The Official ROH Discussion Thread

[smurphy1014]

Got this off of roh's site:

 

Roderick Strong w/ Truth Martini over Tyler Bloack © to capture the ROH World Title after a combination of high-impact moves that ended with a Sick Kick before pinning Black.

 

Strong offered his hand to Tyler in a shake, but was met with the a double middle finger.

 

The arena went dark and Homicide returned to ROH....going toface to face with Strong as the iPPV went offline.

[Jaysin]

So was this show as boring and bad as people said it was? And Davey Richards is NOT retiring now? What changed his mind? And why was he retiring in the first place?

 

He said he was retiring to be with his wife, and tonight he said that he lost his grandparents and wife and wrestling is the only thing that's ever been constant in his life, so he's staying in wrestling.

 

Daniels vs Aries was nice with a really cool finish. Aries was crotched on the top rope with Daniels sitting on the turnbuckle, he hit an Angel's Wings from the top for the win. It looked sweet.

 

Kings of Wrestling vs World's Greatest Tag Team was good, but that loaded elbow pad is so freaking dumb. Really, are we in the 70s or 80s?

 

Roderick vs Tyler was fun I thought. Tyler did Cena's you can't see me taunt which pissed everyone off, except me evidently who laughed. If anything this made me like Tyler more. His character is great.

 

Everything else on the show was lame in my opinion. Even though from what I can tell people are ranting and raving about the double chain match, it bored me to tears. I love Colt and El Generico and it was just not one of their better matches.

At Final Battle its going to be Roderick Strong vs Davey Richards for the title...sooo...Roddy might be an interim champ

[Lo-Drew]

In all honestly, I'm not upset that Strong is the ROH champ. I thinks he kinda deserves it considering that he's done great in what seven years of his ROH tenure. Let's put it like this, he's not Xavier. Plus, Strong's been like a backbone to ROH, constantly having great matches with the best and yeah he's probably the last guy I want to talk on the mic, there i no question that Strong's a good worker. So, we'll see how this turns out but I think his reign won't be as bad as people think.

[The Final Countdown]

Wow, I am not seeing any reason why people say ROH is the best in the world while watching this event. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but I don't get it. It's like there's a cult that follows this promotion and everything they do is gold, but it's just boring to me. The only thing that got me pumped is Davey Richards saying he's not retiring.

...or maybe this show just wasn't nearly as good as most others? Death Before Dishonor was MILES better. This was a pretty mediocre show, but that doesn't mean every other ROH show is bad.

 

I enjoyed Daniels/Aries, KOW/WGTT, and Tyler/Roderick. The stream kept going out during the chain match, so I can't really comment on that one. But yeah, this wasn't even CLOSE to the best that ROH has to offer.

 

Good: Homicide is back. Sweet!

 

Bad: Blanderick is champion. Blah.

[MightyDavidson]

Roddy Strong is champion, I have no problem with that at all.

 

The loaded elbow pad is far from dumb however, it's easy heel heat. Just because it's an old fashioned gimmick does not mean that it's bad.

[Hyde Hill]

...or maybe this show just wasn't nearly as good as most others? Death Before Dishonor was MILES better. This was a pretty mediocre show, but that doesn't mean every other ROH show is bad.

 

I enjoyed Daniels/Aries, KOW/WGTT, and Tyler/Roderick. The stream kept going out during the chain match, so I can't really comment on that one. But yeah, this wasn't even CLOSE to the best that ROH has to offer.

 

Good: Homicide is back. Sweet!

 

Bad: Blanderick is champion. Blah.

 

Still isn't this their supposed top show? Or joint top show with DBD? Then if this was a poor outing it could hamper growth or in the worst case hurt business.

[Jaysin]

...or maybe this show just wasn't nearly as good as most others? Death Before Dishonor was MILES better. This was a pretty mediocre show, but that doesn't mean every other ROH show is bad.

 

Which is why I posted another post asking if all their shows are this boring.

 

and I strongly disagree about the loaded elbow pad. It's just corny.

[MightyDavidson]

Which is why I posted another post asking if all their shows are this boring.

 

and I strongly disagree about the loaded elbow pad. It's just corny.

 

It's not the least bit corny. Piece of metal sewn into his elbow pad allows him to knock people out, it's simple but effective. Now if Hero were a wrestling race car driver or something like that, I'd agree with you but the loaded elbow pad is far from corny in my opinion.

[Lo-Drew]

Still isn't this their supposed top show? Or joint top show with DBD? Then if this was a poor outing it could hamper growth or in the worst case hurt business.

 

I thought Final Battle was their top show. I'm unsure and I've watched ROH for six years.

 

Quick question, have they announced Survival of the Fittest yet because I saw the SotF in 2006 as it came to Cleveland and to this day, Delirious and Sydal as the final two was awesome.

[Lo-Drew]

It's not the least bit corny. Piece of metal sewn into his elbow pad allows him to knock people out, it's simple but effective. Now if Hero were a wrestling race car driver or something like that, I'd agree with you but the loaded elbow pad is far from corny in my opinion.

 

I have to agree. Nothing better than good old school tactic. However, ROH has kinda overdone it so that can work. I wold love to see it done more rarely, like once in a while to bring the element of surprise.

[MightyDavidson]

I have to agree. Nothing better than good old school tactic. However, ROH has kinda overdone it so that can work. I wold love to see it done more rarely, like once in a while to bring the element of surprise.

 

Fair enough. I personally would like to see more old school tactics used more often in wrestling, it'd add a bit more variety to things in my opinion. Like the phantom foreign object bit you'd see wrestlers do from time to time, that sort of thing. Just because it's old school doesn't mean it's bad.

[MrCanada]

first iPPV experience, so lets do the always lame STAR RATINGS (and explanation):

 

Kenny King d. Jay Briscoe

** - Dissapointing. I just dont think the Briscoe's really care anymore. I remember watching them in 2002 and they were new and exciting and showing potential. Now they are the exact same wrestlers except to old to show any potential and too obsessed with being strong style.

 

Mark Briscoe d. Rhett Titus -

*1/2 - Why... why must Titus now start moving away from a gimmick that made him unique? These two first matche, and reviews, could be basically interchanged but this one just didnt have quiet as much talent. But Titus & King used to be fun because of their gimmicks, now what are they? Indyrific. Briscoes have peaked.

 

The Embassy d. Grizzy Redwood & Balls Mahoney

* = This is the same as if the WWE did Michael Tarver & Heath Slater (Tarver = Butcher, no talent. Slater = Stevens, has talent, but for some reason is just meh) vs. Santino Marella and Vladimir Kozlov. Fine for what it was, but clearly no one cares about Redwood. No one really gives a damn about Butcher once he stops mutilating himself, no one cares about Erick Stevens outside Florida indies, and luckily Balls is half-decent and this was in NY.

 

Generico & Cabana d. Steen & Corino

*1/2 = Here's my idea for a match. Lets take El Generico, but take away the spotfest. Lets take Cabana, but take away the comedy, lets take Steen and continue to try and convince people he's a bad ass, and lets take Corino, and have him try and make this work. Dont get me wrong, I like Corino & Cabana, them, 1-on-1 in this kind of match MAY have worked. But Generico is just bland to me. 15 yakuza kicks later and what has he done besides be pale? Steen I see as ROH's equivelant of Test. He has some cool moves, he has a unique look (Test has a good one), and he is put in semi-interesting angles... but he just doesnt click. He's not that main star. Can anyone really see him with the belt? Even if you could, do you think him with the belt is what might help boost ROH up? So why waste time on him? In many ways, like most things with ROH, its usually the same problems for the same people. Generico & Steen are indy darlings, and will NEVER be anything more. Cabana could be bigger, Corino could to, or at least is a good gatekeeper. I think the most upsetting thing is the actual use of the chain. They didnt do anything innovative, rare for a company who should be on the cutting edge. I dont know what I was expecting but it was more then what he saw. A couple chain-wrapped punches and some tug-of-war... BUYRATES!

 

Eddie Edwards d. Shawn Daivari

*** = Overrated by me? Yup. But I saw the potential of this match. In reality it was about the same as Jay vs. King, but I just liked it. It made Eddie look like a real competitor (instead of American Wolfe 2) and showed Daivari has skills if people didnt know already. The only thing thats sad is this didnt get more time.

 

Christopher Daniels d. Austin Aries

*** - I havnt seen a lot of Aries lately, he never really did it for me. However he actually seems to have a fun entertaining character going now and I like it. These two simply delievered a solid wrestling match. Solid match = ***. Average match = ** if you havnt been keeping score. Best comparison is I think if you gave Edwards & Daivari this same time they could have a great match too.

 

Kings of Wrestling d. Wrestling's Greatest Tag Team

***1/2 = Should of been 4 stars, but it seemed to die at the end. Hopefully ROH brings WGTT back as they could be very entertaining, and if you eventually go to a Haas vs. Benjamin feud in a while that would be cool. Benjamin is someone to put on a DVD cover with a title and people might actually buy it. Finish killed this match. I understand what they are doing, so this match COULD be redeemed in the future. IF all these cheap finishes lead to something, fine. If not. ROH is dumb.

 

Roderick Strong d. Tyler Black

** - Does anyone REALLY like Roderick Strong? Dont get me wrong, he has some sick moves. HOLY **** moves. And Black too for that matter and they take incredible bumps. All Strong has to do now is figure out the parts in between the moves, figure out a better look, and figure out how to talk on the mic. If he does all that, he may one day grow up to become Jamie Noble (thats a compliment and an insult all at once). This move is typical indy stuff these days. STIFF KICK! ELBOW ELBOW ELBOW! CHOP! SLAP! CHOP! SPOT! PIN! KICK! SUBMISSION! OUT! ELBOW ELBOW ELBOW! KICK! SPOT! CHOP! SLAP! SUBMISSION! KICK! and on-and-on. If you think I'm trolling on that one, when the match becomes availible onDemand on monday I'll write up a move-for-move report. Then try and write how what just happened made any sense to anything that happened before it. Spotfests are fun though. Dont get me wrong. But main event? No. This is supposed to be the 3rd or 4th match of the night to get the crowd amped. And thats where both these guys belong on the card too sadly.

 

Production d. Quality

-***** = I get they are a small company. My stream only died a couple times, and I'm not sure if I was lucky, or it just showed how action-packed this show was, but I didnt seem to miss anything anytime. The announcing was annoying (why not Lenny Leonard or Prazak? I dont get it....) and it seems they simply need to find a way to figure out the volume and stuff and mixing of everything. If I win the lottery I'll buy the equipment they need for this task, as you cant really fault a promotion trying to grow for trying to find alternative ways to grow and then hitting some bumps along the way. They know its ridiculous and I'm sure are going to try and remedy the sitution, it just might take some time.

 

 

BTW, Final Battle which is the next iPPV already has Richards vs. Strong for the belt announced. Assuming Strong is still champ. I hope Richards wins as he's more marketable and way better. Although why they dont like Aries, Daniels, either of the Kings of Wrestling, or either of WGTT be the face of the company is beyond me.

 

It seems ever since Punk & Joe (and Nigel for that matter) left they've been kind of lost or desperate to build another one but already have 4 (if you dont count WGTT) guys on the roster who are plenty talented in all aspects of pro-wrestling.

[MrCanada]

 

and I strongly disagree about the loaded elbow pad. It's just corny.

 

 

I think this is 100% completely wrong. Sure, maybe the fact its a gold elbow pad is stupid, but workers having a gimmick to win matches is terrific! Its not done all that often, and can make a career when it works (Bob Orton), or mean interesting matches and storylines involving the gimmick as almost its own character.

 

However it WILL become done if it doenst lead somewhere. Doesnt lead to a gold pad on a pole match, or a "if its used, behind the refs back or not, you lose the belts" match. Or a comeuppance situation where someone uses the pad, or maybe their own version (a boot?) to finally beat KOW leading to a boot vs pad match or what not.

 

Slow build is FINE by me. You dont want WGTT beating the KOW right now, you dont have another team thats really intersting or ready to beat KOW elsewhere. You dont want KOW beating WGTT cleanly, so if its going to be a cheap finish anyway, sewing that together with a golden elbow pad works for me.

[Jaysin]

It just reminds me of Luger's dreaded forearm and I can't take it seriously.

 

Also, Kevin Kelly needs to just go away. His stereotypical anti WWE comments really killed a lot of the entertainment for me. "I WAS IN MONTREAL!". I don't care Kevin, shut the hell up you're making Cole look good.

[The Final Countdown]

Still isn't this their supposed top show? Or joint top show with DBD? Then if this was a poor outing it could hamper growth or in the worst case hurt business.

I've never really thought of ROH as having one (or even two) marquee events, like WWE obviously has with Mania. I'd say that GBH, DBD, Final Battle, and the Anniversary show are all on pretty level footing. Supercard of Honor might even be in that group, I don't know. Was this show a let-down, especially for a "name" event like GBH? I'd say so, yeah. But honestly, I wasn't expecting this show to be anywhere near as good as DBD.

[MrCanada]

I've never really thought of ROH as having one (or even two) marquee events, like WWE obviously has with Mania. I'd say that GBH, DBD, Final Battle, and the Anniversary show are all on pretty level footing. Supercard of Honor might even be in that group, I don't know. Was this show a let-down, especially for a "name" event like GBH? I'd say so, yeah. But honestly, I wasn't expecting this show to be anywhere near as good as DBD.

 

I think the Marquee Events are the ones they do on iPPV... Whatever it is. Everything else is just a house show.

[1234]

I've never really thought of ROH as having one (or even two) marquee events, like WWE obviously has with Mania. I'd say that GBH, DBD, Final Battle, and the Anniversary show are all on pretty level footing. Supercard of Honor might even be in that group, I don't know. Was this show a let-down, especially for a "name" event like GBH? I'd say so, yeah. But honestly, I wasn't expecting this show to be anywhere near as good as DBD.

 

My opinion has always been that Anniversary Show & Final Battle are the most important, followed closely by GBH, DBD & SCOH.

[masterded]

Yes. He won it from Danielson at Final Battle '06. Had a pretty short reign before dropping the title to Morishima. It was really more about the chase than the reign for Homicide.

 

He was the start of the chase that went to long when it comes to the ROH World Title. Though unlike with Lynn and Black by the time he finally did win it people still wanted him to.

[The Final Countdown]

He was the start of the chase that went to long when it comes to the ROH World Title. Though unlike with Lynn and Black by the time he finally did win it people still wanted him to.

Homicide's chase was pretty lengthy, but like you said, people were still behind him by the time he won it, so I thought it was fine. But I completely agree on the other two. If Davey really is sticking around like he says, he NEEDS to win the belt when he gets his shot at Final Battle. Otherwise, they risk it turning into another Tyler Black situation.

[Lo-Drew]

Homicide's chase was pretty lengthy, but like you said, people were still behind him by the time he won it, so I thought it was fine. But I completely agree on the other two. If Davey really is sticking around like he says, he NEEDS to win the belt when he gets his shot at Final Battle. Otherwise, they risk it turning into another Tyler Black situation.

 

Yeah I agree. Like I said, I like Roderick Strong, but I think Richards needs to win at Final Battle.

 

As well as Homicide's chase, it was long, but it was fun and he had some great matches during that run(against Cornio, him and Joe Vs the Briscoes) plus added with him saving ROH as he defeated CZW.

[The Celt]

Okay, so it was B-PPV for ROH (although there best selling iPPV so far) but it did contain so mark worthy stuff.

 

Davey Richards not retiring = My prayers answered

 

Homicide returning to a prominent wrestling promotion that appreciates his talent= my prayers answered once again

 

#The Roderick Strong Issue: Will he be a great champ? Probably not. But hey, having seen Strong/Richards matches before I can say we're in for some good matches. I think Strong will probably last 3 or 4 months before either Homicide or Richards get the best of him, but before that happens I think we'll see some memorable defences. I think Daniels will probably be in there as a challenger but I seriously doubt ROH are ready to put the belt on him yet with the fear of him returning to TNA always at the forefront.

 

#The Tag finish issue: Hmmm, not to the fans liking, but hey, if it convinces WGTT of their value to ROH I'm okay with it. The idea of Hass and Benjamin in ROH would be huge and total boost to the company in just so many ways.

 

 

While alot of people are saying this show was booked by Pearce I heard Delirious did have his fingers on it. Apparently Pearce had AA booked to face Daizee Haze or some such but Delirious wasn't really up for that and so changed it. Meanwhile Daniels was to be put into the Main Event to add an element of danger to it but I guess Delirious wasn't into that either (in fairness it wasn't advertised in any way so).

 

 

Perhaps not ROH's best, but certainly no reason to give up on the company (especially if you didn't like it as they're changing booker now).

[The Final Countdown]

(although there best selling iPPV so far)

Was it really? That's kind of surprising to me. I would have expected DBD to have higher numbers, because to me, that show looked far better than this one on paper (and it delivered on its potential, I thought.)

[masterded]

Was it really? That's kind of surprising to me. I would have expected DBD to have higher numbers, because to me, that show looked far better than this one on paper (and it delivered on its potential, I thought.)

 

WGTT and a guaranteed Title change was enough for me to buy an IPPV for the first time instead of waiting for the DVD. I would guess that I was not alone and that is why.

[The Celt]

It probably due to better awareness of the fact that ROH are now available through GoFightLive. Fans that bought iPPVs before + fans trying it out for the first time/just found out about it= Biggest buy-rate so far. Also Cary Silken is suddenly making a very hard push to get ROH over big on social networking which helps draw people into ROH.

[Jaysin]

It would have been so much better if they did something...like show recaps during the intermission or something. There shouldn't be that much down time for the people watching at home. Hell, why even have an intermission?

 

The show got better as it went on, but I dunno, it still bored me to an extent. I'll watch Final Battle for sure though.