Cyhort Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I'm sorry, I really wanted to like this and after playing the demo and winning some competitive matches I thought it would be a lot of fun, but after I bought it and started playing more matches it became really obvious that there's absolutely no skill involved in this. It doesn't really matter all that much what your stats are, everything that happens is based on that random out of 1000 roll. It's ridiculous. I have very high stats that I edited in for my character and he's still getting beaten by people he outranks by several hundred points in everything. There's no strategy, there's no sense of accomplishment, it's all just a dice roll. And that isn't at all fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielBryan Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I don't think that's true. It does rely on luck, but that makes it exciting. Skill also plays a part in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucianCarter Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Luck plays a role but learning to use the right moves to maximize your chance of winning is more important than stats. WS has always been that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russelrules44 Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Cyhort" data-cite="Cyhort" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm sorry, I really wanted to like this and after playing the demo and winning some competitive matches I thought it would be a lot of fun, but after I bought it and started playing more matches it became really obvious that there's absolutely no skill involved in this. It doesn't really matter all that much what your stats are, everything that happens is based on that random out of 1000 roll. It's ridiculous. I have very high stats that I edited in for my character and he's still getting beaten by people he outranks by several hundred points in everything. There's no strategy, there's no sense of accomplishment, it's all just a dice roll. And that isn't at all fun.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> What Lucian said is right. Luck is in WS's blood. Which also explains why not a lot of people like it as much TEW, but hey, what you say is what you say.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielBryan Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 TEW as about as much luck as Wrespi3 does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I'd suggest using the Calculation button, it shows exactly how much strategy there is. Also, you talked a lot about your own skills, but you didn't say anything about your moves - you can have 1000 in everything, if you're choosing your moves badly then you will struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh_Showtime Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="DanielBryan" data-cite="DanielBryan" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>TEW as about as much luck as Wrespi3 does</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I wouldn't go that far since in TEW there aren't any rolls directly opposing you as opposed to potentially facing an opponent who has great stacks and is able to overcome seemingly everything you try to do.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capelli King Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 yeah, it has as much to do with your moves as it does anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredreed Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I think that every game requires luck no matter what type of game It is. For wrestling sims It is about luck yes but like in real life for a wrestler luck is something that all wrestlers need to have and I think that this is what gives them the motivation to them is luck. This is also applies to MMA as well. I think that this could apply to almost every sport that there is. Every sport requires luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truly Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Cyhort" data-cite="Cyhort" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm sorry, I really wanted to like this and after playing the demo and winning some competitive matches I thought it would be a lot of fun, but after I bought it and started playing more matches it became really obvious that there's absolutely no skill involved in this. It doesn't really matter all that much what your stats are, everything that happens is based on that random out of 1000 roll. It's ridiculous. I have very high stats that I edited in for my character and he's still getting beaten by people he outranks by several hundred points in everything. There's no strategy, there's no sense of accomplishment, it's all just a dice roll. And that isn't at all fun.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm willing to go out on a limb and guess that you're constantly trying to go for your High-level moves or Finishers early in the match. That WON'T work, no matter how high your skills are, you always have to wear your opponent down early in the match before jumping for the kill.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordJaguar Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 <p>I gotta agree with the OP, there is way too much luck involved. Even with educated feet lvl2 a high striking rating, 600, I seem to miss my low level and medium dropkicks way too often. I also find it hard for any super or giant size wrestler to do anything once they are on the ground as avoid relies on their non existent speed. Lastly, with a speed of 600 I still get nailed way too much by indy level scrubs.</p><p> </p><p> Lastly, what determines match rating as it seems the one time I dominated I got a 1 star match...</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narcizo Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Luck plays a part (as it should) but, at low levels at least, it's easy to dominate opponents by building momentum and lowering your opponent's. Keep plugging away at it and you generally can get control of the match. Playing Road to Legend then you get sent against random scrubs who you can destroy by concentrating on your strengths and avoiding your weaknesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhd1 Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="LordJaguar" data-cite="LordJaguar" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I gotta agree with the OP, there is way too much luck involved. Even with educated feet lvl2 a high striking rating, 600, I seem to miss my low level and medium dropkicks way too often. I also find it hard for any super or giant size wrestler to do anything once they are on the ground as avoid relies on their non existent speed. Lastly, with a speed of 600 I still get nailed way too much by indy level scrubs.<p> </p><p> Lastly, what determines match rating as it seems the one time I dominated I got a 1 star match...</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> A super or giant-sized wrestler on the ground <em>would </em>be terrible, that's realistic I would say. Eventually you'll either avoid due to sheer chance, or you'll get the option to break or the opposition will pick you up. Getting knocked to the floor is one of your character's disadvantages, the fact you have one is just as important to the game playing well as you having your advantages (such as your strength and the fact you can shrug off basically everyone else's punches). Without your disadvantages in terms of avoiding strikes a giant would be hugely overpowered.</p><p> </p><p> Match rating is based largely on the flow of the match through things like spots and near-falls. It doesn't actually do anything though apart from you get a minor bonus above a certain number of stars (three I think), so it's not something to worry about.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rone Rivendale Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Narcizo" data-cite="Narcizo" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Luck plays a part (as it should) but, at low levels at least, it's easy to dominate opponents by building momentum and lowering your opponent's. Keep plugging away at it and you generally can get control of the match. Playing Road to Legend then you get sent against random scrubs who you can destroy by concentrating on your strengths and avoiding your weaknesses.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Unless you face Mercurio Sleep in your 2nd ever match as a RtL and he destroys you. This happened to me, the only loss I've taken on the demo out of a dozen fights. For an unknown, his stats are insane. <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Payne Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 And then there are the times when, in RtL, you face an Unknown for the 13th time, then suddenly he hits 23 moves in a row on you, and you can't counter one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antithesis Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Payne" data-cite="Payne" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>And then there are the times when, in RtL, you face an Unknown for the 13th time, then suddenly he hits 23 moves in a row on you, and you can't counter one.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> My first time playing a Wrestling Spirit game, and I dunno if they are all like this, but it was surprising to see that some kind of hard coded work around for streaks like this wasn't included.</p><p> </p><p> Video Games 101 should say never design a game where the player feels impotent when playing, but watching the computer spam moves that you are powerless to stop pretty much succeeds in doing just that.</p><p> </p><p> Don't get me wrong I enjoy the game, and it seems to function pretty good in career mode when you are playing an established character that isn't starved for stats/attributes but RtL mode seems to feature some whacky RNG streakiness that kills the fun in the game.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rone Rivendale Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 If you going into a RtL game expecting to go undefeated, you might as well not play. That isn't the point. ROOKIE to Legend. You are supposed to suck in the beginning. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antithesis Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rone Rivendale" data-cite="Rone Rivendale" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>If you going into a RtL game expecting to go undefeated, you might as well not play. That isn't the point. ROOKIE to Legend. You are supposed to suck in the beginning. <img alt=":)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Never stated anywhere I expected to go undefeated. I did, however, expect to avoid, or break or land one counter move of my own during the computer spamming 20+ moves for itself.</p><p> </p><p> Imagine, if you will, a situation where you pay money to get slapped in the face repeatedly and you are powerless to stop it. That kind of scenario should never be in a video game, at least the ones that want people to play them.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Antithesis" data-cite="Antithesis" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>but it was surprising to see that some kind of hard coded work around for streaks like this wasn't included.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I like the irony that I've spent years having people not believe that the computer isn't cheating, then within a week of releasing a game that has a feature that <em>proves</em> that it isn't, we have people asking for the game to actively cheat. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png"></p><p> </p><p> Again, I'd suggest using the Calculation button heavily - you are not powerless at any point in WreSpi, nor is the AI spamming successes, at worst the AI is making good use of the odds and you are being unlucky; a situation that can just as easily happen in your favour with the right tactics and luck.</p><p> </p><p> I don't agree with this suggestion. While it can be frustrating to be on the receiving end of an unlucky streak, you can just as easily do it to the AI, and I think it'd not only go against the entire spirit of the game but be massively, massively irritating if you put together a streak of moves only to lose it because the game decided "sorry, you were doing too well so I've decided to arbitrarily have you fail this move even though you actually should have hit it". Adding even one cheat like that would be a very slippery slope indeed.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordJaguar Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rone Rivendale" data-cite="Rone Rivendale" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>If you going into a RtL game expecting to go undefeated, you might as well not play. That isn't the point. ROOKIE to Legend. You are supposed to suck in the beginning. <img alt=":)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> That makes no sense. When I play a game I expect to be able to defeat it with enough practice, but the RTL modes seems to think that no matter how "good" at the game you are you can never be undefeated which isn't realistic. I mean, even with a stacked deck, educated feet, feet on fire, tons of speed, tons of striking, loads of lower body strikes in all levels, and some good strategy I still find it hard to defeat certain foes due to their inhuman ability to get "lucky" rolls and avoid, break, counter, or slip out of moves.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielBryan Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Antithesis" data-cite="Antithesis" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>My first time playing a Wrestling Spirit game, and I dunno if they are all like this, but it was surprising to see that some kind of hard coded work around for streaks like this wasn't included.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I understand what you mean. Most mainstream videogames always have systems designed to make the player never be too frustrated, even if it makes it no fair. For example, most of the times when games tell you you have a % chance to do something, you actually have a far bigger chance than that, to balance out your expectations. This is what causes a lot of people to think games that are truly random like this one to be too frustrating or outright cheating.</p><p> </p><p> But I like WreSpi as it is right now. I enjoy that it almost feels like every match you have is multiplayer (despite the fact some of the characters outright suck) and that you're truly making it into the big world of pro-wrestling.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayW Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="LordJaguar" data-cite="LordJaguar" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That makes no sense. When I play a game I expect to be able to defeat it with enough practice, but the RTL modes seems to think that no matter how "good" at the game you are you can never be undefeated which isn't realistic. I mean, even with a stacked deck, educated feet, feet on fire, tons of speed, tons of striking, loads of lower body strikes in all levels, and some good strategy I still find it hard to defeat certain foes due to their inhuman ability to get "lucky" rolls and avoid, break, counter, or slip out of moves.</div></blockquote><p> It's not impossible to go undefeated. It just extremely unlikely. As it should be. If everyone was going undefeated, this game would broken. Games aren't made to be easy.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="LordJaguar" data-cite="LordJaguar" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="37113" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>due to their inhuman ability to get "lucky" rolls</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> There's nothing inhuman about it, they have exactly the same chance that you do. The Calculation button proves this.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Cobra Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 I don't mind the luck and rolls etc, but I much prefer the CBH taking turns method of play. It took me a while to think why I wasn't enjoying Wrespi 3 as much as CBH, and that was it. In CBH I might be over matched (or under matched) but I can still win while taking damage due to it being a RPG style turns system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeflonBilly Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 The bad luck can get super frustrating, but I've been playing Pen & Paper RPGs for going on 30 years. I'm no stranger to the dice going cold on you. The real problem is that, in AD&D, you can throw your 20-sider across the room and that makes you feel a little better. It's a little too costly to do that with your computer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.