[HYPE] CV97 for TEW2020 (input wanted)

[Derek B]

As many people already know I'm bringing the Cornellverse 1997 (CV97) mod to TEW2020 and I'm hoping to make it the best version of the mod I possibly can thanks to all the new features, with the possibility that I may continue the mod as it's own unique Cornellverse timeline. The base looks solid already as the data has had many years of people playing it but there are a bunch of changes to the game itself and to the general wrestling landscape so there are areas I'd like to put some effort into improving in order to make the most out of the game. I'm also looking for some opinions too, so feel free to comment on things you'd like to see or things you'd actively NOT like seeing.

 

1. I feel that women's wrestling is under-represented in the mod due to it's relative historical insignificance in Cornellverse lore, so I'm looking to expand that by adding several women to various parts of the world. I'd like to include a couple of women's divisions within the American companies. I'm thinking AMW would suit having a sex appeal based division with some potential in-ring talent mixed in. I'm considering having CZCW and RPW (who I have canonically semi-linked already) to both have a women's division with some shared workers as the core of both divisions. Lastly, I'd also consider a more traditional division of solid wrestlers as part of the NYCW roster as they could offer something different there for the East Coast based companies. I wouldn't want to add ALL of these divisions but I feel like adding some combination of them would help to make the women's scene more interesting in North America, especially when combined with the already existing NOTBPW division and the AAA roster, who would also get more matches as a result. I'm also looking to expand women's wrestling into Mexico to have a proper luchadora scene going on there too which should help to establish a scene there in the long term too. I may also expand Japan a bit, but they are pretty well seeded already as long as 5SSW behave, which they have been doing in testing so far.

 

Thoughts and preferences?

 

2. As the mod stands in TEW2016, do people think there are enough potential people available to work in a deathmatch/hardcore style company? I will be making sure there are plenty of people tagged to be available for the deathmatch scene already but I'd like to hear opinions on who you'd like to see in that pool, beyond any potentially obvious ones. Similarly, would be good to know if there's anyone who shouldn't be able to do deathmatches at all, it would also be good to know about them. I'd also consider accepting some submissions for deathmatch specific workers too if anyone has ideas. A picture and a description of their character should be all I need, preferably with a picture (can be a free picture) so that I can do everything else.

 

3. Due to increased staff requirements, most companies are going to require more people on their rosters. I'll definitely be adding a bunch of referees right away to make sure the world has enough of them now, road agents may also be needed though I'll have to test out the mod more to be sure. I'll be welcoming names and home areas for referees for anyone who wants to add their friends, family or random e-fed creations there.

 

4. Due to the increased roster sizes requirements, most companies are going to need at least a few more workers on them. For the most part I'll be looking to add workers from the available dojos who have graduated in the last couple of years to keep in line with the way the game generates workers now. But I will also be looking to add a few other people to the upper reaches of some companies as established veterans. Once again, I welcome suggestions for workers if there is anyone you would like to see added. Providing pictures for workers is ideal, but making use of the existing free pictures in TEW16 would be good enough too. All I need is for them to be era appropriate with a fairly short description of their character so that I can assign a gimmick and stats, which I will balance myself.

 

5. Good lists are divisible by 5. Also, I'd be happy to add a bunch of new companies that could debut in future if there are logos available for them. If you can leave me names and logos for them, along with a description then I can do that too.

 

BONUS #1: Should I retool AMW to be a viable company instead of being doomed to fail with a scumbag owner? They'd still be stuck with their scumbag owner and likely in a precarious spot, but could at least be set up to have a chance of surviving.

 

BONUS #2: Suggestions for managers are extremely welcome. Whether they be old school guys who are perhaps winding down their career, valets who are there primarily for their sex appeal or something else entirely.... all suggestions are welcome there as it's an area that is definitely lacking and could definitely add a lot of flavour to lots of areas of the game.

 

I don't have a timeline for exactly when the mod will get released due to how busy I'll be in real life and with how late in the game development cycle it'll be before I can properly get work started on this mod, but once the game is released I'll be putting a lot of time into it and hopefully I can make this as good as possible. Thanks in advance for any and all contributions that people make in this thread, I hope we can get some fun additions to the mod.

 

Okay, work on the mod continues to go well and the game world that is active from the start is close to complete, with me mostly working on future aspects of it now. I've been tinkering with adding some people to rosters, fiddled with some onwer preferences regarding roster sizes and tweaked a lot of dojos to levels that make sense with what has come before and also future debuts. At this point I'm looking to fine tune some roster numbers to encourage companies to need minimal signings early on and to provide a nice, stable base for every game to start from and for the world to unfold from. I'm looking to fill in some of the remaining gaps on the rosters, and this is after I've added logical people to the various companies already and in some cases added a few created workers that I had noted down already. Below is a rough list of what I'm looking for to bring companies to tha approximate midpoint of their recommended rosters, though any suggestions made even if companies that have already reached that number are welcomed. It doesn't hurt to have some extra bodies around in case of injuries and whatnot.

 

--------------------

 

AAA: They need up to 3 more wrestlers, with there being a couple of potentially open spots for trainees who would have debuted after August 1996. Some solid hands aged around 30 would also be welcome additions to provide more experienc and depth to a roster that is largely filled with veteran talents and unproven talents. They have links with 5SSW (for excursions) and NOTBPW's women's divisions and happily share talent.

 

AMW: They could do with 2 more wrestlers. They still have a TV deal that they really shouldn't and have a mostly terrible locker room, so any new additions would either be bargain basement level guys that the owner literally uses as jobbers OR a top level guy or two who is a terrible influence. Before anyone suggests adding Giant Redwood, he's already been given a job there.

 

CZCW: They need about 3 wrestlers, ideally dojo graduates from 94, 95 or 96... but certainly anyone added here should be local to the Southern Californian wrestling scene. Being strongly linked to RPW, workers could also have graduated from there and be on this roster to there is some potentially fun crossover. Tag teams are super welcome here as CZCW are a little light on those.

 

DAVE: They could use between 2 and 5 wrestlers. Given the future canon of DAVE winning the east coast war, and Nemesis' debut being the major event that turns the tide in DAVE's favour along with Phil Vibert being the new owner at the start of 1997, DAVE are kinda in a rebranding phase. Any additions to their roster would be mostly low level guys who would be cut when DAVE cherry picked the warring rosters, with tag teams and locally based wrestlers being particulary welcome here.

 

HGC: HGC only need a couple of wrestlers at this time. They have been set up as a Small sized company that isn't far from hitting Medium, meaning they will make several signings in the not distant future. Those signings will of course hit other companies fairly hard, but at this time HGC don't need too much. A tag team or two is always nice, but mostly I would say that any new workers they get should either be cool enough to impress JK Stallings, have decent potential to impress Rip Chord OR be a hanger-on who sucks up to Sam Strong. This doesn't just need to be limited to in-ring talent, some more non-wrestlers is never a bad thing.

 

NYCW: They need up to 4 new wrestlers. An old school, minor territory who stays out of the wars, NYCW are a mix of highly experienced veterans and inexperienced talents getting their first breaks in the business. As ever, tag teams are welcome and I'm keen to continue the theme of old vs new, as it's something that was very much a canon issue later on with the likes of Joey Minnesota.

 

PPPW: They need a couple of new wrestlers. Having regained a couple of people when I nixed NEW, PPPW still have a few gaps in their roster. The most solidly traditional of the warring east coast companies, I'd like them to have another tag team or two that are hitting their peak kind of years, even if they aren't all that talented. They already have too many youngsters so a bit more experience is definitely needed here.

 

PDW: The smallest company in the US, and one I seriously considered removing from the data due to being non-canon... PDW are filled with a lot of dojo graduates and youngsters looking to gain experience. I gave the school a bunch more graduates already, but 1991 could do with a couple more male wrestlers who could act as seniors here. The company also needs another female wrestler on the roster, perhaps two and I'm open to any suggestions there.

 

RPW: They only need 1 or 2 wrestlers. Which is great, especially as there are spaces in their dojo graduation history for wrestlers in the years 92, 93, 94 and 95. Any workers here can potentially be shared with CZCW, and vice versa, while potentially also having gone on to bigger things with the likes of HGC in particular being a place that has just hired a bunch of smaller wrestlers for their cruiserweight division.

 

SWF: They need about 2 wrestlers, and probably some more non-wrestlers for fun. Having picked up a bunch of workers when I removed their former child company NEW, the SWF roster had a big of an influx of young, low level talent. The SWF Training Facilities could do with a couple of graduates from the class of 94 (set to December, like the 05 class was in canon) so that would be ideal. But really, if you have a fun idea for a character at any level below the main event I'd be happy to hear about them, the SWF could do with some fun new blood.

 

XFW: Shockingly, doesn't need any wrestlers. They've benefitted from a bit more of a focus on making a viable hardcore wrestling scene and are part of the Hardcore Alliance too, which allows them access to other talents. But I wouldn't say no to a couple more wrestlers for them too, as well as some workers who could go into the indy scene and be hired later. Mid level talent would be ideal, and as always tag teams are particularly welcome.

 

--------------------

 

4C: They need up to 4 wrestlers. The company has only been active for 2 shows (2 months) with each one having a focus on crowning a champion, so I feel like their roster is still coming together. Their next show will see the crowning of the first ever tag champions here, so they need tag teams to build that division, which currently has..... 0 tag teams in it. I always feel that Quebec is under-represented and isn't far from here geographically, so a team based on that would be good. But really, all options are good options.

 

CGC: They need up to 3 workers. And happily, the DeColt Powerhouse needs some graduates from 92, 94, 95 and 96 to help filll the ranks as the school has been lacking in those. Naturally, these would be undercard workers who would likely not achieve a lot in the world, but CGC has already had some new additions to the midcard ranks to help their roster a little. They're just looking for a little more depth now. Teams always welcome.

 

NOTBPW: Only need 1 woman, no men. But having more always helps too, especially with the House Of Stone needing some more graduates over the last few years. NOTBPW are Medium sized and have had a LOT of talent already added to their midcard, as well as several names added to the women's division (June Butler!). Mostly they just need more names for the midcard and undercard, though their roster is quite large already due to the women's division growing a lot. NOTBPW accept excursions from BHOTWG, a link I feel is canon due to the likess of Kenko Takemitsu, Haruki Kudo and Stone Yoshikawa all having time with the company. They also have links with 5SSW for excurions on the women's side of things and are friendly with AAA.

 

--------------------

 

MPWF: MPWF have been given an excursion link with BHOTWG (mostly for developing Junior talents) and don't NEED more wrestlers, but I'm happy for them to have a few more. They have picked up a bunch of previously indy talents to give them more depth and are in a pretty strong position at game start.

 

OLLIE: They need a couple of workers, but are above the minimum already so they can easily hire from the free agent pool remaining. They don't have any links to other companies but as with many rosters, they coud do with another tag team or two to help flesh out the division more.

 

--------------------

 

MOSC: Surprisingly, they don't need more workers as they've been filled up with stylistically similar and/or geographically local workers who fit the bill. Another worker or two wouldn't hurt but they don't require any more people willing to bleed just yet.

 

--------------------

 

EWCW: They could do with a couple of wrestlers. I gave them a few new signings already, including any locals who made sense. As an Austrian based company it would make sense to add a couple more Austrians and the company needs a good babyface tag team, so that would be ideal. Other locally sourced talents would also be good to have, though we're not looking at people who are likely to go on to megastardom.

 

--------------------

 

5SSW: The 5SSW dojo could do with a couple of graduates from 93, 94 and 95. Given that this would also make them prime candidates for being on excursion to AAA or NOTBPW this could be a great way to help fill the ranks for all three companies. Their roster has already been filled out a bit with available talents and they only need a couple of workers for their own roster.

 

BBW: Only need a couple of wrestlers for their roster. I had strongly considered giving them Ken Shimedzu and Natsu Miyamae before deciding to leave them as a prime indy team who could potentially go anywhere. BBW have had their roster filled out with a few new workers and some available talents already, so they just need a couple more talents. I've set them to be a Junior-Deathmatch style company as they actually have a pretty good Junior division building already, so another couple of Juniors, perhaps as a team, could slot in nicely.

 

BHOTWG: They don't NEED more workers, but I want to add a few more still. I've given them the Burning Junior Tag Team titles years early and their roster got a significant boost from various Hinote Dojo talents who got folded back into the main roster when I removed them. BHOTWG could do with a 95 graduate of the school (October graduation), and has links to MPWF and NOTBPW for sending people away on excursions if you want to create talents who could be elsewhere. Otherwise, the undercard could do with more people in it in both the heavyweight and junior ranks, with most expereince levels being welcome.

 

GCG: Another company that don't technically need any more talents, the company is packed full of veterans, including people brought out of retirement to fill gaps. Their story is one of mismanagement and misfortune.... they've lost so many people to injury over the years, they've had young lions be disloyal, they've lost the chance to sign some indy talents due to PGHW coming in to snatch them up, and after that they lose many talented foreigners to HGC when they were created. GCG have underinvested in youth and everything has come together to leave them in rough shape. If it wasn't for Maeda and Yoshizawa, they'd maybe be doomed. As for additions, a few youngsters from anywhere in the 90s might be good, remembering that the company doesn't like Juniors.

 

PGHW: They don't need many talents, but a couple of undercarders could help them out. They've got a couple of people on short term deals (using limited dates options) and a bunch of the more over indy talent added to their generation of future legends so they're set to grow fast. They haven't been around long enough to have young lions, so the only real additions they can have are lesser talents and unproven guys who could fill out opening matches.

 

--------------------

 

On top of those 30 to 50 positions that should probably be filled, I'm also happy to add a bunch of people to indy scenes around the world. All rosters have grown a bit since the TEW16 data so the unemployed scenes have gotten a bit smaller everywhere and it would be nice to help them grow a little. Not essential of course... with new workers debuting into the future for basically forever, and with the increased control of those through updates to patches (I checked, we missed a bit during changes!) the future in the mod will be flexible. I plan to make it so that training facilties will debut some workers every year that they are open so that any company that owns one will always be getting a return on their investment every year. This will be done via narratives that can be easily removed if you want and will be structured in a way that ensures graduations from the point that canon workers are no longer debuting.

 

So yeah... get any submissions in that you want to see added. I'll assign pictures to people and handle the full bios. You can even submit ideas for future workers too if you want, though obviously there is less chance to see them in gameplay if they don't debut for 10 years.

[lavelleuk]

<p>Just a few thoughts, maybe not all helpful but I like your idea</p><p> </p><p>

I made the 2018 c-verse mod and like you I really tried to add more women, made AAA bigger, few more women's companies etc. so to me that is a huge must. I have set the ground work for some of my mods in the future to have expanded women's companies and workers in the future too. Obviously mines just had two years to build on but if you can go back to '97 and do the same that would be a huge opportunity to build something that the c-verse is really lacking, especially in Britain and Australia, but really every single area. If you were looking at making this your cannon c-verse then helping establish women's wrestling is something I would do too.</p><p> </p><p>

I too was going to give CZCW a women's division but they had gone through enough changes on my mod so thought it would be too much. But I can see them having one. I personally couldn't see NYCW with one, but that doesn't mean they couldn't, great thing about c-verse is it can be different things to everyone.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>

I also added deathmatch workers as I didn't feel there was enough, and that's the style of promotion I like to play. Even now I still think I need to add a few more talentless hardcore workers just to make things balanced, but obviously you don't want the game running too slow. I never played the '97 mod as I don't think I knew it existed, but if it is based on how real life wrestling was at that time period then crazy hardcore people willing to kill themselves for the business is a must. I asked for submissions too but didn't get many, I'd be jealous if you got more lol. But seriously hope you get some interest, it's good to have other people's creative input into characters</p>

[Teh_Showtime]

<p>My last game of 2016 is gonna be a HGC 97 game that I’m powering through so this data is pretty fresh to me I might as well throw my input here.</p><p> </p><p>

1. CZCW should definitely have a women’s division, J-Ro was a star there in canon. It would also give them a different identity than RPW even if they’re tied together so much.</p><p> </p><p>

I loved how different XFW has become over the iterations of the mod and it has its own identity, I think it would be interesting if they had a BSC style division since none of the other east coast companies have many women at all. Not too sure how much AMW would help if they go under pretty quick so it depends on that also.</p><p> </p><p>

This also goes with #3 but much more women non wrestlers would be a huge help. Women managers (to satisfy the sex appeal requirements) are pretty much a must for every US fed but the talent pool isn’t that deep.</p><p> </p><p>

2. I think attributes should help this for the most part. Previously people you would expect would refuse death matches, but I feel like it’ll be a bit more flexible this way. Not everything has to line up and they’ll still agree to it.</p><p> </p><p>

4. The biggest discrepancy I’ve seen is the thin gap between old era stars and modern CVsrse era stars. Tons of under 25 talent and tons of over 40 talent, but not too many between. I feel like we’re in the same line of thinking on this one.</p><p> </p><p>

A guy like Monty Walker is one of my favorite “non canon” guys who represents the core of the mod to me. We already know who becomes megastars in the future and it’s so hard to not push a 19 year old Tayler Morton but interesting characters that bridge the gap like that are what make me come back to this mod every time a new TEW is released.</p>

[Derek B]

<p>Showtime, you reminded me of TWO things I forgot to ask and will add in to the first post too. More suggestions for managers in general as they are a role that used to be huge and is now horribly under-rated... and whether I should retool AMW so that they are no longer set up to fail from the start.</p><p> </p><p>

For AMW, I'm tempted to put them in a similarly precarious position but without the narratives that see them destroyed financially, though perhaps still with ones that hit their prestige and momentum to simulate them being in danger. This would allow them to be a southern breeding ground for potential talent and could make their style of women's division mean something. It would also allow them to have their original talents still locked in, but with a chance of escape down the line too... though I suspect I will nerf some of the stats there a bit more too.</p><p> </p><p>

Speaking of which.... some stats are going to be getting nerfed around the world. With the new stat progressions there is less need to have some people acting as seeds for top row stats, since they can now grow over time organically. I feel like this gives more scope to tone some skills back a bit and to give a lot of the more talented youngsters a bit of a hit. This can also work perfectly with adding some solid 30ish year old guys to the data to act as a bridge between the older and newer generations..... the main reason I've never added too many guys in that age bracket was because it was always tricky to explain where they disappeared to by 2004, and Cornellverse lore has always had a bit of a hole there.</p><p> </p><p>

So thanks for the input. Thanks lavelleuk too, I'm glad you like the idea of expanding the women's and deathmatch scenes... I'm not trying to copy real life exactly, but adding a solid and diverse range of styles and having enough people around to work with that is always a good thing. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[Herrbear]

For what it is worth.

 

1. I think you are spot on with the changes you propose regarding women's division in the universe.

 

Thoughts and preferences?

 

2. I personally do not like a deathmatch. I don't think it is good for a wrestler's career; but I know that it is not uncommon now. I still like wrestling to be a believable "sport". I'm old, what can I say.

 

3. Totally agree that referees, road agents and managers should be added.

 

BONUS #1: Should I retool AMW to be a viable company instead of being doomed to fail with a scumbag owner? They'd still be stuck with their scumbag owner and likely in a precarious spot, but could at least be set up to have a chance of surviving.

[Blackman]

1. Sure, you could add a few extra women like you've done already, but please don't insert random female Sean McFly's into the gameworld. CZCW should have some women "integrated" in the roster (that's a change I always make). A division would be fine, but it's not canon so I'm not a fan of that. In my CZCW game I ended up hiring J-Ro with her "equality fighter" gimmick, and that's loads of fun. An AMW sex-appeal division seems like a fun idea that could give birth to some funny narratives.

 

I probably have more experience playing female promotions than most people here, and I was never in trouble in terms of hirings, or finding enough talent to move to global. Look: if the player want to play as SWF from the start and add a women's division, the mod already had the tools to make them succeed. If it's very early, I haven't really tested whether AAA can deal with the poaching, but this can easily be helped by adding a couple of low-skilled wrestlers to the database, preferably old. The good thing about the small women's scene is that all new workers immediately get a job like they should. You start expanding the scene, they might sit on the sidelines, and that's a definite no-no. So the need is not there, it's not canon, it would be detrimental to the actual talent in long games,... I'm having trouble understanding the need for anything other than what's suggested.

 

BONUS #1: No, I like those scripted narratives. But maybe you could give them a small chance if the player is the booker.

[lavelleuk]

The good thing about the small women's scene is that all new workers immediately get a job like they should. You start expanding the scene, they might sit on the sidelines, and that's a definite no-no. So the need is not there, it's not canon, it would be detrimental to the talent

 

Remember 2020 will have a more active indy scene now though, upto 8 shows a month including upto 4 all-women shows so they shouldn't just sit doing nothing anymore

[Peria]

I'm all for that. Your mod is actually my favorite mod and have had multiple 20+ year saves but as soon as I open a women's division I get so confused and lost because NO women have any accolades or achievements for me to play off of and create storylines that are interesting to me. I got lucky this time and AAA and QoC (Queens of Chaos) are both doing well enough, but sadly 5SSW always dies.

[Blackman]

I get so confused and lost because NO women have any accolades or achievements for me to play off of and create storylines that are interesting to me. I got lucky this time and AAA and QoC (Queens of Chaos) are both doing well enough, but sadly 5SSW always dies.

 

Geez... Sure thankful WWE didn't adapt this way of thinking.

 

Not sure about the current state of narratives, but in WMMA5, you could easily program a "women's revolution" where GAMMA and ALPHA-1 open up women's weights at a specific date. But as TEW doesn't have divisions I'm doubtful it's possible.

 

And 5SSW dying has simply to do with lack of finances and nothing more. If the AI knows how to book them now they'll stay afloat. In TEW16 you should've given them a financial injection to keep them around instead of letting them die and regretting it. In earlier TEW games, when 5SSW dies Winnow or the women's BHOTWG always takes its place later on.

[Self]

Remember 2020 will have a more active indy scene now though, upto 8 shows a month including up to 4 all-women shows so they shouldn't just sit doing nothing anymore

 

This. It definitely sounds like not being signed to a name company is no longer an issue in TEW'20. You're still going to get ring time.

 

That's exactly how I'd handle including more women in the game world. Add a bunch of unsigned talent to each game area, so that if a player wants to develop a women's division the raw materials are there. And if the player doesn't, they're going to be working low level indy shows, just hoping that wrestling promoters don't wait a couple of decades to take women's wrestling seriously.

[lavelleuk]

This. It definitely sounds like not being signed to a name company is no longer an issue in TEW'20. You're still going to get ring time.

 

That's exactly how I'd handle including more women in the game world. Add a bunch of unsigned talent to each game area, so that if a player wants to develop a women's division the raw materials are there. And if the player doesn't, they're going to be working low level indy shows, just hoping that wrestling promoters don't wait a couple of decades to take women's wrestling seriously.

 

That's what I've been working on in anticipation of the new game. Weirdly the more active indy scene is probably the feature I'm most excited for

[Derek B]

A more active indy scene is definitely going to help everything at lower levels, making it possible for workers to develop a lot more even while only working some relatively low level jobs. It's going to be great.

 

First quick update as I redo my notes for the mod.... the new name for the tag team of Victoria Stone and April Appleseed, based on their surnames being parts of fruits and having some yoga talents.... Core Strength.

 

I feel like that alone will make this the best mod ever.

[Thane of Fife]

1. I feel that women's wrestling is under-represented in the mod due to it's relative historical insignificance in Cornellverse lore, so I'm looking to expand that by adding several women to various parts of the world. I'd like to include a couple of women's divisions within the American companies. ...

 

Thoughts and preferences?

 

I agree that CZCW should have either a Women's Division or an Integrated roster (probably several of the smaller promotions could get away with integrated rosters).

 

One thing that might work with both this and the managers discussion would be to allow some of the current female non-wrestlers (like Karen Killer, Lady Melissa, Dream Girl, or even Emma Chase) to wrestle, and to add other women who are willing to wrestle or be valets. That would give them a chance to actually get work, add some depth for a potential women's division or AAA run-through, and drop in some women for the indies without inflating the women's wrestling scene beyond what it's canonically supposed to look like. You could potentially also toss in some more older women who happen to have strong, negative relationships with Heidi Brooks, which could help to explain why there is talent around that's not being used.

[Adelwolf]

I usually give XFW a "women's" division that is mostly eye candy matches and one or two strong females that work intergender matches with men... I could see them pulling that of as a desperate measure to be more "extreme" than DAVE.

[Blackman]

and to add other women who are willing to wrestle or be valets. That would give them a chance to actually get work

 

I guess I won't feel bad when I fire Jakki White Trash as AAA now. I'm fine with new additions to the roster as long as they are either A, "lookers", or B, low-skilled workers. Otherwise the entire canon from TEW2005 onward stops making sense, as these workers would've made it big or would've won titles (even when mysteriously leaving the business in 2004, which you can't program in anyway). In the end, the players is free to delete new workers anyway. The problem is when you've started a game and you only notice them later on.

 

Giving managers some crappy performance stats seems like a great idea. Irl there have been several valets who would have the occasional match that was not an automatic "F". Some at least had decent selling and safety.

 

"Core Strength" is a great name for the tag team. I might even consider debuting the AAA tag titles a little earlier than usual, if I were to play as them.

[Derek B]

<p>Been looking through the data and I'm thinking that adding some customised schedules to the data would be good.... would be a good way to give different companies a very good feel, and it could also be used as a way to set up nights for tournaments and stuff ahead of time. Things like the PGHW Elite Series and Elite Tag Series for example could be set up and spread out over an appropriate time frame if they are set as G1 style events.</p><p> </p><p>

Siimlarly, major lucha companies in real life run a LOT of events.... I could set up something for them as well in order to make them more diverse and interesting. Obviously I'd try to balance things with the rest of the world, so some thoughts for any companies (active OR yet to debut) would be helpful. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p>

I also have a feeling I might end up releasing a couple of versions of the mod.... a first one that would be 100% a finished version of the mod, and a second one with polish as more and more people come up with ideas on how to make it better using all the features. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[The Celt]

Two things:

 

1. Great to see that CV97 is coming back. I'm thinking that I'll probably attempt to do CV2001 for TEW2020, which I didn't do for TEW2016, and I knew before this that it would depend on you doing CV97 again.

 

2. As far as XFW and women goes: To me, XFW is to DAVE what XPW was to ECW in real life. XPW very much patterned itself after ECW but when even edgier on a lot of things in a euphoria of late 90s constant excess.

 

Canonically, to me, it seems like DAVE, for the most part, didn't hire that many women. Emma Chase was seemingly the only major female face associated with DAVE if we're going off past bios in TEW history. They seemed to have definitely gone the sex appeal route for a while but then cottoned on to how actually charismatic she was, so she wasn't pigeonholed in that.

 

That's not too far off what ECW did. They did exploit the sex appeal of the likes of Francine and Dawn Marie, quite heavily as the late 90s ramped up, but kept it to a certain level. Whereas on the other hand, with Beulah, they toned it down over time and made her into a more sentimental character.

 

In XPW, predictably because of the porn background of the owner Rob Black, the use of sex appeal was pretty all out in XPW. None of the girls were really there to talk like in ECW; they were there so that they could be featured on the DVD covers in bikinis. On occasion, they did do matches, but it was once in a blue moon. So likewise, I expect XFW would be similar: hot girls are used to escourted the ugly SOBs that do hardcore wrestling to the ring.

 

You could give XFW a women's division that's just a pure eye candy deal...but I'd really recommend against it. The only way for a division to be workable is that you have at least 8 people in it. Anything less than that it gets terribly repetitive. That means having to put like 8ish women on a regional promotional roster, rosters that tend to be not that big anyway. You could do less than that, and let the AI and the player pick the addtional stars to add...but then with the AI they might end up using talent who probably canonically wouldn't touch XPW with a 10-foot barge pole.

 

I personally feel like eye candy divisions for hardcore promotions are often suggested but rarely successful. The same mistake was made in the That 70s mod. In the second version they took 2 girls who were previously just managers, added another 2 girls, and made a division. Then the player would have to look for addition girls if they wanted to keep the division going.

 

Most of the time people felt like it was a chore or they simply immediately ditched the division.

 

Going back to the real world comparisons: I feel like a promotion like XFW would do a woman vs woman match, eye-based...but like once a year as like a blow-off to two managers feuding, just like ECW did in real life, and ECW did that in imitation of what the promotions of the 1980s would do. I don't think the fans would care for monthly matches between the women. It's good as a rare spectacle that shakes up a card once in a while; as a regular thing, it just becomes part of the woodwork.

 

So yeah, long story short I'm rather against it. Not venomously, just in principle. Girls on the roster as managers, definitely, but not in the ring. It wasn't an enlightened time in North America about women in wrestling in real life and probably wasn't in the C-Verse either. That, and what I've already said above about how it actually plays.

 

3. As far as more Deathmatch workers go:

 

Playing previous versions of the mod, often as XFW, I never found it too difficult to get the kind of roster I wanted. The starting XFW roster I actually quite enjoy: I like the oddball, broken toy vibes they have. I would hire on new people and I don't recall struggling too badly to get new recruits. Two or three additional "obviously a deathmatch sort of guy" types in the mod that could be used by XFW or DAVE wouldn't be overdoing it, but at the same time, you don't necessarily need to fill under pressure to definitely get them in.

 

That said, it has been a good while since I've played TEW and I might not be remembering everything I need to remember here.

[Dalton]

Been looking through the data and I'm thinking that adding some customised schedules to the data would be good.... would be a good way to give different companies a very good feel, and it could also be used as a way to set up nights for tournaments and stuff ahead of time. Things like the PGHW Elite Series and Elite Tag Series for example could be set up and spread out over an appropriate time frame if they are set as G1 style events.

 

Siimlarly, major lucha companies in real life run a LOT of events.... I could set up something for them as well in order to make them more diverse and interesting. Obviously I'd try to balance things with the rest of the world, so some thoughts for any companies (active OR yet to debut) would be helpful.

 

I also have a feeling I might end up releasing a couple of versions of the mod.... a first one that would be 100% a finished version of the mod, and a second one with polish as more and more people come up with ideas on how to make it better using all the features.

 

I know it's probably some more work for you, but I would definitely love customized schedules. Being able to set up a realistic schedule for puro and lucha companies in one of my favorite new features, as I am a purohead myself! It's something I plan on doing myself if it's not in the first release of this data. Obviously there are more important features for you to worry about!

[Thane of Fife]

Another interesting option for a women's promotion could be a GLOW-type company. The Cornellverse often seems a bit delayed compared to reality, so something like that could fit in the '97 period. Say it's been around for 5-10 years or so, but now it's struggling as the rise of AAA is stealing its market.

 

Give them a not-so-great booker, some older women of moderate talent, a couple women with potential who would eventually go to AAA, and some younger women who are more pretty than talented and you've got a company. You could put them at war with AAA and say that "historically," AAA wins and puts them out of business.

 

In game terms, that could put more importance on a big star like Catherine Quine and give some justification for why AAA is a bit more T&A-focused in the '97 data than it is in the present.

[Blackman]

For the question about the women's presence: I honestly wouldn't add any new companies unless there's a draught like AUS, and would rather explore new divisions like several people suggested. It's probably best left to testing games so you can see what actions the gameworld takes without player intervention. As TheCelt says, the AI will probably botch the use of these divisions as it would be very hard to program. I assume it will likely spam the same match over and over.

 

Maybe Hollyweird could have a division? It might be a little too ambitious (and it's definitely not canonical ) but it will help kickstart women in the C-verse earlier than usual. Because indeed, given the parallels with "reality", the women's intrusion in the top level comes very late. WWE had at least B-level stars in 2002. The C-verse basically remained dormant until 2005, as canon NOTBPW's women's division was - quite frankly - a joke . Anyhow, with the existing workers it's unsustainable. There's only the fictional "Ashley Amazon" & "Dixie Diamond", and then Bertha Mayle, who can even be considered by a big company such as Hollyweird, so that's not nearly enough. Stardust is locked to AAA I presume. Katie & Jakki won't cut it. Unless you take a page from Adam and set everyone's pop to the maximum level for the region, like Jakki to 21 everywhere (instead of just in Texas).

 

But I still think the best option is to just leave it to the player. I'm not sure what small features Adam has made unannounced, like automatic women's divisions (WMMA5 had it, but that's a different context). The thing is: if the player cares about it, he will most likely take action and start a women's division. With the presence of AAA, NOTBPW and 5SSW, there's enough other places to work. If the player doesn't care (I assure you most won't), it's better to leave the canon intact. Realistically, there should only be the occasional women's match on an indy card. Having an "all-female" indy event is doubtful given the state of the women and not needed.

 

I've always "modded" your mod with CZCW set on integrated, and it worked fine. Obviously it's not going to follow canon but that's to be expected. TEW16 would often let them work double or triple schedules, but it seemed to work. AAA often gets the short end of the stick and will 'inherit' tired workers during their one action day, but it's still doable.

[Derek B]

Thanks for the input so far everyone. I've not made any decisions YET on most things but I have an idea where I'm leaning.

 

Got another question for people today.....

 

Should I scrap the Hinote Dojo promotion?

 

My thinking is.... while the company did exist in canon for a while, it was always just a way to give BHOTWG a place to help develop youngsters. With the improvements to the Young Lion system, worker development in general, excursions and company relationships I think I can do a far better job using those workers in other ways. Some might find their way to the BHOTWG main roster, some may be on excursion to add variation to other talent pools and some could be in the free agent pool or other rosters.

 

The Hinote Dojo schedule has always been a little strange anyway the way I have it set up and I was looking at changing that, but straight up removing the company may actually make for the most interesting changes and make better use of TEW20's features.

 

Thoughts?

[Bigpapa42]

Given that Hinote would still exist as the BH-linked dojo.... it makes sense. Someone running Burning Hammer can create a child promotion of their own easily enough.

 

I've always viewed Hinote as one of the dojos that just runs SOME shows on their own. I realize they were more than that for a long time, but it just feels like that kinda of situation. The training is the main focus and the shows they promote are more occasional than normal. Kinda like what Noah did with SEM, or even the way that Toryumon Mexico seems to function.

 

One of my own canon ideas is that those involved with Hinote are stern traditionalists who want to stick very closely to Kitizon's intentions rather than evolve them in any way. When I would run BHTOWG in the past, I would always keep the Hinote roster native-only (as that seems like something traditionally Japanese) and open a second child company that would allow gaijin talent.

[Blackman]

Another thing you might want to consider is drastically lowering the resilience of the workers who (canonically) ended up getting injured for life.

 

Farrah Hesketh and Reese Paige were the most significant losses from the women's side, and Craig Prince afaik for the men. Farrah and Reese have 84 and 88 RES respectively, which seems insanely high (Craig has 71, which is more reasonable). Though a freak accident can always happen, and the aim of this database is not to faithfully reproduce history, it seems very unlikely that it will in any playthrough. Why not lower it by 50 once you run your first watcher games and see what happens? They will probably be fine, but it might set them up for a big (but probably not career-treatening) injury somewhere along the road.

 

As for the question of the Hinote dojo: you should know best how the game adapts to it not being there. Only testing will tell.

[Jaysin]

I'd rather Hinote Dojo stay on as a feeder league.

[Derek B]

Another thing you might want to consider is drastically lowering the resilience of the workers who (canonically) ended up getting injured for life.

 

Farrah Hesketh and Reese Paige were the most significant losses from the women's side, and Craig Prince afaik for the men. Farrah and Reese have 84 and 88 RES respectively, which seems insanely high (Craig has 71, which is more reasonable). Though a freak accident can always happen, and the aim of this database is not to faithfully reproduce history, it seems very unlikely that it will in any playthrough. Why not lower it by 50 once you run your first watcher games and see what happens? They will probably be fine, but it might set them up for a big (but probably not career-treatening) injury somewhere along the road.

 

As for the question of the Hinote dojo: you should know best how the game adapts to it not being there. Only testing will tell.

 

I'd considered doing that in older versions of the mod, but I decided against it for the same reason you said there. Freak injuries happen and there's nothing about any of them that suggests that they would be injury prone. They were unlucky, and the game does a good job at handing out unlucky injuries to people as it is. For every worker who lasts longer than they did canonically, another will get a career ender that will send them down a totally different path.

 

I'd rather Hinote Dojo stay on as a feeder league.

 

Crowd so far seems torn on this one. I think I'll wait until people have got their hands on the demo and can see some of the features in action. Might make it easier to get feedback on some of the newer aspects of the game and a solid idea of what I could do with it that is different from the current set up.