Return time decline to creative + expanding creative

[Capelli King]

TEW is a very micro intensive game. I do not have time to sit and study all the road agent comments and try to figure out who is in decline. The same way i have my road agents give me comments as to who is the biggest draws and best talent for the future, i want them to tell me that X and Y workers are in decline, which was an awesome feature in 2016. I have no idea why this was removed. Please return this!

 

I would also like that we add an option to see in order the best prospects, draws etc, beyond the top 5. Currently we see just the best 5 in each section. Maybe have a top 10 or have the option to move onto page 2 or something to see the whole list. This is especially the case when you have massive rosters of highly talented workers. Obviously when you barely have 1-2 great up and comers, the current creative works fine, but that is not the case for the bigger promotions.

[franticloser]

It was removed because people where either jobbing out or firing anyone on the list even if they had a lot of use left in them. Adam felt like it was a hurting the game play. Adam cut it so that people wouldn't have such knee jerk reactions.

[TeemuFoundation]

Just because someone enters time decline, doesn't mean they're terrible, or not worth using at all. You shouldn't really look at whether or not someone is in time decline, and instead just look at the results workers are giving you. If a worker delivers good grades, awesome. Keep using him. Time decline or not. The moment they start slipping, it'll show in the ratings. That's how I view it anyway.

 

I mean hell, Ric Flair, you could argue, was in time decline for all of his time spent in the mainstream spotlight. His actual best years were spent in front of a much smaller audience, a lot of it not even televised. He was still a worthy hire and even main eventer for any wrestling company in the 90s. All throughout the 90s.

[djthefunkchris]

It was removed because people where either jobbing out or firing anyone on the list even if they had a lot of use left in them. Adam felt like it was a hurting the game play. Adam cut it so that people wouldn't have such knee jerk reactions.

 

Where is all these people that did this? I do remember maybe one or two people saying something, but to change something many liked because a few people weren't "playin the game right" seems totally different from how this game used to be advertised. Which was Play the game your own way... the reason we have so many options.

 

Even if EVERYONE jobbed them out or something, I don't understand to be honest.

 

Personally, doesn't effect me at all, because I never really payed attention to it until I noticed a drop in ratings for match's by a specified time declining individual. Even then, I would usually give them a title run with whichever title they were wanting to be a part of.

[Capelli King]

It was removed because people where either jobbing out or firing anyone on the list even if they had a lot of use left in them. Adam felt like it was a hurting the game play. Adam cut it so that people wouldn't have such knee jerk reactions.

 

That is a terrible reason why it was removed. How i book the card should be my decision. I want to have all the real data and take decisions based on that data. Also, who says i will job a worker past his prime anyway? I still want to know the real information though to plan ahead. Also, it is not as if this information is not available, i can still get it, i simply need to read the worksheet's.

 

However you put it, i still have not read any real reason why it was removed. The above reason is at most unusual.

[PacoAce]

I can see a reason... To be closer to reality.

Even if Goldberg and Undertaker are old and clearly in TD, you don't have a ranking of who's the most declining, the closest to retirement. But you know they are declining as you can see it and your road agent tells you about it.

[Capelli King]

I can see a reason... To be closer to reality.

Even if Goldberg and Undertaker are old and clearly in TD, you don't have a ranking of who's the most declining, the closest to retirement. But you know they are declining as you can see it and your road agent tells you about it.

 

Ok, so why have creative section then? Lets remove this whole section. Because in the creative section you have other details (such as who are the biggest prospects, franchise players etc). The whole point of having a creative is to have this information.

 

I am fine with having staff assigned to creative which are not 100% accurate. For example you can hire someone and he can tell you that X or Y is the biggest stars for the future but in reality someone else has the biggest potential. OR they could make a mistake about decline and miss that detail totally OR point that out 6 months later.

[Blackman]

The reason was he wanted to make the gameplay harder. I'm sure you'll figure out whose performance is declining, especially now it's easier to access the data.

 

But I don't think he'll bring it back. I mean: the rant is even featured in the player handbook.

[cwamaniac]

In all do respect

 

I want time decline back if I’m gonna buy the game who cares how I book, imagine if wwe 2k20 removed the new custom weapons because they thought everyone used only the Giant lollipop, they would rightfully get chewed out for this as it removes a nice feature

 

Anyways i don’t want to rant so I’ll just end this here and say I want time decline back and don’t care for any opinion based answers which ignores the other side

[Bull]

I want time decline back if I’m gonna buy the game who cares how I book, imagine if wwe 2k20 removed the new custom weapons because they thought everyone used only the Giant lollipop, they would rightfully get chewed out for this as it removes a nice feature

 

Anyways i don’t want to rant so I’ll just end this here and say I want time decline back and don’t care for any opinion based answers which ignores the other side

 

I mean if that's how you view it that's your choice, but is it really that important of a feature?

 

I freely admit to being one of those people who buried anyone who showed up on the list, but I don't mind being pushed(or forced if you wanna be concrete about it) to book a little differently without it. . But there's nothing stopping me from just picking some 35ish and older guy or gal high up my card and burying them like auditioning for a HHH biopic, just for the sake of a Hot Prospect. . You can push and bury whoever you want.

 

Why would you want to go back to booking certain people a certain way just because they shows up on an list?

[cwamaniac]

Your making a few assumptions

 

It’s true that I would occasionally replace people in my files when they hit decline but I’d usually hang on to them and gradually depush them for example I kept Duane stone in my local 2 global game despite the fact that he was at literally ten years in decline and even made him a Tag Team Champion, when I felt he couldn’t be carried anymore even with help I sent him down to my development where he became the new owner, this wasn’t an uncommon thing for me as I like to reward loyalty

 

If someone is willing to put over talent when I ask they find rewards, and sadly I book a promotion that has 150+ wrestlers so some people will get lost in the shuffle from time to time, I guess my point is the removal of time decline to me is a major annoyance as I used it as a last run pusher rather than a let’s fire them immediately, without time decline I’d never have pushed some of my favorites

 

If others only used it to freshen up there roster that’s fine, and shouldn’t ever be an issue as certain promotions were known to employ those guys anyways, and it was the players choice.

 

Anyways thanks I got that off my chest, do you get why it’s important to me at least now?

[Bull]

It’s true that I would occasionally replace people in my files when they hit decline but I’d usually hang on to them and gradually depush them for example I kept Duane stone in my local 2 global game despite the fact that he was at literally ten years in decline and even made him a Tag Team Champion, when I felt he couldn’t be carried anymore even with help I sent him down to my development where he became the new owner, this wasn’t an uncommon thing for me as I like to reward loyalty

 

If someone is willing to put over talent when I ask they find rewards, and sadly I book a promotion that has 150+ wrestlers so some people will get lost in the shuffle from time to time, I guess my point is the removal of time decline to me is a major annoyance as I used it as a last run pusher rather than a let’s fire them immediately, without time decline I’d never have pushed some of my favorites

 

If others only used it to freshen up there roster that’s fine, and shouldn’t ever be an issue as certain promotions were known to employ those guys anyways, and it was the players choice.

 

Anyways thanks I got that off my chest, do you get why it’s important to me at least now?

 

Apologies as I wasn't trying to assume that's how you used it, I just failed to see why it was of such importance that it would upset you like that. .

 

Still though, I can't speak for running huge rosters like that, but I can imagine that is a headache in and of itself, but nonetheless, I guess I'm the type who constantly keeps track of worker progression good and bad so losing it isn't as much of a headache for me as I'm always tracking stats anyway so I'm bound to see who's dropping off in workrate. .

[cwamaniac]

Apologies as I wasn't trying to assume that's how you used it, I just failed to see why it was of such importance that it would upset you like that. .

 

Still though, I can't speak for running huge rosters like that, but I can imagine that is a headache in and of itself, but nonetheless, I guess I'm the type who constantly keeps track of worker progression good and bad so losing it isn't as much of a headache for me as I'm always tracking stats anyway so I'm bound to see who's dropping off in workrate. .

 

No problem man I just figured my analogy didn’t explain my point and felt I could explain better, we’re cool

[Chikbot]

The reason was he wanted to make the gameplay harder. I'm sure you'll figure out whose performance is declining, especially now it's easier to access the data.

 

But I don't think he'll bring it back. I mean: the rant is even featured in the player handbook.

 

He's basically saying "You're not playing the game how I want you to play it". That's not good development

[DeathZone2]

The reason was he wanted to make the gameplay harder. I'm sure you'll figure out whose performance is declining, especially now it's easier to access the data.

 

But I don't think he'll bring it back. I mean: the rant is even featured in the player handbook.

 

This doesn't make any sense to me. TEW isn't Rocket League where what you do affects other people. It's a single player sandbox game where difficulty takes a back seat to creativity. Why does it need to be difficult? Sure I like difficulty in mods because I get a sense of achievement from it. But why is HE deciding how I play a sandbox game? It makes no sense, and the arrogant tone of his rant was annoying.

 

end rant;)

[Blackman]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="DeathZone2" data-cite="DeathZone2" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47942" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>This doesn't make any sense to me.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Perhaps his reason doesn't make sense. I for one am an advocate for never removing existing features entirely as I like customization. However, this is an exception as this simply... isn't much of a feature. It's a list taken from the (i guess hidden) database file. </p><p> </p><p> With that being said, you DON'T seem to have access to the performance data afaik (I haven't seen it), so I too would like to see it return as this pretty much forces the player to keep an excel with individual performance data, which is a pain. I often play sessions of booking one show. You can't expect the player to memorize what the previous performance was of an aging worker. The only thing you see is skill decline, and though that will be a big indicator for sure, it's quite treacherous as several skills that decline (athleticism) won't be noticable in performance.</p>

[RazorsEdge]

It was removed because people where either jobbing out or firing anyone on the list even if they had a lot of use left in them. Adam felt like it was a hurting the game play. Adam cut it so that people wouldn't have such knee jerk reactions.

 

I think that's a bit silly. Going into a modern day game I already know 'Taker, for example, is going to be on Time Decline. If I want to job him out, I job him out. If I want to play closer to reality I use him as the special attraction that he is. I am the booker so it should be up to me.

[tryker2710]

I don't want to rag on this too much, but the removal of time decline does feel a bit like a "you were playing my single player sandbox wrong" and this is coming from someone who had Steve Flash as a main eventer for his entire run as a wrestler in my 2016 MAW save.

 

I don't really know why he didnt just make it toggleable like the dirt sheet in the preference menu. Then he can have his true way of playing and we can have our useful tool if we want it.

[a0161613]

Don't get me wrong, I thought that the explanation was flawed and I think it would be useful. That being said it's a piece of p*ss to establish time decline after one show. I can still job them out if that's warranted.

[Bull]

I think that's a bit silly. Going into a modern day game I already know 'Taker, for example, is going to be on Time Decline. If I want to job him out, I job him out. If I want to play closer to reality I use him as the special attraction that he is. I am the booker so it should be up to me.

 

Not having a list isn't stopping you from doing that. . It just feels a bit like a min/max argument to me. . People wanna know the exact moment a worker is on decline and then book them either for one last hurrah or to bury them into obscurity. . For all the argument of wanting options why would argue for something that just restricts your booking style by limiting workers just because they can't go like they use to? It seem like people feel like its too much work to just book people how you want when you want and naturally adjust when new information is gathered. .

[Questlove]

Not having a list isn't stopping you from doing that. . It just feels a bit like a min/max argument to me. . People wanna know the exact moment a worker is on decline and then book them either for one last hurrah or to bury them into obscurity. . For all the argument of wanting options why would argue for something that just restricts your booking style by limiting workers just because they can't go like they use to? It seem like people feel like its too much work to just book people how you want when you want and naturally adjust when new information is gathered. .

 

Let's remove Next Big Thing and Hot Prospects from that very same screen then if we're following that logic. They're even bigger crutches than Time Decline ever was.

[Bull]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Questlove" data-cite="Questlove" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="47942" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Let's remove Next Big Thing and Hot Prospects from that very same screen then if we're following that logic. They're even bigger crutches than Time Decline ever was.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I can't say it would bother me honestly. I'm still gonna push the guys I wanna push and see whether they sink or swim. . That's part of the fun to me anyway. <img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />:D</p>

[Bulletproof]

The removal of the Time Decline section in Creative disappointed me but at the same time I could see why in its previous incarnation it was removed from a gameplay standpoint. I get it. You don't want players to "game the system" by "rerolling" a new game if they see someone they wanted to push hard (particularly someone under 40) get a bad decline age roll and end up in the Time Decline section of their company's creative. I have admittedly done this myself in the past.

 

The problem is by removing this, those same players are now just going to go on the assumption that there's no way that 38 year-old star they want to headline their next year's worth of big shows and possibly make the central focus of their diary at the start of the game is already in decline. What do you think is going to happen when as soon as a month or two in (or worse, 4-6+ months in when they've already put in a lot of time in their game), they begin to notice that star's skills are declining and realise that they have hit decline? There's a decent possibility they're going to get put off and abandon the game. Not to mention, it'll just make players (or possibly even modmakers, who do this already for certain workers that IRL entered decline age in their mid 40's or later) "game the system" anyway by setting up decline ages for every major worker they to use before starting a new game. Players have gotten used to multiple installments where they were told from the get-go who is deep in decline and just taking that away altogether is going to result in backlash.

 

Which is why I suggest an alternative, that is to tweak the feature so it doesn't go away entirely BUT will also punish players who just try to "job out" these all-timers. Tweak 1, you still have the Decline in Creative EXCEPT that workers will only start showing up there once they're 2-3 years past their prime. This makes sense since people normally wouldn't be able to tell when someone who has just hit their decline age has past their prime as they would just assume they were having an off month/year. After about 2/3 years, people will have generally started to notice that top-tier worker has not been top-tier for some time now, and this is where your creative will mention it. Not to mention, it'll reward players who notice workers are in decline by keeping track of their skill progress.

 

Which brings me to Tweak 2, and that is to punish players who are trying to job out these veteran wrestlers to the younger talent. The idea is after their momentum has sharply downturned and they're losing almost (if not all) of their matches (especially if they were one of the most popular acts on the roster), the locker room (and especially anyone who is on good terms with the declining talent) will notice this booking and penalties in regards to locker room morale and worker morale will start to occur, with the player eventually getting an email that "the locker room has noticed your recent booking of Talent X, and they believe you are primarily booking them this way because they're past their prime. This has upset them and made the roster ask if this will be their fate one day". These penalties could be even bigger depending on how respected they are and whether the worker is a future hall of famer/immortaler. you could also add a locker room morale penalty for firing someone presumably because they can't go anymore. One the other side, continuing to book these time decline workers strongly could result in a worker morale boost that "they are being treated well despite their degrading skills". That last one isn't too realistic, but rewards players who continue to stay loyal to these veterans.

 

Making these tweaks would make gameplay more realistic and add more of an incentive to keeping those on decline somewhat strong while recognising they may not be someone that you wish to renew their contract once the time comes. One look at WWE is a good example. The likes of Big Show, Undertaker and Triple H are far removed from their best days, yet are still being utilised as big deals today. Imagine the outcry if they were jobbed out to lowcard acts such as Bo Dallas, Apollo Crews or Lince Dorado for no good reason. Those guys who probably not stick around, at least on a In-ring basis.

[Hawk1665]

It makes no sense to remove time decline due to "power gaming reasons" when you can do the same exact thing with next big thing and hot prospects section. You can just restart games over and over until you get destiny rolls you're satisfied with.

 

Either time decline needs to be added back or NBT & HP need to be removed. It makes no sense to have some power gaming but not all power gaming.

[TOTKingNothing]

I’m okay with it being removed but there should be a new section, almost like Chemistry, that keeps track of the declines you’ve discovered in my opinion. That way you’re still forced to play the game, but the game keeps track of your information. Maybe time decline shouldn’t populate with people until after you’ve used them a few times.