Public Beta Reaction Thread

[Arber]

Reading is fundamental.

 

He never said that none of the UI will be overhauled. He said that a COMPLETE overhaul will not be happening.

 

Do you know if it is worth skinners continuing to work on current skins or will it be more beneficial for them to wait this out? I can't imagine a huge amount of screen changes will be taking place so I'm guessing we will be fine...?

[Powerful_Fox]

This, the large majority hate this new interface and it’s embarrassing to imply that it’s a “vocal minority” rather than to accept a glaring flaw with an otherwise great game

 

Nah mate, I think you have the wrong end of the stick on that one. The vocal minority are the ones calling for a complete overhaul. That's just not feasible at this point in the development cycle. What most people have been calling for is simply a review on colour scheme, border thickness etc. and some UI tweaks to make it easier on the eye, which he addressed as something they are looking at.

[Xendarii]

Reading is fundamental.

 

He never said that none of the UI will be overhauled. He said that a COMPLETE overhaul will not be happening.

 

I know - but I'm pretty sure that everything but a complete overhaul will not make this game enjoyable for me in any way.

 

Absolutely willing to be surprised by the changes, but I'm not optimistic.

[ZonaCidal]

Maybe we can do a poll or petition on the UI to show whether it is a vocal majority or minority.

[Charvalos]

The fact that scroll bar / arrow key support doesn't seem to be a bug but just a decision by GDS really baffle me, if I understand what Adam said.

[Bad Collin]

You can add me to list of people who are gutted about the release delay. I'm itching to get started on a long term game.

[lamivoy]

The new release date seems better, hope they can actually improve the final product.

 

And I agree with the fact that just a minority wants a completely new UI. I don't want a completely new UI for example. But I want something well done. I don't want a combination of squares and tiny default text. I don't want some boxes thrown around with no order at all. The office menu is insane to me... There's not even any logic put into that 40 buttons battle royal! I'm not saying lines or topics separating them. I'm saying any kind of logic. It's not A-Z, it's not thematic, it's not by number of letters, it's not like the previous games, nothing. Just 40 buttons randomly placed. It makes no sense that something like the match rating is a tiny little box with a number in a 10-sized font, no spacing, nothing. It makes no sense that some of the most used buttons or tasks are small or not completely obvious while there are huge icons or boxes with blank space. The whole UI feels cheap, but I can deal with that. The problem is it feels like a first draft and not a 2020 35$ finished (I know it's only in beta, but the UI is supposed to be pretty polished for beta-releases) videogame. And that's because it fails in the most basic aspects of UI/UX, things any designer learns during their first semester.

 

I mean, Adam and his team deserve all the love they get from the community, which is a lot. But let's not pretend I'm not paying from a product, let's not pretend I'm not giving them my money for their work. The least I expect is to see honest pride in delivering the best they can to an incredibly loyal player-base.

 

In my case I will wait for the upcoming changes to decide if I'm buying the game or not. Because the new gameplay features are truly amazing and would improve a lot my experience considering the way I play this amazing game, but the job isn't done until the job is done...

[Remianen]

Come on, man. Read my post. What I said was that I didn't expect thàt many people to use the feature.

 

I think a lot of people were intimidated by it at first but learned to use it to some degree as time went on. Once you understood the feature, it took almost no effort to update it from game to game. My product in TEW07 (when the feature debuted) is quite different from my product in TEW16, but only because of other features added (match intensity/danger killing workers, for example). To have that taken can really be jarring. Luckily, I quickly found a new product in 20 that, assuming major changes aren't made between now and release, is fundamentally the same as my TEW16 product (with the addition of 'big deal' status for unmaskings and head shavings, which didn't exist in 16).

 

Like anything else, it'll take getting used to. Go look at the 07 forum and see how people complained about losing categorized products (Cutting Edge, etc) from TEW05.

 

As for the game, I'm satisfied with TEW 2020. The bugs are getting fixed, the interface while not great compared to previous games doesn't bother me in the slightest. I'm diggin' it

 

Yeah, I'm in the same boat. 30 saves/60 months in and I've already become comfortable. Well, I'm still trying to come to grips with 'book main event first' since I've always booked preshow then main show from open to close, but if that doesn't work I can just turn that feature off.

[jonnycosmic]

In light of the recent post from Adam, I am disappointed that coloured lists are going to stay as is. I really love coloured lists, but I just hate how I have to click a million times to get from top to bottom.

I also love that Adam has given the players the option to turn off coloured lists and use the original list boxes.

I just don’t understand - I assume it’s limitations in the programming - why Adam has decided to have either/or, why not have coloured list boxes with scrolling capabilities.

[TallerGohstDaniel]

Fair play to Adam, took criticisms on the chin, made a very tough call to knock the date back for release especially from a business aspect. His entire customer base are locked in their homes for a while and many will have bought on release day with this being a driving factor.

 

Taking a step back, receiving, acknowledging and reacting for the feedback he got, can't really argue with the decision he has made.

 

I'm gutted as I downloaded Kam's skin and haven't looked back, I've been enjoying the hell out of the game since.

 

Almost word for word my thoughts. People are too negative. I absolutely am gonna buy whenever it's finally released, and I dont know Kam, but if that's this blue & gold skin, then 100% agree.

[TeemuFoundation]

In light of the recent post from Adam, I am disappointed that coloured lists are going to stay as is. I really love coloured lists, but I just hate how I have to click a million times to get from top to bottom.

I also love that Adam has given the players the option to turn off coloured lists and use the original list boxes.

I just don’t understand - I assume it’s limitations in the programming - why Adam has decided to have either/or, why not have coloured list boxes with scrolling capabilities.

Your assumption is correct; it's not possible due to coding limitations.

[BDC212]

Why am I able to influence things in outside companies such as days they can broadcast and talking to their workers? That doesn't feel right.

[KingSlender]

Loving it so far..

 

I've played every game since TEW 2005. Played the WMMA games and that superhero game.

 

I don't really post much...or ever...until now.

 

Adam, take as much time as you need to make the game YOU want to make. I'm loving the game that I am seeing. I'm down with the changes. Well done!

[Hive]

What about trios do you think is missing? Were you expecting a trios section like the normal teams menu?

 

Yes.

[TOTKingNothing]

Adam's post both reassures me and worries me.

 

As far as the UI is concerned, I'm glad he heard feedback about mouse scroll and arrow keys needing to extend to more menus than it currently does, that's great. I'd still like to know why this was disabled for the NEW menu features and why colored lists cannot include this way of searching. If it is a technological issue, then I would understand, but not knowing is kinda weird. (EDIT: I have seen that this IS due to technical limitations. That is unfortunate but now more understandable.)

 

The UI, largely, is okay but there ARE things that need to be adjusted. So no, a complete overhaul is not necessary, but it sounds like Adam has a handle on that.

 

I hope that he has heard the criticisms about custom products. Pre-set Products are a fine idea for people who are new to the game or looking for the challenge of playing specific companies, and when you are not playing as the owner, being locked into a product makes complete sense. But taking away the ability to create your own product as an owner or database maker, even as an OPTION, is a giant step back in customization and freedom. Especially when a vast majority of the products are HEAVILY restrictive. Even the "no style" style of product penalizes matches of certain lengths, comedy gimmicks, and cinematic matches?

 

What I find very interesting is the two completely different approaches to the same problem that was taken with the new Gimmick feature and the new Product feature. The core problem being making things simpler for everyone and especially mod makers.

 

Gimmicks were turned into a much more simple, less restrictive, more creative process. This has, widely, been received positively so far by players.

 

Products were turned into a heavily restrictive process that allows NO user creation or customization, even when logically there should be such as creating your own company, either during or prior to the start of a game. This has been received mixed by players, some seeing the benefit of simplifying the process, as well as the increased challenge it provides. The other side of players see this as needlessly restrictive and incredibly frustrating and decisively less fun than TEW 2016. I would go as far as to say there are more people on the latter side of the fence than the former, but I recognize my personal bias.

 

Moral of the story is - People like simplicity with the option to go deep or customize. People don't always like being put in a corner.

[Idolized]

Well we wouldn't be fawning over concept art if they made the game look like it was made in 2020 and not 2002. It's just sad that we can only look at concept art that is far far superior in design to whatever the "artist" designed for this game.

 

Concept art that does not take into account the limits of the programming language used for the TEW games.The programming language does not allow for scrolling with the colored lists turned on or transparent png files. How do you think it will fare rendering that concept without becoming an absolute graphic nightmare for anyone to mod with skins?

 

By the way, the "artist" you speak of has a four year degree, has been designing for well over ten years, and has released various logos, banners, mods, skins, and whatever else for free on this board over the past fifteen years that have mostly been well liked and gotten a great reception. Not to mention the fact that he is a fellow human being, raising a family, and also going through a rough time with the world wide pandemic. Yay mental health! I get it if this skin isn't your taste and you have problems with it, but seeing constant posts like this is a bit much.

 

Concerns are being addressed. It's much easier for artists improve upon an established layout and get a skin "released" a couple days after the game drops that addresses things that people do not like by changing buttons and borders (but is 90% the work of the original artist still.) Building it from the ground up is a whole other story. I'm glad users like Kam and even J Silver (whose little rant in his thread too contributes to the unwarranted over the top toxicity of this board) have put out versions that they consider improvements already. The whole modding section is supposed to improve upon the game and the community as a whole. Heck, I released a whole pack of assets to make it easier for people that want to make skins.

 

I don't know if it is being cooped up due to the virus, but the toxicity across the board is overwhelming and the entitled attitudes here are just head scratching. Relax. There's no need for it.

[BrokenCycle]

The new attendances are much improved through this latest patch.

[BDC212]

I don't know if it is being cooped up due to the virus, but the toxicity across the board is overwhelming and the entitled attitudes here are just head scratching. Relax. There's no need for it.

 

This.

 

Its whiny and really unnecessary. Its a beta release, the developers are working on fixes. I get it, voice your opinion after all this is something you're potentially paying for but constantly going "Ugh, this feature sucks. I won't be paying $35 for this". You aren't paying $35 for this. Its a beta, to be improved on. Keep that in mind.

[jonnycosmic]

Your assumption is correct; it's not possible due to coding limitations.

 

Thank you. I love the colour lists, so I guess I deal with it.

[BrokenCycle]

I don't know if it is being cooped up due to the virus, but the toxicity across the board is overwhelming and the entitled attitudes here are just head scratching. Relax. There's no need for it.

 

Yes, it's absolutely insane. I thought I was the jackass around here. People, most of them I have never seen before, are really coming out of the woodwork for this one. The amount of inflammatory dialogue and bitterness towards Adam and other users is crazy.

[Infernalmiko]

I'm just being patient and waiting to see how things work out. It sounds like some of the things I don't like about TEW 2020 are getting sorted. Any time there is a big change there is a period of getting used to it, and I'm certainly going through that right now. I'm definitely going to playing with some way to reskin the UI so it's not as loud/busy, if that's possible. I hope the font for stats will be bigger as well. Red stats on black background are hard for me to read.

 

Some things I don't like I can fix myself. I was pretty disappointed in the lack of development in the Japanese women's scene and the total lack of pregen rookies coming into it. I can understand it, it's not something most people are playing the game for so it's understandable to focus limited time on areas more people will play. It's also easy to add pregens and import or create a new promotion. I just need to speadsheet the stats of the wrestlers to see if how wrestlers are statted has changed any. Adding experience makes sense and it's rare any one complains about there being more numbers to look at.

[Arber]

Concept art that does not take into account the limits of the programming language used for the TEW games.The programming language does not allow for scrolling with the colored lists turned on or transparent png files. How do you think it will fare rendering that concept without becoming an absolute graphic nightmare for anyone to mod with skins?

 

By the way, the "artist" you speak of has a four year degree, has been designing for well over ten years, and has released various logos, banners, mods, skins, and whatever else for free on this board over the past fifteen years that have mostly been well liked and gotten a great reception. I get it if this skin isn't your taste and you have problems with it, but seeing constant posts like this is a bit much.

 

Concerns are being addressed. It's much easier for artists improve upon an established layout and get a skin "released" a couple days after the game drops that addresses things that people do not like by changing buttons and borders (but is 90% the work of the original artist still.) Building it from the ground up is a whole other story. I'm glad users like Kam and even J Silver (whose little rant in his thread too contributes to the unwarranted over the top toxicity of this board) have put out versions that they consider improvements already. The whole modding section is supposed to improve upon the game and the community as a whole. Heck, I released a whole pack of assets to make it easier for people that want to make skins.

 

I don't know if it is being cooped up due to the virus, but the toxicity across the board is overwhelming and the entitled attitudes here are just head scratching. Relax. There's no need for it.

 

 

I said this earlier but it may have got buried, so I want to repeat:

 

Idolized, I totally understand how a lot of the feedback this past few days can feel like a personal attack on yourself, especially when the negatives can feel like they far outweigh the positives, but most people will know that the screens were built around the limitations given to you by Adam. I very much doubt you had much input on font size and placements (for the most part) and were just doing as you asked. Without sounding arrogant, feel free to drop me a PM at any time to bounce ideas off if you need a sounding board. I have been developing software and graphic designing for close to 20 years, so please feel free to reach out at any time. Have a good weekend.

 

And to add; despite my joined tag saying 2019, I've been here since 2005 (and on .400 before that) - I've seen you're work and know you're talented. Too much negativity is bad for your mental state. Feel free to hit me a PM and blow off some steam if you need too.

 

To everyone else: I am not a fan of the underlying personal attacks on the artist, especially when the artist is and has been a member of this forum and community for so long. He is one of our own. He was not some hired gun with no love for this game, this company and this community. More than that, he is a human-being. We are going through one of the most toughest times our planet has seen since the 1940's and people's emotions are already on tender-hooks. Please have some compassion in your criticism - be constructive; not destructive.

[lr10540]

Yes, it's absolutely insane. I thought I was the jackass around here. People, most of them I have never seen before, are really coming out of the woodwork for this one. The amount of inflammatory dialogue and bitterness towards Adam and other users is crazy.

 

It's becoming quite upsetting. There's a lack of constructive criticism and a plethora of this game is trash and I'm not buying it. I really don't understand it. I'm enjoying the hell out of it.

[Lex Star]

It's going to take some getting used to the new UI, but overall it's greatly improved over the previous releases.

 

Things like keyboard scrolling, and such being added to more screens is something he said he's looking into, one of my main gripes was road agent notes requiring clicks, for example.

 

I also hope he allows more customization in the products, or adds more choices, as I can't quite find one that gives me what I want with the desired match:angle ratios, etc.

 

But overall, I look forward to the full release.

[bigdaddykraven]

Ok, rants about the UX (which is different from UI) from a professional UX Designer as well as some things I really like. I'll also have a few suggestions sprinkled in here too.

 

Rants

There are changes that can be made to improve the UX without making complete overhauls. Most screens are tolerable. The navigation on some pages are extremely painful. Eg: Click a button which opens a popup, inside that you click a button that opens another popup...so now to get back to your game and regular play, you have two popups to open, we should be utilizing tabbed viewing in a lot of cases (like the Wrestler screen), instead of a popup for each of the link/buttons.

 

That may be a bigger overhaul, but arranging buttons so it isn't a massive wall on the company screen would be great.

 

Also, I'd LOVE the ability to control font colors in some way (maybe a config file that lets you change the hex value or something). That would allow Skin Creators greater control of things. I hate how the button colors are limited because you have to account for white and red text.

 

Also, minor UX complaint, why do we use RED text at the top for when something was done successfully when its also used to indicate something is unable to be used or deletes stuff? That and inconstant font sizes (or lack of hierarchy in fonts) really bugs the crap out of this UX Designer.

 

Likes

THERE IS A LOT TO LIKE HERE TOO! A lot of the new features are amazing. I love being able to talk to the workers. That was a wish list item for me. The only thing I think is missing that I'd like is if they could either approach you, or you could ask them, about workers they'd like to work with (maybe an added feature in the future) either as opponents or partners.

 

I really like the concept of not assigning pushes to a worker. I think it being more fluid in how you use someone is much more realistic. It really makes things more fluid. I'll have guys that have been on a roll and earn their way into the main event scene, at least on a temporary scale, and like how they are perceived too play into it. There's a lot of potential story-telling to go on there.

 

Basically all of the stuff that gives the workers more personality is an improvement. I think, especially with social media in recent years, we've seen a lot of the people in the wrestling industries personalities. Guys like Seth Rollins are well respected in the locker room but has shown he's got a bit of a ego on him and is a "company guy." Guys like David Star are showing they really care about the industry and making sure fellow workers are treated well. So anything that gets us closer to the workers being people playing the role of a character helps with the immersion.

 

Also the bottom quick bar is great. I wish I had a way to navigate to those sections without going arrow for arrow (I click one too many times and I have to literally move across the screen to get to the back arrow, sorry, small UX complaint). But I like having the highly used features being available from almost any screen and the customization info screen is the best.

 

I think we are going to discover a lot of features we really love once we can get past the confusing interface. I think some good stuff is buried here that we will love.

 

I was happy to have a new area included. India is going to be great. It would be really cool to let us customize areas. maybe we can't add areas but adjusting names and rules for those locations would be awesome for some fantasy-based Mods. Imagine a mod set in Westeros of Game of Thrones, or set in Final Fantasy 7's world or even one that takes place on Mars or with the planets being colonized?

 

Closing

As I said. I have a few User Flow improvement suggestions I'd like to see made without a complete overhaul. If anyone from GDS are interested, I'd and I know a few other UX Designers in the community would happily talk with you. Even if it were to come after release as a "revamped" that's even optional. I'd do it without any compensation, I just want to make sure one of my favorite games is better!

 

GREAT JOB OVERALL! However this is a great example of how important User Experience is to a software. I'm actually going to save this and compile a case around it when teaching new designers (or selling clients on the importance of UX).