Public Beta Reaction Thread

[Texasrangers13]

Spent the first 11 days of the trial modifying and converting a RW mod. Finally dove in for my first test today... Gotta say, I LOVE IT. The changes are great. The interface took no time to get used to. Ya it is different, but change isn't a bad thing. I do agree that some of the bright white on black UI needs changing, but there are plenty of great skins out and coming. I'm using Kamchatka's at the moment.

 

My show ratings are coming in right where I feel like they should, my viewers look close to where I'd expect them. All told, very happy. Attendance levels are a bit down, but I don't mind that, I'd rather them be low than way over inflated like in the past. I will say it is odd that they fluctuate during tapings.

 

My biggest concern overall is the match ratio...

B-Shows are having 2-3 dark matches and then 3-4 regular matches. I get dark matches, but if I'm taping a set of shows, the taped episodes wouldn't also get dark matches... especially for the B show... Those poor fans are getting 4 hours of a b-show, plus dark matches, and then 4 hours of the A-show... OOOF.

 

 

Some examples:

WWE NXT (2 Hour show, 3 dark matches, 9 regular matches, 6 angles. match/angle ratio is good... but total amount of matches is high. For reference, pre-COVID they were averaging 2 Dark and 6 matches in real life. I could shorten the show to 1:30 to account for commercials, and may go that route.)

 

Raw is typically in that 7-8 matches in 3 hours range in reality, so I'm not upset with the number coming in at 8-9 matches per-show.

 

They seem to get really out of whack when we look at PPV's... for the Royal Rumble (A historic event) we had 6 pre-show matches, and then 11 matches and 17 angles. (The actual Royal Rumble had 6 matches and 2 pre-show kickoff). I get that the AI can't quite process this, but it would be nice to be able to cap the Pre-show matches... YES incredibly nitpicky.

 

My mexican promotions, AAA/CMLL are having 12-14 televised matches on their 1:30 show... that seems incredibly aggressive even for Lucha Libre.

 

Any thoughts or suggestions to curb some of this?

 

Overall this game is clearly a step up and will be a purchase day of. Excellent work.

[Matt_Black]

What's the auto Booker set to on your product screen?

[TeemuFoundation]

I will say it is odd that they fluctuate during tapings.

This is a glitch that was fixed in one of the patches.

[Donners]

My take is that people had too high expectations about what TEW 2020 being rebuilt from the ground up meant and represented. I think people made the assumption that it meant it would be rebuilt in a more modern way using a more modern method and thus have a more modern back end and modern functionality when the reality is while it was rebuilt it was rebuilt using the same language and thus has those same limitations and limits. Pretty much every complaint or question where the answer is "sorry, we simply can't do or change that" fundamentally comes back to that point. People have to decide whether that's a dealbreaker for them or not.

 

That’s well put. I’m probably one of those people. I’ve learned to live with it being stuck in a small (to my resolution) window, running it in admin mode and the like, but things like having to choose between coloured numbers and the ability to scroll really bring home just how limited it is.

 

When you consider that it’s the seventh iteration over 16 years in a commercial series, it is not unreasonable to be a bit frustrated by the continued fundamental limitations.

 

While it might not be a deal-breaker for most people who have become accustomed to it (though I think it will be an increasing problem as the game gets more feature-rich, and other games continue to make strides forward in UI), it makes it a really hard sell to potential new players.

[Makhai]

I think the complaints about having to run in admin mode are less directly to do with running in admin mode itself (although it is a touch annoying) and more than it's a sign of how... I guess "old fashioned" is just about accurate... TEW currently is. No, other programs (and games in particular) can't change picture files while making a database in your programs folder without being in admin mode but that's because they don't need to change picture files while making a database in your programs folder to begin with; they generally use the Documents folder for things like that and have for years. It can be seen in the same light as the complaints about things that can't be changed due to limitations in the programming language.

 

My take is that people had too high expectations about what TEW 2020 being rebuilt from the ground up meant and represented. I think people made the assumption that it meant it would be rebuilt in a more modern way using a more modern method and thus have a more modern back end and modern functionality when the reality is while it was rebuilt it was rebuilt using the same language and thus has those same limitations and limits. Pretty much every complaint or question where the answer is "sorry, we simply can't do or change that" fundamentally comes back to that point. People have to decide whether that's a dealbreaker for them or not. It's not for me; yes, so far TE2020 has limitations and is probably an inherently less satisfying user experience then you might expect from a 2020 release but nothing that wrenches me out of it or really impacts on my overall enjoyment. If nothing else, while someone being harsh may pejoratively call it "Stockholm syndrome", once you play enough and get used to all the little quirks they end up being second nature.

 

Visual Basic is a near 30-year-old platform at this point. And Microsoft stopped supporting it ages ago. As we move further on there is a real risk that this will get worse with 8k resolutions, and adaptive text scaling, and we'll need to run compatibility modes with fixed resolutions to fire these games moving into the next decade. Adam has gone as far as he can in VB. If the game is to progress onward, its time for a new foundation.

[consortium11]

That’s well put. I’m probably one of those people. I’ve learned to live with it being stuck in a small (to my resolution) window, running it in admin mode and the like, but things like having to choose between coloured numbers and the ability to scroll really bring home just how limited it is.

 

When you consider that it’s the seventh iteration over 16 years in a commercial series, it is not unreasonable to be a bit frustrated by the continued fundamental limitations.

 

While it might not be a deal-breaker for most people who have become accustomed to it (though I think it will be an increasing problem as the game gets more feature-rich, and other games continue to make strides forward in UI), it makes it a really hard sell to potential new players.

 

Visual Basic is a near 30-year-old platform at this point. And Microsoft stopped supporting it ages ago. As we move further on there is a real risk that this will get worse with 8k resolutions, and adaptive text scaling, and we'll need to run compatibility modes with fixed resolutions to fire these games moving into the next decade. Adam has gone as far as he can in VB. If the game is to progress onward, its time for a new foundation.

 

Resolution is probably the big one for me. I know it's basically the definition of a first world problem but I'm running a 1440p monitor and the window is noticeably on the small side and can get frustrating on long play sessions (although hopefully the revamped skins help with that). I can scale my display of course (but adding to the first world problems side of it) I also run a Rainmeter custom desktop and changing the display scale messes that up.

 

The other issue with resolution is that it always acts as a reminder of how limited things are. All the other quirks I can (and to an extent have) got used to already, from the arrows for moving angles and matches around to the cluttered screens to having to make extensive use of the notepad for things that I'd instinctively think are a pop-up window away but every so often I just instinctively think "shouldn't I be able to resize this window or at least make it full screen" only to remember "no, I can't" and that in some ways this game which is a labour of love and clearly has a vast amount of time and effort put into it is in some ways far less functional than the most basic and low effort of asset dump "games" built on a more modern platform.

[Owen Rey]

I’d just like to add that I have decided I probably am not buying this game, at least not for a long while. The layout is far too much for me to overcome, way worse quality of life than TEW 16 and all the games prior. Re-skinning won’t help, as I’ve tried many skins. On top of the layout, the sandbox feel has been stripped away and I can’t put my finger on why. It goes past custom products, I just feel like even with preferences and settings and everything I can’t play this in as fun of a fashion as previous additions. I know this adds nothing new to the discussion but since this is the place to react to the beta, might as well put my final reaction in here.

[Sons of Kohral]

I’d just like to add that I have decided I probably am not buying this game, at least not for a long while. The layout is far too much for me to overcome, way worse quality of life than TEW 16 and all the games prior. Re-skinning won’t help, as I’ve tried many skins. On top of the layout, the sandbox feel has been stripped away and I can’t put my finger on why. It goes past custom products, I just feel like even with preferences and settings and everything I can’t play this in as fun of a fashion as previous additions. I know this adds nothing new to the discussion but since this is the place to react to the beta, might as well put my final reaction in here.

 

I think the layout is mainly because we've all been playing the older version for so long. We might get used to the new layout and like it more, who knows. I wont really know until I get a nice long term game going. I remember there was a bit of an uproar about WMMA 5's layout and that basically subsided after about 2 months post release and it had a similar, "all the buttons on one screen" layout.

 

I'm most concerned about games slowing to a halt 3+ years in.

[Owen Rey]

I think the layout is mainly because we've all been playing the older version for so long. We might get used to the new layout and like it more, who knows. I wont really know until I get a nice long term game going. I remember there was a bit of an uproar about WMMA 5's layout and that basically subsided after about 2 months post release and it had a similar, "all the buttons on one screen" layout.

 

I'm most concerned about games slowing to a halt 3+ years in.

 

Fair point about getting used to it, but if I can't get used to it after a week of hard play, I can't see myself getting used to it. I have put more hours into TEW 13 and 16 than any other video game so I'm happy keeping myself to 16 for now unless some impeccable mod gets released on 20 that I don't stop hearing about.

 

With that said, I don't really care about the crazy amount of buttons. Doesn't bother me. What bothers me is the new style lists. I know they can be replaced in many places, and i know they technically "look cooler" or whatever, but every screen that they exist in is a screen that is less practical to use than previous editions. I also hate how while the game window is larger and should be able to fit more info, it's harder than ever to read through a worker's stats. Mostly because there's no scroll support, but that could be fixed by spreading the stats out instead of putting them in one column. Too late for that though. I dislike the lack of a singular "move up/down" button in the booking screen, instead being replaced by small individual buttons that make large shows very tedious to book. Those are just some of my complaints. And even if all the UI problems were fixed (too late for that now so I won't ask for it or expect it), the game still feels more like a chore than ever. Which is cool for people who want a straight up realistic wrestling simulator but it's never how I've played.

 

Again, I know these things have been touched on frequently, more than frequently really, so I'm adding nothing new. But I believe people need to keep putting in their true reactions, positive or negative, as long as it doesn't start arguments and doesn't get personal.

[FlightlessGypsy]

Fair point about getting used to it, but if I can't get used to it after a week of hard play, I can't see myself getting used to it. I have put more hours into TEW 13 and 16 than any other video game so I'm happy keeping myself to 16 for now unless some impeccable mod gets released on 20 that I don't stop hearing about.

 

With that said, I don't really care about the crazy amount of buttons. Doesn't bother me. What bothers me is the new style lists. I know they can be replaced in many places, and i know they technically "look cooler" or whatever, but every screen that they exist in is a screen that is less practical to use than previous editions. I also hate how while the game window is larger and should be able to fit more info, it's harder than ever to read through a worker's stats. Mostly because there's no scroll support, but that could be fixed by spreading the stats out instead of putting them in one column. Too late for that though. I dislike the lack of a singular "move up/down" button in the booking screen, instead being replaced by small individual buttons that make large shows very tedious to book. Those are just some of my complaints. And even if all the UI problems were fixed (too late for that now so I won't ask for it or expect it), the game still feels more like a chore than ever. Which is cool for people who want a straight up realistic wrestling simulator but it's never how I've played.

 

Again, I know these things have been touched on frequently, more than frequently really, so I'm adding nothing new. But I believe people need to keep putting in their true reactions, positive or negative, as long as it doesn't start arguments and doesn't get personal.

 

Not trying to discredit your opinion in any way, but a week of hard play is what compared to days of hard play on the old layout? Every two month game I play, it seems to become more and more natural for me. Hoping the eventual same for you guys too.

[Donners]

I remember there was a bit of an uproar about WMMA 5's layout and that basically subsided after about 2 months post release and it had a similar, "all the buttons on one screen" layout.

 

I find WMMA to be a more passive game than TEW; I've got a very long save in WMMA 5 and have barely looked at many of the screens. TEW requires a fair bit more involvement.

 

Familiarity will certainly help, though; plenty of people are just coming off 16 - or, worse, still bouncing between 16 and 20 - which makes it hard to adjust to new placement of screens.

[FlightlessGypsy]

I find WMMA to be a more passive game than TEW; I've got a very long save in WMMA 5 and have barely looked at many of the screens. TEW requires a fair bit more involvement.

 

Familiarity will certainly help, though; plenty of people are just coming off 16 - or, worse, still bouncing between 16 and 20 - which makes it hard to adjust to new placement of screens.

 

I'd call WMMA more of a simulator over a sandbox though, the fighting mechanics take away the need for true creative booking. Taking creativity features and tools away from that game wouldn't damage it as much, I don't think. I agree with what you're saying though and believe this game will push through. Just food for thought.

[FlightlessGypsy]

I find WMMA to be a more passive game than TEW; I've got a very long save in WMMA 5 and have barely looked at many of the screens. TEW requires a fair bit more involvement.

 

Familiarity will certainly help, though; plenty of people are just coming off 16 - or, worse, still bouncing between 16 and 20 - which makes it hard to adjust to new placement of screens.

 

Said what I was trying to say but better

[Makhai]

I find WMMA to be a more passive game than TEW; I've got a very long save in WMMA 5 and have barely looked at many of the screens. TEW requires a fair bit more involvement.

 

Familiarity will certainly help, though; plenty of people are just coming off 16 - or, worse, still bouncing between 16 and 20 - which makes it hard to adjust to new placement of screens.

 

WMMA is about watching the fights play out, and then seeing how that changes history. I remember one save in WMMA 2 when Sarkano KO'd Ziskie with a spinning back fist after the AI booked that fight. I'd done 100 saves and when this fight got booked it always ended with Ziskie tapping him out in the early rounds as he's just a much more complete fighter. The win turned Sarkano into a god in a year. And this is just one outcome. Fights and where fighters go to camp can turn entire saves on their head. And that's the fun of that game. The fun of this game is watching the world develop around the work you put in. That requires alot more of you.

[djthefunkchris]

Not trying to discredit your opinion in any way, but a week of hard play is what compared to days of hard play on the old layout? Every two month game I play, it seems to become more and more natural for me. Hoping the eventual same for you guys too.

 

I will say the more you play the easier it is to navigate. That's true with about everything though. Most find a multitude of things, but I'm hoping by the time the game is ready at least some of the things people don't think is possible to fix, do get fixed. I've seen similar happen before, so there is that.

[FlightlessGypsy]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I will say the more you play the easier it is to navigate. That's true with about everything though. Most find a multitude of things, but I'm hoping by the time the game is ready at least some of the things people don't think is possible to fix, do get fixed. I've seen similar happen before, so there is that.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Yeah, same boat here friend. I'm not expecting magic but an extra coat of paint would be nice.</p>

[WalterSobchak]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I've seen you around talking about the development territories and other things as well, so it's not like you think the game is golden.<p> </p><p> There really haven't been many that said they wouldn't buy it, so your comment it kind of overboard. Maybe something just struck you wrong or something, doesn't seem normal for you.</p><p> </p><p> Anyways, hope that was more tongue in cheek, and your really not that upset, his post was pretty nice and respectful, too much to get such a reaction if you were even reacting to him.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It was meant tongue and cheek and I appreciate you seeing the levity. Golden...no, but there are also things like the UI that while strange at first for 2016 players...starts to grow on you as folks are starting to allude to and Kam had the solid Blue and God skin available what within twenty-four hours of the beta release? I think the game is on it’s way to being what everybody wants it to be and while this may be a tough time to be patient, I think a lot of folks will eventually see what they hope to see in the final release. Adam has already shown a willingness to adjust and correct, my hope is the community continues to meet him half-way.</p>

[BrokenCycle]

<p>WMMA has less stuff to worry about, but the UI is much more organized than TEW. WMMA5 has more small icons that give relevant information, and it makes use of hover boxes over text or icons that TEW lacks for whatever reason. For example, you could hover over the icon that shows an increase in popularity and it tells you how much popularity they gained.</p><p> </p><p>

You can also... like... fire people from the contract screen?</p>

[Slim Jim]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jaredpalexander" data-cite="jaredpalexander" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You awesome people who are going above and beyond to let everyone else know you are not buying the game, or not buying it right now, or might buy it at some point but not right now, but maybe will if this one thing changes, but definitely still not...the rest of us have all been really worried about your decision, so please know we will all sleep better tonight knowing your intentions. <p> </p><p> Truly...as someone who’s been actively observing the forum for about fifteen years, I can’t tell you how many fly by night forum joiners I have lost sleep over when you all just jump on days before or after a beta launch to inundate everyone else with your consistent and adolescent lack of patience, pissing, and moaning...only to then disappear into the digital aether after contributing absolutely nothing of substance to the GDS community.</p><p> </p><p> I really shouldn’t get so attached, but it’s just your attitude and demeanor are so super helpful and make a release so much more enjoyable because as you already know this whole community is about you and about how you feel, so again thank you from everybody for letting us know your displeasure and trivial hangups, I can sleep easy tonight knowing you are out their carrying all that burden for us sinners.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It’s almost like you weren’t the intended audience for posts about whether or not someone will be buying the game. You’re aware that this is a reaction thread for people to post their reactions? Can you genuinely not see the value for Adam and his team to know how potential customers are feeling in regards to the game? People posting their reasons for not (or potentially not) buying the game give Adam information he can use to either make changes or not. If he reads something that gives a reason for not buying he can decide as the developer if making the suggested change is worth it to him or not. Some things will be, such as redesigning the interface. Somethings won’t be, like rewriting the product system. That’s fine either way but at least he has the information to make those choices. If no one posted the reasons for not buying the game and instead just didn’t buy the game, nothing would change and they still wouldn’t buy the game.</p><p> </p><p> Anyway, I’m glad you’re sleeping better. <img alt=":)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[FlightlessGypsy]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BrokenCycle" data-cite="BrokenCycle" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>WMMA has less stuff to worry about, but the UI is much more organized than TEW. WMMA5 has more small icons that give relevant information, and it makes use of hover boxes over text or icons that TEW lacks for whatever reason. For example, you could hover over the icon that shows an increase in popularity and it tells you how much popularity they gained.<p> </p><p> <strong>You can also... like... fire people from the contract screen?</strong></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Next gen! <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[djthefunkchris]

<p>I will say this is the weirdest one I've seen here. From WMMA, To CBH, to all those RPG types the new dev has been dishing out. This is the weirdest reactions by far. I've never seen so many love and dislike the same things. </p><p> </p><p>

The weirdest thing to me though, is I've never seen so many people try to keep others from expressing things they see problematic. This thread alone has gone back and forth, back and forth, needlessly. It's for reacting (good or bad) to the game, how you feel about it. Those really aren't negotiable terms, but I see people trying to tell others how they feel, or rather, how they think they should feel. I feel that they are just being loyal to Adam which is awesome, but trying to hide everything anyone has a problem with doesn't help the game at all.</p><p> </p><p>

If I say I don't like the booking screen... that's not negotiable (I don't hate it, but for the sake of my point). I just don't like it, I want easier control. That's not something you can change someone's mind. If it doesn't bother you, that don't automatically make my viewpoint non valid. What that feels like is like when your trying to order pizza, and want pepperoni and mushrooms and someone behind you is yelling "No, get anchovies!! You have to get anchovies!!!". And you absolutely hate anchovies. Just fill it in for yourself, and have the person yelling something you don't like, like that's the decision you have to make. That's what it's like when someone is constantly debating you on how you feel about the game.</p>

[Jaded]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I feel that they are just being loyal to Adam which is awesome, but trying to hide everything anyone has a problem with doesn't help the game at all.<p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Agree strongly with this. As much as I'm loving the game, there have been MAJOR issues fixed with numerous patches. If people were just going "Oh, yeah, this is cool" there's absolutely no reason to think we'd currently having a working momentum system, for example, which would have screwed the game world up massively.</p><p> </p><p> And from Adam's point of view, presumably having a significant number of people tell him they won't buy and why IS useful feedback. Because if sales figures do end up down on 16, then it lets him see which things put people off, and he can consider whether to adjust them for the (hoped-for) next game in the series.</p>

[Jaded]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jaredpalexander" data-cite="jaredpalexander" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div> Golden...no, but there are also things like the UI that while strange at first for 2016 players...starts to grow on you as folks are starting to allude to and Kam had the solid Blue and Gold skin available what within twenty-four hours of the beta release?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> As great as the Blue and Gold skin is, it's not what people will see immediately on downloading it, and there will be people who aren't necessarily going to realise there's already skins available. Thankfully, the game's graphic designer is working on the UI, but that's in response to feedback in this thread - again, if that feedback hadn't been forthcoming, we'd have a game which a significant amount of people, myself included, couldn't even play for a decent period of time without getting headaches!</p>

[Donners]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47578" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div> I've never seen so many love and dislike the same things. <p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> A lot of that comes down to the fact that people can play the game in very different ways.</p><p> </p><p> At one extreme you have those who play it pretty much as a fantasy fed, at the other you have those who treat it as a game to be beaten - with plenty of variation in between.</p><p> </p><p> That means there are a lot of different, and sometimes conflicting, expectations - any change is liable to be loved by some and hated by others.</p>

[nerodragomir1]

Noticed the list for bugs is getting smaller & smaller. I think I'd only found like 2 crashes my entire time playing. Good to see it though.