Official MLB Discussion Thread

[BHK1978]

I no very little about Japanese Baseball, but what type of rotation do they use over there? Is it a Three-Men, Four-Men, or Five-Men?

 

No wonder why he and Nomo start to stink after a couple of seasons over here. With that many innings pitched, it is no wonder why they wear their arms out.

[Slagaholic]

lmao why? is it cuz you think Lee is better than that or because he is worse than it?

 

Because I'm a Phillies fan.

 

I think having Cliff Lee signed to Halladay's deal, Kyle Drabek and Michael Taylor is a lot better than just having Halladay. Ruben Amaro offered Cliff Lee the exact deal he signed Halladay. Lee's agent said "No I want to be a free agent." Ruben trades Lee for 1 and a quarter good prospects, and traded 2 of his top 3 prospects for Halladay. This after getting rid of everything semblance of talent in the upper minors for Lee in the first place.

 

Ruben Amaro has ruined this team. The decline has begun, thanks to Ruben. Every single move he has made as GM has been a poor decision. If it's not poorly thought out, it is certainly poorly executed.

 

TWO more years of Ibanez. TWO! **** YOU RUBEN

[GatorBait19]

I no very little about Japanese Baseball, but what type of rotation do they use over there? Is it a Three-Men, Four-Men, or Five-Men?

 

No wonder why he and Nomo start to stink after a couple of seasons over here. With that many innings pitched, it is no wonder why they wear their arms out.

 

im not sure about that, I have heard of teams using 3 or 4

 

also i think they play three different seasons (spring, summer, fall)

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_in_Japan#Differences_with_Major_League_Baseball

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nippon_Professional_Baseball#Single_Season_Pitching

[GatorBait19]

Wow Rays are such an odd team

 

they have now been no hit twice and been involved in a perfect game

 

the number 1 offense and they can't get anything, and they were avg. 5 runs a game vs Barden

 

A guy who they ripped into last week two, it makes no sense sometimes with them

[BHK1978]

I guess Stephen Strasburg is the real deal, or he is at least down in the minors. Washington needs to bring him up, I am not sure why they plan to keep him in the minors until June. Bring him up now, the franchise is doing pretty good and you are not drawing the crowds. Now would be a great time to bring up the young pitcher that your fans want to see.

 

Granted, Washington has historically never supported their baseball teams. Hence the reason why we have the Twins and Rangers now...

[PoisonedSuperman]

Going to Yankees next Tuesday and Wednesday...

 

Tuesday is against Redsux and Beckett, I think Vasquez is pitching.

 

Wednesday is against Tampa and will be C.C vs. Wade Davis.

 

Last year I went to my first game, Yankees lost to Tampa Baby. I believe it was May 8th but might of been the 9th. It was the game before A-Rod came back. Yankees lost to Tampa Bay, Mo Rivera lost the game (Giradi shouldn't of put him in a tie game). Sand man entrance is amazing! Every Yankee fan should go to one game before this guy retires!

[PoisonedSuperman]

I guess Stephen Strasburg is the real deal, or he is at least down in the minors. Washington needs to bring him up, I am not sure why they plan to keep him in the minors until June. Bring him up now, the franchise is doing pretty good and you are not drawing the crowds. Now would be a great time to bring up the young pitcher that your fans want to see.

 

Granted, Washington has historically never supported their baseball teams. Hence the reason why we have the Twins and Rangers now...

 

If you bring him up in June (I believe after the draft, but not sure) this season will not count towards his eligibility towards free agency... so you get an extra half of season of him stayin in Washington.

[Imarevenant]

I guess Stephen Strasburg is the real deal, or he is at least down in the minors. Washington needs to bring him up, I am not sure why they plan to keep him in the minors until June. Bring him up now, the franchise is doing pretty good and you are not drawing the crowds. Now would be a great time to bring up the young pitcher that your fans want to see.

 

Granted, Washington has historically never supported their baseball teams. Hence the reason why we have the Twins and Rangers now...

 

It's all about delaying his eligibility for free agency. You need 6 years in the majors before you can become a free agent. By delaying when they bring him up to June they pretty much gain an extra season as he won't have a full 6 seasons worth under his belt come 2015 or whatever.

 

Teams do this type of stuff all the time to avoid free agency or "Super 2" rules.

[BHK1978]

It's all about delaying his eligibility for free agency. You need 6 years in the majors before you can become a free agent. By delaying when they bring him up to June they pretty much gain an extra season as he won't have a full 6 seasons worth under his belt come 2015 or whatever.

 

Teams do this type of stuff all the time to avoid free agency or "Super 2" rules.

 

Okay I was wondering why hold him down there until June. I think it is safe to say, once he has the chance he will bolt from that god awful franchise.

[Stennick]

Okay I was wondering why hold him down there until June. I think it is safe to say, once he has the chance he will bolt from that god awful franchise.

 

It all depends really Washington has some guys in the farm system so whos to say what will happen in six years. Remember there was a time Tampa was awful as well and now look at them. Six years is a lot of time to turn something around and I think their trying to put the pieces together.

[BHK1978]

It all depends really Washington has some guys in the farm system so whos to say what will happen in six years. Remember there was a time Tampa was awful as well and now look at them. Six years is a lot of time to turn something around and I think their trying to put the pieces together.

 

Yeah but how long can a team like Tampa Bay stay together? The minute their players come up for free agency big market teams will snatch them up.

[Stennick]

Yeah but like you guys said if they got six years before their free agents thats a solid six year run very few teams not named the Yankees and Sox hold onto a team for more than six years and the thought process is to then continue to develop players to take their place.

 

Thats the theory anyway Oakland has done well for themselves by trading away big stars and staying on top. Oakland and Tampa are really the first teams in a while to employ the farm system strategy.

 

Although my own St. Louis Cards have had Pujols, Molina, Wainwright, and some others have all came up through the system and we've used other guys like Brett Wallace, Clay Mortenson, Perez, etc. to get guys like Holliday.

[GatorBait19]

Yeah but how long can a team like Tampa Bay stay together? The minute their players come up for free agency big market teams will snatch them up.

 

Remember the Twins trade away players when they can't resign them, the Rays will do the same, even if the Rays are in first and second they will still listen for offers for Pena and Crawford

 

Also, the Rays became good not just because of a great farm system, but more because they were patience with their talent, they didn't rush Longo to the big show, alongside Niemann, Price, Davis. They let them develop and it has worked nicely for them

[GatorBait19]

Yeah but like you guys said if they got six years before their free agents thats a solid six year run very few teams not named the Yankees and Sox hold onto a team for more than six years and the thought process is to then continue to develop players to take their place.

 

Thats the theory anyway Oakland has done well for themselves by trading away big stars and staying on top. Oakland and Tampa are really the first teams in a while to employ the farm system strategy.

 

Although my own St. Louis Cards have had Pujols, Molina, Wainwright, and some others have all came up through the system and we've used other guys like Brett Wallace, Clay Mortenson, Perez, etc. to get guys like Holliday.

 

Twins, Redsox, and Marlins as well. Yes, the soxs spend money in the free agent market, but they also have a mix of their own players paps, dustin, Jacob, Jed Lowire (when he gets healthy), Lester, Buckholtz, just to name a few. Also remember the best SS in the game was trade to the Marlins from the Soxs

[Slagaholic]

Remember the Twins trade away players when they can't resign them, the Rays will do the same, even if the Rays are in first and second they will still listen for offers for Pena and Crawford

 

Also, the Rays became good not just because of a great farm system, but more because they were patience with their talent, they didn't rush Longo to the big show, alongside Niemann, Price, Davis. They let them develop and it has worked nicely for them

 

The Rays also had a decade full of top draft picks. They're a well built team, but when I talk about a team re-building the last team I point to, that's turned it around, are the Rays.

[GatorBait19]

The Rays also had a decade full of top draft picks. They're a well built team, but when I talk about a team re-building the last team I point to, that's turned it around, are the Rays.

 

can you explain that please, it has me confused, are you saying they will be able to rebuild quickly next year or saying it will take a while?

 

 

and also remember about the rays great draft success has only come recently. New ownership and GM took over in 2005 (offseason, but played a big part in the 04 draft)

 

so now we look at who the first front office drafted

 

names like Upton, Crawford, Huff (a 5th rounder), Shields(16th round), Rocco, Dukes, and Young (Hamilton too if you want) now only 3 remain and only One has been an all-star while Upton tries to find sucess and Shields is getting back to 08 form

 

 

New Office has found the likes of Niemann, Brignac, Davis, Longoria, Price, made trades for Soriano (closer) Bartlett, and Garza and signed Pena

 

in fact out of 7 drafts the Rays have been apart before the new ownership took over in which we had a first round pick, the rays failed horribly, only collecting three solid everyday starters for themselves and 6 all together, and Huff and Shields wont be apart of this next number because it's top three rounds only and in 1998 we had no picks in the first three rounds (due to free agent signings) and in 2000 no picks in the 2nd,3rd, or 4th so out of 20 picks 2 are still with the Rays and 5 are still playing ball big league ball.

 

The Rays pretty much wasted years of top draft picks because they rushed them to fast or people failed for other reasons (i.e Rocco and Josh H.)

[BHK1978]

Twins, Redsox, and Marlins as well. Yes, the soxs spend money in the free agent market, but they also have a mix of their own players paps, dustin, Jacob, Jed Lowire (when he gets healthy), Lester, Buckholtz, just to name a few. Also remember the best SS in the game was trade to the Marlins from the Soxs

 

When was Jeter in the Red Sox minor league system!

[CQI13]

can you explain that please, it has me confused, are you saying they will be able to rebuild quickly next year or saying it will take a while?

 

 

and also remember about the rays great draft success has only come recently. New ownership and GM took over in 2005 (offseason, but played a big part in the 04 draft)

 

so now we look at who the first front office drafted

 

names like Upton, Crawford, Huff (a 5th rounder), Shields(16th round), Rocco, Dukes, and Young (Hamilton too if you want) now only 3 remain and only One has been an all-star while Upton tries to find sucess and Shields is getting back to 08 form

 

 

New Office has found the likes of Niemann, Brignac, Davis, Longoria, Price, made trades for Soriano (closer) Bartlett, and Garza and signed Pena

 

in fact out of 7 drafts the Rays have been apart before the new ownership took over in which we had a first round pick, the rays failed horribly, only collecting three solid everyday starters for themselves and 6 all together, and Huff and Shields wont be apart of this next number because it's top three rounds only and in 1998 we had no picks in the first three rounds (due to free agent signings) and in 2000 no picks in the 2nd,3rd, or 4th so out of 20 picks 2 are still with the Rays and 5 are still playing ball big league ball.

 

The Rays pretty much wasted years of top draft picks because they rushed them to fast or people failed for other reasons (i.e Rocco and Josh H.)

 

But they had access to those picks. It's just like you expect the Clippers to be good with that many top picks in basketball. The fact that they've been squandered by their front office doesn't take away from the fact that they had the picks to begin with.

[GatorBait19]

When was Jeter in the Red Sox minor league system!

 

lol when has he ever been the best SS lmao sorry had to

[GatorBait19]

The Rays also had a decade full of top draft picks. They're a well built team, but when I talk about a team re-building the last team I point to, that's turned it around, are the Rays.

 

But they had access to those picks. It's just like you expect the Clippers to be good with that many top picks in basketball. The fact that they've been squandered by their front office doesn't take away from the fact that they had the picks to begin with.

 

you said they had a decade full of top picks, so I took it as you were saying they hit on all their top picks.

 

and teams don't need top picks to be great, look at players like Crawford, Pedroia, Pujols, Mike Pizza, Kenny Rogers, Roy Oswalt, Dan Uggla, Mike Lowell, Jason Bay.

 

So top picks don't mean a org. will be great, it's the middle where you find the role players and final pieces.

 

But I agree, Rays are a great team right now and are loaded still in the farm system with names like Beckham, McGee, Hellickson, Jennings, Joyce ect. waiting to fill people's shoes, and Tampa still has the number 1 farm system, even after failing to sign their top two picks last year and bringing up their number 1 pitcher and number 4 and 8 prospects in Brignac and Sean Rod.

[BHK1978]

<p>Pizza had to be one of the best draft pickups in the history of Baseball in my opinion. I mean for what he turned into and where he was picked, talk about value.</p><p> </p><p>

Maybe as a Yankee fan I see this more than if I were a fan of another team. However, I think the Yankees have been good at finding some gems in the draft over the past twenty years of so. And they have been able to move some of those players for players that they need. All though that trade with Detroit looks like it is going to bite them where the sun don't shine.</p>

[GatorBait19]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BHK1978" data-cite="BHK1978" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26724" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Pizza had to be one of the best draft pickups in the history of Baseball in my opinion. I mean for what he turned into and where he was picked, talk about value.<p> </p><p> Maybe as a Yankee fan I see this more than if I were a fan of another team. However, I think the Yankees have been good at finding some gems in the draft over the past twenty years of so. And they have been able to move some of those players for players that they need. All though that trade with Detroit looks like it is going to bite them where the sun don't shine.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> do you remember Buhner lol, but I don't know from 00-07</p><p> </p><p> 2000: Best pick Sean Henn</p><p> 2001: Shelley Duncan</p><p> 2002: Phil Coke</p><p> 2003: Tyler Clippard</p><p> 2004: Phil Hughes</p><p> 2005: Austin Jackson..... oh wait:rolleyes:</p><p> 2006: Joba and Ian (Joba might be your next closer)</p><p> 2007: Can't tell yet</p><p> </p><p> so from the start it was horrible, but you guys have improved</p><p> </p><p> but 97 to 05 (remember Hughes is the only one to make it so far from that 04 draft) has been horrible and most of it is the constant free agents they sign</p>

[Stennick]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="GatorBait19" data-cite="GatorBait19" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26724" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Remember the Twins trade away players when they can't resign them, the Rays will do the same, even if the Rays are in first and second they will still listen for offers for Pena and Crawford<p> </p><p> Also, the Rays became good not just because of a great farm system, but more because they were patience with their talent, they didn't rush Longo to the big show, alongside Niemann, Price, Davis. They let them develop and it has worked nicely for them</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I guess that depends on the trade but it would have to be a hell of a trade to trade away either of those guys if they were in first or second.</p>

[BHK1978]

<p>Okay I am putting down names of players that turned into good major league players that either stayed with the Yankees or were let go by them via trade or free agency. Remember I am just talking about who they drafted and not what they did for the team.</p><p> </p><p>

1990: Andy Pettitte possible Hall of Famer (might not be because of the roids and his numbers might not be strong enough).</p><p> </p><p>

Jorge Posada a durable Catcher who has helped them win and win a lot.</p><p> </p><p>

Carl Everett: Went on to have a decent Major League career</p><p> </p><p>

1991: I refuse to talk about the blight that was Brien Taylor.<img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p>

1992: They drafted Jeter who is a future Hall of Famer</p><p> </p><p>

1995: Mike Lowell turned into a very good 3B.</p><p> </p><p>

1996: Nick Johnson who became a decent utility player.</p><p> </p><p>

2005: Brett Gardner who is a decent player who has helped the team out.</p><p> </p><p>

Also guys like Ricky Ledee who may have not turned into great players but were traded for good players.</p>

[Stennick]

<p>I thought their track record was better than that. Its not bad but its also not great. Then again I remember hearing about how Jr. really revitalized the farm system for NY refocusing on it. In the last few years it looked like they had an entire starting rotation coming up with Joba, Ian, Hughes and somebody else I can't remember. </p><p> </p><p>

The Cardinals have had just off the top of my head. </p><p> </p><p>

Danny Haren (2nd in Cy Young voting on two occasions I think)</p><p>

Adam Wainwright (3rd in Cy Young voting last year)</p><p>

Albert Pujols </p><p>

Yadier Molina (argubably the best defensive catcher in baseball)</p><p>

Skip Schumaker (.300 hitter over the last four seasons)</p><p>

Brendan Ryan (gold glove caliber SS for the last two years)</p><p>

Brett Wallace (we traded him for Matt Holliday)</p><p>

J.D Drew </p><p>

Colby Rasmus (still unproven but A graded minor leaguer and so called five tool player)</p><p>

Placido Polanco </p><p>

Adam Kennedy </p><p> </p><p>

There are other unknown prospects we've traded for guys like Mulder, DeRosa, etc. </p><p> </p><p>

As it stands right now this year</p><p> </p><p>

C - Molina (farm system)</p><p>

1B - Pujols (farm syste)</p><p>

2B Skip Schumaker - .306 hitter the last 4 yrs he's been on the team (farm system </p><p>

SS - Brendan Ryan - 98.5 fielding ptg, .294 hitter last year (farm system)</p><p>

3B - David Freese (rookie year)</p><p>

CF - Colby Rasmus (sophmore year) 280 avg, 6 HR (farm system)</p><p> </p><p>

Wainwright 5-1 2.08 ERA (farm system)</p><p>

Jamie Garcia 4-2, 1.42 ERA</p><p> </p><p>

looking at this years numbers so far and realizing that nearly our entire starting team has been taken from our farm system in the last five years is pretty damn impressive.</p>