Major gripe with turns and gimmick changes

[PGHJuice]

So, someone explain this to me. I'm 4 months into my SWF game, and i'm ready to start some new storylines.

 

That's all good and well, except for two bad, and frankly stupid game designs. I haven't changed anyones face/heel disposition since the beginning of the game, but, apparently, everyone that i'd like to turn, it's too soon because their last turn was too recent.

 

WTF? Are you kidding me right now? I haven't turned ANYONE in game yet, 4 months in, i'm pretty damn sure that I should be able to turn anyone I want right now, but of course, because it's random, I can't. Who decided this was a good idea? Who decided that we shouldn't be able to turn anyone we want to, without severely affecting the turn, angle grade, momentum and what not? I haven't turned them yet, so how is it too soon? I shouldn't have to wait a few more months to get my storylines started because someone decided this was a good idea.

 

And oh, same thing for gimmick changes! Trying to change Joe Sexys horribly rated gimmick, but guess what, I can't! Wonder why? Because it's too soon since his last gimmick change. I never changed his gimmick in my game, so how the hell is it too soon? Whatever, some of the game design decisions with this game drives me insane.

[bigtplaystew]

<p>Well it is a GAME, nto a dramatic representation of real life. And the game is tryign to mimmickt he idea that you cant just turn guys willy nilly. If a top heel turns babyface, but has to go heel again 4 months later... it wouldn't look good for said worker. It would likely be percieved that said worker couldn't get over as babyface and had to go heel.</p><p> </p><p>

Which he did, but he would take somewha of a momentum hit untilhe got a big storyline push, a reinvention of his gimmick, etc.</p><p> </p><p>

So you just kind of have to keep trucking for a bit if you dont want to suffer penalties. Or turn the guy(s) and suffer your momentum/gimmick rating penalties.</p><p> </p><p>

I wouldn't be too scared to turn a guy babyface or heel though. The gimmick rating might prevent a guy from really hitting that a+ level match/angle grade on a consistent basis. But you can still get decent work out of a dude with low gimmick grades. And you can always bump up momentum by booking a guy in decent storylines.</p>

[Harmor]

It isn't ideal, I agree, but what you describe can be explained by the 6 months minimum time a gimmick or disposition will have to stand before you can change them without penalty. And since your game is 4 months in, you'll have to wait another 2 to be able to change things. This is because the game doesn't take into account for how long workers had been using their characters before you start a game.

[PGHJuice]

<p>What i'm saying is, if i'm starting a brand new game, I should be able to turn whoever I want to at least once without incurring penalties. It's a NEW GAME, the AI doesn't know how long someone was a face or a heel. It's just random. Why in the hell should I have to wait all these months to turn someone from a brand new game. </p><p> </p><p>

I haven't turned ANYONE yet, so I shouldn't be getting the it's too soon since his last turn note. It's stupid.</p>

[Adam Ryland]

It's a new game, but it's not a new game world - you are not starting with a blank slate like you seem to be expecting, you are picking up from where the last booker left off, just as you would in reality. You therefore have to take into account that people will have been turning, etc, before you arrived.

 

If you got offered the WWE job in reality tomorrow, you wouldn't just get to turn everyone you liked to get it the way you liked it, you'd have to gradually do it based on the current positions - I don't really see any reason why it's 'stupid' to simulate this given that it's what a real booker would have to do, and you're playing as a booker.

[Adam Ryland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Harmor" data-cite="Harmor" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="36696" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>It isn't ideal, I agree, but what you describe can be explained by the 6 months minimum time a gimmick or disposition will have to stand before you can change them without penalty. And since your game is 4 months in, you'll have to wait another 2 to be able to change things. This is because the game doesn't take into account for how long workers had been using their characters before you start a game. </div></blockquote><p> </p><p> This is all false, for reference - times are randomly set at the start, only those who 'rolled' as having been turned recently would need to wait the usual 6 months, you could just as easily have someone who is ripe for turning. You can see who is at what state via the gimmick screen, etc.</p>

[UEWpro]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="36696" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>It's a <em>new game</em>, but it's not a <em>new game world</em> - you are not starting with a blank slate like you seem to be expecting, you are picking up from where the last booker left off, just as you would in reality. You therefore have to take into account that people will have been turning, etc, before you arrived. <p> </p><p> <strong>If you got offered the WWE job in reality tomorrow, you wouldn't just get to turn everyone you liked to get it the way you liked it, you'd have to gradually do it based on the current positions </strong>- I don't really see any reason why it's 'stupid' to simulate this given that it's what a real booker would have to do, and you're playing as a booker.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> **** that noise, bet I would turn Cena heel my first night.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> Boom!</p>

[SirMichaelJordan]

**** that noise, bet I would turn Cena heel my first night.

 

 

Boom!

 

lol well Cena's Gimmick has been stale for years and is ready for a change.

[Teh_Showtime]

**** that noise, bet I would turn Cena heel my first night.

 

 

Boom!

 

Real life is not randomly generated Cena has been face for about 10 years now

 

Highly doubt turning a guy like Ziggler heel again would go over well considering how recently he just turned

[TLCJR4LIFE]

It's not bad. It doesn't make sense for people to keep switching gimmicks and turning heel/face..what I dislike is that they removed one of the old features for gimmicks...certain gimmicks were character overhauls that required you to take them off tv for a while...I think this would be a better way at handling gimmick changes if you wanted to do a drastic overhaul.

 

Secondly just because the turn is early doesn't mean it'll be crippling...I turned a guy early 5 months into a save and he only lose like 12 momentum...not that big of a deal.

 

 

I will agree though the execution isn't great because the heel/face thing is based on segment usage and not overall time...that to me is very flawed. It also makes turning midcarders a lot harder than it should be.

 

If a guy gets injured for a year or goes on hiatus he will typically come back as a babyface just because he was gone for a long time....like HHH when he came back in MSG.

[Silent_Thunder]

As an aside to all of this. If I give my worker a mask, can I turn him and change his gimmick immediately? Since he's technically not the "same" person anymore? Or do the fans still consider him to be the same person?

[Eidenhoek]

I'd like to be able to preset those times in the database editor, but meh.

[Nachtfalter]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Eidenhoek" data-cite="Eidenhoek" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="36696" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'd like to be able to preset those times in the database editor, but meh.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> This.</p><p> </p><p> It doesn't matter as much for CVerse games, but for Real World mods, there absolutely needs to be a way to set how long it has been since the last turn in the editor.</p>

[Mattywood]

This.

 

It doesn't matter as much for CVerse games, but for Real World mods, there absolutely needs to be a way to set how long it has been since the last turn in the editor.

 

Agreed with both of you. This would have really come in handy for Genadi's Golden Age mod as it starts in March 1987, and Brutus Beefcake turned face at WrestleMania III. Or for Justtxyank's Rising Storms mod, which starts in January 1991, and Randy Savage turned babyface at WrestleMania VII(though he was still sounding kind of heelish on commentary, but mostly to sell that he was bitter about being "retired" from in-ring competition).

[shawn michaels]

It's not bad. It doesn't make sense for people to keep switching gimmicks and turning heel/face..what I dislike is that they removed one of the old features for gimmicks...certain gimmicks were character overhauls that required you to take them off tv for a while...I think this would be a better way at handling gimmick changes if you wanted to do a drastic overhaul.

 

Secondly just because the turn is early doesn't mean it'll be crippling...I turned a guy early 5 months into a save and he only lose like 12 momentum...not that big of a deal.

 

 

I will agree though the execution isn't great because the heel/face thing is based on segment usage and not overall time...that to me is very flawed. It also makes turning midcarders a lot harder than it should be.

 

If a guy gets injured for a year or goes on hiatus he will typically come back as a babyface just because he was gone for a long time....like HHH when he came back in MSG.

 

Flawed? No, au contraire mon ami. It is a perfect way to simulate reality. If you turn "The Rock" (for example) to face and use him only once in one year, than the old system would say he's stalled and it's time for a gimmick change. Which is ridiculous. The new system allows you to bring him back one year later with no need to turn him. It's a perfect simulation of reality. It's not about the time in the form of how many months have they done this, it's about the hours of segments they have provided during those months.

[3rdStringPG]

It's all about randomness, just as the others had said, and it's all good. All breaks of the game. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Yes, it irritates me at times (especially if you want to turn a tag team right off the bat), but all I have to do is discard the old game and start a new one so that the person I want turned can do so without incurring any penalties or suffering from any morale issues. No biggie.

[Harmor]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="36696" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>This is all false, for reference - times are randomly set at the start, only those who 'rolled' as having been turned recently would need to wait the usual 6 months, you could just as easily have someone who is ripe for turning. You can see who is at what state via the gimmick screen, etc.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> o.O ... Never knew that, or well, never was that 'lucky' I guess. Good to know nonetheless because so far, from playing the game, I had thought this had entirely to do with starting a game. It's also why I stopped trying at one point. It does make sense though - however, the 6 months thingy - real life isn't hard set and neither should be a game that depicts real existing sports, CV notwithstanding. A more gradual approach would make things a little more interesting imo.</p>