Zoloftjunkie Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Watching Fitch get Fitched was very enjoyable : ). Especially loved near the end where he threw his arm up in frustration, must of been thinking so this is what I have been doing all these years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Just wanted to say how funny, great, and utterly fantastic it was to see Jon Fitch get a taste of his own medicine at the hands of Demian Maia. Watching Fitch get Fitched was very enjoyable : ). Especially loved near the end where he threw his arm up in frustration, must of been thinking so this is what I have been doing all these years. Exactly. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synticha Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Wow... Just... Wow... Didn't think Bigfoot would be the one to stop Overeem. Reem came in a bit too cocky and that was his undoing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoloftjunkie Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 So that is what happens when your too cocky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Wow... Just... Wow... Didn't think Bigfoot would be the one to stop Overeem. Reem came in a bit too cocky and that was his undoing. I believe you are right. That's what Reem gets for standing there and taking those shots. I couldn't help but laugh a little bit when he crumpled to the mat. That's what happens when you don't fight smart and respect your opponent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShotgunShogun Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 I think its not using the testosterone made Overeem weaker + the ring rust equaled a loss for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
consortium11 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 There's also the small matter of Overeem not being that great at MMA. Throughout his long career (roughly 14 years and 49 matches) what "top" wins does he have in MMA at either LHW or HW? A very narrow win over Werdum (who he'd previously lost to) and a fluke injury related win over Kharitonov (who he was later knocked out by)? I guess if you're generous you could put a win over a shot Brock in there as well but frankly, that's about it. The record gets worse when you consider that for a guy noted as a striker, his record against fellow strikers when it remains standing is pretty awful. He was knocked out by the previously mentioned Kharitonov (and in their first bout, much like the Hunt contest, Overeem took the fight to the ground immediately), Rua took him out with a combination of striking and ground work twice, Chuck knocked him out, Bobby Hoffman knocked him out, Diet Nog lit him up standing and Arona of all people kicked him apart with leg kicks (although the Brazilian Tiger has always had pretty solid leg kicks). Overeem's MMA resume is basically built on beating the likes of shot versions of Buentello, Vovchanchyn, Fujita and Goodridge, Belfort at his worst, untested prospects like Duffee and journeymen like Thompson, with a side order of undersized scrubs from Eastern Europe and Japan. On paper he should be a real force... massive physical power, an ADCC Europe winner (with three submissions) and a K-1 Champ. But that misses that ADCC Europe hadn't got the deepest of talent pools at the time (let alone at heavyweight) and that his K-1 run was pretty soft; despite individual good wins his final two fights to win the title were against a man with a broken arm and a man who had nothing left. Moreover, his style in K-1 was to basically put his gloves up, bully forward and weather his opponents storm and then either (when it was allowed) get the clinch and deliver knees or try to counter with powerful hooks. With smaller MMA gloves you can't hide behind them anywhere near as effectively with far more of your defences having to come from range, head movement and parrying... things Overeem has never been particularly strong at. Then add in a gas tank that even at its best rarely has more than 10 minutes in it and it's not a pretty picture. That's not to say he can't win big fights... his physical strength makes him hard to take down meaning many wrestlers especially will struggle with him and with his power he can always land a single punch/knee and end it. It's just that in 14 years he's very rarely done so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 If you look at Overeem's record, he's never really dealt well with other people's strikes in MMA. He submitted to Arona's punches. Not a choke, armlock, or leglock. Punches. From Arona. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSelfDestruct Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 I hate when people talk bad about Overeem just because they always use fights from before he really changed as a fighter. I hate the guy for his personality, but not his fighting, especially not irrelevant losses to his current abilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoloftjunkie Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 Do you count punching bag for Silva as one of his current abilities? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSelfDestruct Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 yes, quite happily actually. I hate Overeem, but to say he's so bad because of a loss, after he's changed his entire fighting style since the losses mentioned is a bit pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
consortium11 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 If you look at Overeem's record, he's never really dealt well with other people's strikes in MMA. He submitted to Arona's punches. Not a choke, armlock, or leglock. Punches. From Arona. To be fair, he'd been crippled by Arona's leg kicks at that point and if can remember correctly had eaten a punch in the eye while Arona had his back. I hate when people talk bad about Overeem just because they always use fights from before he really changed as a fighter. I hate the guy for his personality, but not his fighting, especially not irrelevant losses to his current abilities. Adding 60lbs of muscle didn't massive change his style or skills. He bulked up which gave him more one-shot power and less speed (although he's still fairly quick for a heavyweight) but otherwise his style is basically the same. He doesn't throw as many single knees from the outside as he once did but his bread and butter is still single shots (often with a loop), with the occasional 1-2 which is sometimes followed up by a kick or, if he presses into the clinch, a knee and he still likes to bully forward into the pocket/clinch. In essence his style has remained the same throughout... a big fighter for his weightclass with good single-shot power (especially in his knees), a varied and dangerous clinch game (with underated trips and throws) and a ground game which takes people by surprise (both from on top and the bottom) with an exceptional guillotine. He likes to use lateral movement to avoid opponents strikes (and take them on the gloves if he can) before pressing into the pocket/clinch from where he scores with knees and takedowns. If you leave your neck exposed he'll latch on a choke and if you don't have a solid ground game he'll grind you out from the top. Likewise his weaknesses have remained; he has a gas tank that tends to lapse by around the 10th minute, even in a relatively low paced bout, he's sometimes a little too open with his grappling defence, his stand-up defence is fairly poor, he rarely counters (instead preferring to wait out a combination before firing back), he keeps his head on centreline rarely moving it, his footwork is fairly sloppy and he doesn't react well to being hit, often starting to panic. He's clearly very skilled... despite being a weaker year than previously you don't win a K-1 GP without having talent, likewise the ADCC European trials. But throughout his MMA career he's basically been a gatekeeper; genuine contenders/champions generally beat him: see losses to Arona, Shogun, Lil' Nog, Werdum, Sergei, Chuck and even Hoffman (for the time) while picking up the odd win against that level of fighter (see Werdum and Sergei) but generally beating on the those who are not at that level, be it from fading away, not getting there yet or never coming close (see Igor, Thompson, Duffee, Belfort, Bencic etc). Stylistically he's dangerous for grapplers and wrestlers in that his strength makes him hard to take down or bully in the clinch, he's got solid grappling (both offensive and defensively) and his sheer power means that he can end things with a single shot. Against strikers the flaws in his stand-up become more apparent. He still has the talent and the power to beat anyone... but he simply hasn't been able to consistently do it against upper echelon competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 yes, quite happily actually. I hate Overeem, but to say he's so bad because of a loss, after he's changed his entire fighting style since the losses mentioned is a bit pointless. Except you can't change the fact that he's been TKOed one too many times. TKOs happen when fighters can't handle strikes either physically and/or mentally. If it's physical, it wouldn't matter much that he changed his style if he doesn't defend strikes ot the head. He's still going to get TKOed or KOed. Being TKOed so many times could also mean there's not much left for him to take hits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prw18 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 If the Aldo-Edgar fight was 7 rounds Edgar would have won... and if the superbowl was 5 quarters the 49ers would have won. Just saying. PS: I'm a 49ers and Frankie Edgar fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
consortium11 Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 If the Aldo-Edgar fight was 7 rounds Edgar would have won... and if the superbowl was 5 quarters the 49ers would have won. Just saying. PS: I'm a 49ers and Frankie Edgar fan. The Diaz brother's have never lost a fight*... They just keep running out of time... * (apart from when they were stopped) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 If the Aldo-Edgar fight was 7 rounds Edgar would have won... and if the superbowl was 5 quarters the 49ers would have won. Just saying. PS: I'm a 49ers and Frankie Edgar fan. I don't know about football, but there are good reasons why fights don't last beyond 25 minutes. Even without weight-cutting, most guys probably last around 15, if at that. And then the thing is, you don't ever leave it at the hands of judges, and you must have a quick start. The only way Frankie wins is through points. He's not likely to KO someone, and it's hard to submit someone one. He must win every round, or he's not going to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonster Posted February 4, 2013 Share Posted February 4, 2013 The Diaz brother's have never lost a fight*... They just keep running out of time... * (apart from when they were stopped) same with big nog in pride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashleyholland Posted February 6, 2013 Author Share Posted February 6, 2013 If the Aldo-Edgar fight was 7 rounds Edgar would have won... and if the superbowl was 5 quarters the 49ers would have won. Just saying. And if my Auntie had b******s she'd be my Uncle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackman Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Don't really know anything about what Couture precisely did, other than sign a contract with 'competitor' Bellator, but UFC banning him is kind of a weak reaction, though a rational one, alas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonster Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Don't really know anything about what Couture precisely did, other than sign a contract with 'competitor' Bellator, but UFC banning him is kind of a weak reaction, though a rational one, alas. i wonder if it was before he signed with bellator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackman Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 i wonder if it was before he signed with bellator I can't really see it being 'for the money', as UFC would have an edge there. Furthermore, he was having a good job as a commentator during tv shows. So there are no grounds for a breakup there. Maybe Brad knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonster Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 I can't really see it being 'for the money', as UFC would have an edge there. Furthermore, he was having a good job as a commentator during tv shows. So there are no grounds for a breakup there. Maybe Brad knows. maybe he didn't want a job with the UFC like Liddell and Hughes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackman Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Anyone check out Bellator 88? Khasbulayev vs Guerreiro was pretty nice and worthy of a watch. The rest was not that spectacular or exciting though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 I can't really see it being 'for the money', as UFC would have an edge there. Furthermore, he was having a good job as a commentator during tv shows. So there are no grounds for a breakup there. Maybe Brad knows. Some people want to make money... their own way. Max money now, no long-term loyalty wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtplaystew Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Randy Couture wants to be an actor and a personality and continue to make nice money. More money than a pregame commentator for the UFC. He signed a contract with Spike TV to be on two reality shows and (he thinks) a part in a scripted show down the line. He felt that was the better move for the Couture "brand" than being on a pregame show and talking for 10 minutes before FX fights. It's not a crazy move when you think about it. And I also don't have a problem with UFC saying they aren't putting him on TV anymore, even to corner his kid. He wants to go work somewhere else. That's fine. But he's not going to raise public awareness for HIS product that they feel is a competitor on their airwaves. BTW I don't know if UFC can officially stop him from cornering his kid. I thought they were athletic commision situations and not UFC situations. I always thought when Nick cornered Nate Diaz' fights the athletic commissions approved it even though UFC didn't want it. Could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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