Someone posted a while ago here, that they heard WWE plans things out to at least six months away. You just described them doing a one year plan for Bret, around what... almost 20 years ago? </span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> </span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> This is why I 'try' not to get upset with stuff in the here and now. The WWE has been known to think long term since back in the 80's, and although plans get changed on the fly, a show here and there gets re-wrote, the over all long term plans are still in motion. I say 'try', because I'm not always as patient as I'd like to think I am.</span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> </span></strong></p><p><strong><span style="font-size:14px;"> I don't take any of the "WWE is doomed/They are burying Daniel Bryan" stuff seriously at all. He gets more average screen time then any two other stars, which is the opposite of burying. Spoilers said they had big long term plans for him a few months back, Long term isn't a few months. Spoilers also read that they felt they could elevate his popularity by having him have to chase the title. It's definitely worked so far. He is going to be even more popular then he is already, by the time this is through.</span></strong></p></div></blockquote>

[TLCJR4LIFE]

<p>So phil has officially quit but that whining hypocrite will probably crawl back soon when he realizes he has nothing better to do in his miserable life.</p><p> </p><p>

In the meantime, more screen time for Sheamus and Bryan and all the other guys who work hard every night without whining.</p>

[Truly]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Someone posted a while ago here, that they heard WWE plans things out to at least six months away. You just described them doing a one year plan for Bret, around what... almost 20 years ago? <p> </p><p> This is why I 'try' not to get upset with stuff in the here and now. The WWE has been known to think long term since back in the 80's, and although plans get changed on the fly, a show here and there gets re-wrote, the over all long term plans are still in motion. I say 'try', because I'm not always as patient as I'd like to think I am.</p><p> </p><p> I don't take any of the "WWE is doomed/They are burying Daniel Bryan" stuff seriously at all. He gets more average screen time then any two other stars, which is the opposite of burying. Spoilers said they had big long term plans for him a few months back, Long term isn't a few months. Spoilers also read that they felt they could elevate his popularity by having him have to chase the title. It's definitely worked so far. He is going to be even more popular then he is already, by the time this is through.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You're absolutely right. If history is anything to go by, take Austin as another example. Even with his meteoric rise following the genesis of the 3:16, it took nearly, what, a year and a half from his KOTR victory before he won the big one against HBK at WM14. During that Austin feuded with Bret for nearly a year, not scoring a victory over Hart until after their WM13 match.A tag title, ic title run, and a Bret Hart departure later, it's apparent that Austin was on the cusp of officially being "The Man". A long development but it was needed.</p>

[The Final Countdown]

Did Austin <em>ever</em> beat Bret? If he did, I don't remember. Not like it mattered, because losing that I Quit match the way he did did more for him than winning it possibly could have.

[Teh_Showtime]

He eliminated him to win the 97 Rumble if that counts.

[djthefunkchris]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="The Final Countdown" data-cite="The Final Countdown" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Did Austin <em>ever</em> beat Bret? If he did, I don't remember. Not like it mattered, because losing that I Quit match the way he did did more for him than winning it possibly could have.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I agree 200% with you.</p><p> </p><p> At times I think they have played with doing something similar with Cena. I can actually see it happening with him and Bryan down the line, which I think would almost be as good if built correctly..... Bryan trying to make him tap, Cena "Not giving up" and passing out. It's not going to help him with the boo's or anything, but if they build Bryan up far enough, it could have a really good impact for both of them.</p>

[delv213]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="The Final Countdown" data-cite="The Final Countdown" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Did Austin <em>ever</em> beat Bret? If he did, I don't remember. Not like it mattered, because losing that I Quit match the way he did did more for him than winning it possibly could have.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Completely agree, Bret did more for Austin by winning that match then he could've ever done by losing. I remember reading a Observer years ago saying Austin was suppose to feud with Bret post Wrestlemania 14 after he was champion, and seeing how Bret was the top heel in the WWF at the time and Austin was being positioned to become the face of the company, it would make perfect sense. With Bret already 2-0 against Austin in Singles competition, it would've been a cool little feud with Austin obviously going over.</p>

[Truly]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="The Final Countdown" data-cite="The Final Countdown" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Did Austin <em>ever</em> beat Bret? If he did, I don't remember. Not like it mattered, because losing that I Quit match the way he did did more for him than winning it possibly could have.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Wikipedia" data-cite="Wikipedia" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Austin eventually got his revenge on Hart in the main event of In Your House 14: Revenge of the 'Taker, in a match to determine the number-one contender to The Undertaker's WWF Championship. Austin won when Hart was disqualified due to assistance from The British Bulldog, earning him a title match against The Undertaker at In Your House 15: A Cold Day In Hell. Austin faced Hart once again in a street fight on the April 21 episode of Raw, injuring his opponent's leg with a steel chair during the bout. The match was ultimately awarded to Austin when Hart refused to tap out of the Sharpshooter. He proceeded to beat Hart while on a stretcher in the back of an ambulance.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> By the way, Austin lost the title match against Taker via interference from Pillman. The way they developed Stone Cold's character, carefully booking when he would go over someone or not, really maximized the effect of his climb to the top in my opinion. Would he have had the same impact if he was just hotshotted to the top? I honestly don't think so. The way WWE is handling the Bryan situation is the right way to go about it if history has a say in it.</p>

[RayW]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Truly" data-cite="Truly" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>By the way, Austin lost the title match against Taker via interference from Pillman. The way they developed Stone Cold's character, carefully booking when he would go over someone or not, really maximized the effect of his climb to the top in my opinion. Would he have had the same impact if he was just hotshotted to the top? I honestly don't think so. The way WWE is handling the Bryan situation is the right way to go about it if history has a say in it.</div></blockquote><p> I've recently been re-watching the WWF from around early 1996, and my next event to watch is In Your House 15. The whole Bret Hart and Steve Austin thing is awesome (I missed out on this by about a year, I didn't start watching the WWF until around mid to late 1998). Austin is full out loose cannon at this point, while Bret is (looking very uncomfortable while) doing his anti-American gimmick, reuniting the Hart Foundation, this time with Bulldog, Owen and Pillman. Very entertaining stuff.</p>

[delv213]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="RayW" data-cite="RayW" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I've recently been re-watching the WWF from around early 1996, and my next event to watch is In Your House 15. The whole Bret Hart and Steve Austin thing is awesome (I missed out on this by about a year, I didn't start watching the WWF until around mid to late 1998). Austin is full out loose cannon at this point, while Bret is (looking very uncomfortable while) doing his anti-American gimmick, reuniting the Hart Foundation, this time with Bulldog, Owen and Pillman. Very entertaining stuff.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Bret was in WCW feuding with Flair and Perfect by 1998. I always find it odd when people think Bret was a mark for himself. Bret was treated like a hero during his Anti-American stuff here in Canada during 1997. People in wrestling always laugh when they say Bret thought he was a Canadian hero and took himself too seriously, in reality he was voted 39th Greatest Canadian by CBC in 2004. Saying he was a hero here isn't too much of a stretch.</p>

[bigtplaystew]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Truly" data-cite="Truly" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>By the way, Austin lost the title match against Taker via interference from Pillman. The way they developed Stone Cold's character, carefully booking when he would go over someone or not, really maximized the effect of his climb to the top in my opinion. Would he have had the same impact if he was just hotshotted to the top? I honestly don't think so. The way WWE is handling the Bryan situation is the right way to go about it if history has a say in it.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I think you're so on point with this stuff. Good post(s)!</p><p> </p><p> I don't think DB is being handled nearly as carefully as Austin was when they realized they had something. But different times, different situations, and two very different types of stars. </p><p> </p><p> There's a mentality going around that Daniel Bryan doesn't need to win to get more popular. It seems that this is true, and in some cases his losses have propelled him further. I think had he defeated Sheamus in a run-of-the-mill Wrestlemania match it would not have been nearly as good for his character as getting knocked out in seconds was. </p><p> </p><p> I just think some wins would help too. He needs a few big wins this year. He was being booked as a guy who isn't getting it done when guys like Cena and Punk managed to do so no matter what the odds were. The big win over Orton with the subsequent screwing over by HHH was awesome. That's the kind of stuff he needs to go forward, and so far they're doing stuff like that. I don't mind them taking their time with this, it's probably the right way to go.</p>

[milamber]

<p>Personally I'm in the camp of people who just enjoy Bryan being on TV every week. You can put him in a match with anyone and at the very least I'll be entertained. And there's always a chance he'll put on damn good match with a quality opponent.</p><p> </p><p>

A lot of people seem to forget he went clean over Cena in a face vs face match before being screwed by HHH. Sure, he lost the title to Orton a few seconds later, but if that doesn't scream big push I don't know what does. He also got some impressive wins over the Shield and when he did lose it due to overwhelming odds.</p><p> </p><p>

He had to lose to Bray to get Bray over but the match was so damn good it didn't hurt Bryan one bit. If anything the Authority storyline still bubbling in the background guarantees that people will still chant for Bryan even he were to go on a losing streak. </p><p> </p><p>

Post-mania he should go on a winning streak for a few months to build up to him taking the title off of Batista.</p>