TEW2020 Discussion Thread

[edenborn]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>AI booking of the level you're imagining is not viable for me to add, no. What you're outlining may sound pretty simple from the outside looking in, and I fully appreciate that people who aren't coders can't be expected to take the internal workings into account, but it's very difficult to achieve in a game where companies can have such a huge variety of situations because of the sheer amount of variables that are in play. We did look into some variations of it and it was clear almost immediately that it wasn't even remotely attainable.</div></blockquote>That's a helpful explanation, thank you, and though it's disappointing news for me, I greatly appreciate that you looked into the feasibility of the idea.<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That is not to say that there aren't some simulations of forward thinking included, but they are just that - simulations. Having the AI <em>actually</em> plan several moves ahead is far too difficult to actually have, for the reasons already outlined.</div></blockquote>This strikes me as a clever compromise -- giving us the illusion of purposeful AI booking wherever possible. Cheers for all you can do on this front.<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>EDIT - Just to underline in case it wasn't clear: I'm not saying it's <em>impossible</em> to do what you're suggesting. It could be that someone else will make a TEW-style game and come up with a clever way of doing it. I'm just saying that I've looked into it and I don't see it being feasible, so if it is do-able then it's simply beyond my range.</div></blockquote>Humility and honesty aren't qualities one always finds in game developers, so again, much obliged. To clarify where I'm coming from, I consider the TEW series the crown jewel of wrestling booking sims -- well thought out and tremendously fun -- so it's practically heartbreaking whenever the AI breaks the sense of immersion with its random-seeming booking.

[Historian]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TeemuFoundation" data-cite="TeemuFoundation" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Then it goes back to the overness of the competitors. And this is already part of the match rating calculation.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I think the point is to potentially make the match rating going higher by having a hotter crowd because they have been waiting for this match, because it's been hyped -- away from the show -- before it happens. So it's not the same thing. Obviously, if I throw two ultra-over competitors into a match and they don't have terrible chemistry and are decent workers, it's going to go well, but it would be beneficial to be able to announce/hype a match in advance and that raises the overall rating of the match because it helps make the crowd hotter for it going forward.</p>

[Adam Ryland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="edenborn" data-cite="edenborn" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>To clarify where I'm coming from, I consider the TEW series the crown jewel of wrestling booking sims -- well thought out and tremendously fun -- so it's practically heartbreaking whenever the AI breaks the sense of immersion with its random-seeming booking.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> No worries: I can assure you that the same is true for me, especially as my background is in AI! As any of my testers can attest, we spend ridiculous amounts of time trying to get the AI polished to the best quality that we can, so any niggles or outright problems are down to a failing of skill or technological capability, not effort or imagination from the team. All that being said, I think we manage to get it better with every game, and I'm pretty confident that the same will be true of TEW2020.</p>

[shawn michaels]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>No worries: I can assure you that the same is true for me, especially as my background is in AI! As any of my testers can attest, we spend ridiculous amounts of time trying to get the AI polished to the best quality that we can, so any niggles or outright problems are down to a failing of skill or technological capability, not effort or imagination from the team. All that being said, I think we manage to get it better with every game, and I'm pretty confident that the same will be true of TEW2020.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I like today's feature and Adam's explanations and the honesty behind them are always welcomed. This is good to know. I'm really hoping for the live journal to come along so we can get an idea of how things are. Is it still scheduled to enter the live journal stage around the early summer?</p>

[BrokenCycle]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TLCJR4LIFE" data-cite="TLCJR4LIFE" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>(removed post)</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> What's your favorite announced feature so far?</p>

[ChairToFace]

Can't wait to see how Indie shows work. With all the new features, it seems that the AI will book more realistic, and that Indie shows will occur more often. Seems like that feature has somewhat adopted some things from WMMA 5, with it's low and high level local shows. Since it seems like many things from WMMA 5 are being converted to fit into TEW 2020, I feel like it'll be much smoother in TEW 2020, plus I won't get so burned out like I have been lately with 2016.

[SirMichaelJordan]

With the new AI booking, I’m praying that AI storylines are booked correctly. As in actually happening in angles or matches and since events are broken up into tour, basic, season finale, etc. it would be cool to see pay off matches booked at major events/PPV’s at AI companies.

[Levinux]

You know what would be awesome? If with the on-the-fly booking, we had the ability to change finishes of matches if an injury happens.

[dvdWarrior]

I'm really a fan of these new features that seem like they'll simplify the modding process. I have a tendency to get... really obsessed with specifics, and when that gets out of hand, it can take the fun out of modding. It's weird to have TEW-specific OCDs - things that ease that particular burden, I like.

 

[ChairToFace]

I'm really a fan of these new features that seem like they'll simplify the modding process. I have a tendency to get... really obsessed with specifics, and when that gets out of hand, it can take the fun out of modding. It's weird to have TEW-specific OCDs - things that ease that particular burden, I like.

 

 

I only obsess over the canon of my mods. Technical aspects and editing are my worst areas, but I shine in creativity.

 

I'm looking forward to the feature where we can now take saves and turn them into a database. Will certainly take all the work out of mod making in some cases.

[dvdWarrior]

I only obsess over the canon of my mods. Technical aspects and editing are my worst areas, but I shine in creativity.

 

I'm looking forward to the feature where we can now take saves and turn them into a database. Will certainly take all the work out of mod making in some cases.

 

Creativity has always been my strength as well. I have a nice little universe in my head that I've been thinking about/working on for years, but if I'm not careful, I become too much of a perfectionist when it comes to stats.

 

What I like about the whole turning saves into databases feature is that I'll actually be able to create different stages of my world. I feel like that should be a lot of fun.

 

[Peria]

So far all of the "inner" changes such as AI and indy shows just seem to be creating a more lively world and I always thought that was much needed.

[TLCJR4LIFE]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BrokenCycle" data-cite="BrokenCycle" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>What's your favorite announced feature so far?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Probably either the experience stat or the new way company sizes are handled.</p><p> </p><p> Both should be super healthy for long term games</p>

[XMultiGames]

<p>I know this theme hasnt been mentioned yet on the journals, but Im actually excited/intrigued, to see what changes have been made to the alliance system, or if there is any.</p><p> </p><p>

I just think that a change this big, like is changing literally the base of the game, instead of just writing over it, gives a lot more room to move around, and have features that couldnt be had before because of limitations in the game, now can be tried and tested and see if they are worth putting them on the final game.</p><p> </p><p>

I just feel that since the alliance system was introduced, is more like a template of the basis of an alliance system, instead of a finished product, again very possible for game limitations, but it seems unrealistic, that an alliance accepts every member the player proposes, even if it isnt benefitial for the alliance or a member (like PSW joining and now NYCW cant run in the tri state) or the fact that the titles change hands randomly without a reason and that the player has whole liberties of changing the champions at his will, I feel that there must be a way to make the alliance feel more real, like have limitations, but counterweight it with benefits, this is not the place to give my specific ideas, is just that i feel that the player experience with the alliance shouldnt be that much player driven, and in its place more AI or Alliance driven.</p>

[Adam Ryland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="shawn michaels" data-cite="shawn michaels" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Is it still scheduled to enter the live journal stage around the early summer?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Phase one will probably finish in June, then there'll be a break for a couple of weeks, then phase two should start in July.</p>

[ChairToFace]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="XMultiGames" data-cite="XMultiGames" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I know this theme hasnt been mentioned yet on the journals, but Im actually excited/intrigued, to see what changes have been made to the alliance system, or if there is any.<p> </p><p> I just think that a change this big, like is changing literally the base of the game, instead of just writing over it, gives a lot more room to move around, and have features that couldnt be had before because of limitations in the game, now can be tried and tested and see if they are worth putting them on the final game.</p><p> </p><p> I just feel that since the alliance system was introduced, is more like a template of the basis of an alliance system, instead of a finished product, again very possible for game limitations, but it seems unrealistic, that an alliance accepts every member the player proposes, even if it isnt benefitial for the alliance or a member (like PSW joining and now NYCW cant run in the tri state) or the fact that the titles change hands randomly without a reason and that the player has whole liberties of changing the champions at his will, I feel that there must be a way to make the alliance feel more real, like have limitations, but counterweight it with benefits, this is not the place to give my specific ideas, is just that i feel that the player experience with the alliance shouldnt be that much player driven, and in its place more AI or Alliance driven.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It seems like a lot of people want the alliance system upgraded, so that we can see things like alliance events. I'd love the idea of an alliance council, with a president, booker, treasurer, etc. (purely for cosmetic purposes), monthly meetings between council members to determine things like workers to be borrowed, events to run, and titles, votes to occur before a title change and other things, winning only if a majority agree, and some other things. Would certainly make playing as the COTT much better. Since the Modern Japan Movement isn't an alliance, then perhaps there could be two alliances types: Alliance (like the NWA), and Confederation (Like the MJM). Alliances are tight, have a leadership system, etc, while confederations can only trade workers, have no titles, no leadership system, etc.</p>

[Munit]

So with the new entry does this mean that we get back the AI booking for human players to auto book shows?

[shawn michaels]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Levinux" data-cite="Levinux" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You know what would be awesome? If with the on-the-fly booking, we had the ability to change finishes of matches if an injury happens.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Actually i'd love more options, not less. Meaning, some matches would end up called in the ring by the workers due to severity of injury, or some other reason and were rapidly wrapped and we wouldn't have time to call an audible, as they would do so themselves too quickly due to need. I would also like to see "normal injuries" where the worker is trying to work through it and we can call an audible and change the finish.</p><p> </p><p> With that said I would love more depth. Worker botches finish and loses instead of winning as it was planned, worker botches and wins instead of losing as planned, the other worker botches, both workers botch, etc, etc. This would add more depth and more problems to solve. Obviously it would need to happen in an appropriate degree. There really isn't the need to call an audible every single show, or have any other kind of incident. But during a year, for example, you will get quite a few.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Adam Ryland" data-cite="Adam Ryland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Phase one will probably finish in June, then there'll be a break for a couple of weeks, then phase two should start in July.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Awesome, thanks.</p>

[HarryFandango86]

I’m enjoying the log so far. The game looks like it will be great.

[cappyboy]

Look forward to seeing what the quickie notes are this week. Doubt anything Adam comes up will approach the volume of discussion last week's brought. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />

[wrestlingfan1]

Been gone awhile, still playing the game though. loving the sound of the new game and all of the new/upgraded features. I have a question about the recent post though. With the smarter ai and ability to put a preference on tag matches, will it recognize an existing tag team or will it still be randomized partners aka new tag teams. It's just always annoyed me to sign a tag team and send them to development only to have the promoter book them in different teams.

[Zeel1]

<p>Honestly there are some e-mails I feel like I could just go without seeing, it's real easy for an inbox to get cluttered, so I definitely see myself using this. </p><p> </p><p>

It'd be nice if there was a prompt to set these as a default like with preferences, not sure if that's how it works in WMMA or not.</p>

[YoungNoble]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="wrestlingfan#1" data-cite="wrestlingfan#1" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46105" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Been gone awhile, still playing the game though. loving the sound of the new game and all of the new/upgraded features. I have a question about the recent post though. With the smarter ai and ability to put a preference on tag matches, will it recognize an existing tag team or will it still be randomized partners aka new tag teams. It's just always annoyed me to sign a tag team and send them to development only to have the promoter book them in different teams.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I am pretty sure that he said the team usage by the AI is greatly improved and their are additional team settings that you can "lock" guys together. It was one of the earliest entries I believe.</p>

[Morti]

The more WMMA 5 stuff the better *clap clap*

[Jaysin]

Hopefully we can turn off developmental complaint emails